# Cattleya Heathii OR not?



## terryros (Nov 17, 2020)

Cattleya Heathii (loddigesii x walkeriana) was registered with the RHS in 1907. There have been 12 AOS awards for flower quality to this hybrid, with the first in 1999 and the most recent in 2016. I obtained my Heathii plant from Orchids Limited some years ago as (loddigesii ‘Shorty’ x walkeriana ‘The Chairman’).

However, in recent years walkeriana ‘The Chairman’ was reported to have come from the cross (walkeriana ‘Pendentive’ x walkeriana ‘Tokyo No. 1’) and some experts think that ‘Pendentive’ is actually Cattleya dolosa (loddigesii x walkeriana). Yet, ‘Pendentive’ is still listed as a 1977 awarded Cattleya walkeriana (Alba) by AOS. Here are two posts from Orchid Board about the messy situation with ‘Pendentive’ and some other prominent walkeriana cultivars.






C. walkeriana (not) Kenny - Orchid Board - Most Complete Orchid Forum on the web !


The plant patent for Cattleya walkeriana ‘Kenny,’ issued to Limrick.RTM Orchid Nursery in June 1994, states that it is the result of a cro



www.orchidboard.com










Walkeriana 'pendentive' - Orchid Board - Most Complete Orchid Forum on the web !


'pendentive' was recently reclassified as a hybrid. I have a plant which is labelled c walkeriana 'pendentive' x c walkeriana coerulae. Does anyone kn



www.orchidboard.com





If ‘The Chairman’ is actually (dolosa x walkeriana), it becomes Cattleya Tsiku Taiwan, which was registered as a hybrid in 2000.

I don’t find evidence questioning the legitimacy of loddigesii ‘Shorty’ so my plant could be (Tsiku Taiwan x loddigesii) which is not a registered hybrid. It would be 62.5% loddigesii and 37.5% walkeriana compared to the 50% split that Heathii would be.

This is the fourth time my currently six-growth plant has bloomed. The inflorescence has always been axial, has never had a sheath, and has always had two flowers. Growths have been either unifoliate or bifoliate with thin pseudobulbs. The current blooming growth is bifoliate and measures about 30 cm from the surface of the potting material to the horizontal leaves.

The flowers did not develop fragrance to my nose until they had been open for a week. The fragrance is still subtle today and not either the described “baked milk chocolate” fragrance of loddigesii or the vanilla/cinnamon of walkeriana. I would say the fragrance is just pleasingly floral.

Here is a picture of the top of the plant. The flower is about 11.0 cm in horizontal natural spread.


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## Ozpaph (Nov 22, 2020)

I dont know but its pretty. Keep the label as it is and let others worry about the true origin; enjoy the flower


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## monocotman (Nov 22, 2020)

That is a very pretty flower. 
Unfortunately until we have reliable markers for these species, discusssions about parentages will be all speculation.
David


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## terryros (Nov 22, 2020)

Unfortunately, from the beginning, we have always had uncertainties about species and hybrids. Matters not for some. But, for breeding and collecting of special plants, it becomes like the art and collectibles markets. Provenance is critical for authenticity. I would not be able to sell or trade this plant off as Heathii, after what I have read. I have a healthy plant with pretty flowers that is some mixture of walkeriana and loddigesii; just forget the name.


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## SouthPark (Nov 24, 2020)

That is a very nice flower there. I think the closed side-lobes are neat and tidy. Nice colours and I like the shape of it.

Just have to get in there and manually flip the two petals back out ....... so that the dorsal goes into the back seat - _behind_ the two petals.


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## Guldal (Nov 24, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> Just have to get in there and manually flip the two petals back out ....... so that the dorsal goes into the back seat - _behind_ the two petals.


A keen observation, SP - I embarassingly didn't notice the first time around. But when made aware of it, it really sticks out: like an open fly in a pair of jeans. You might not notice, but when you have, it's really difficult to divert your attention away from it!

I have a walkeriana var. album 'Pendentive' - and as much as I love the flowers and the scent of this clone, I've had to accept, that I, neither this day, nor even tomorrow, will get to the bottom of its taxonomic status. I veer towards the fraction, though, that sees it like Catt. x dolosa.
This unanswered question is, but a minor irritant, if your only purpose is to enjoy the plant and its flowers - if you are up for breeding/further hybridizing, you are certainly in a pickle!

Maybe one could contact the registrar at the RHS and ask, how they would consider further offspring of your cultivar, especially newly generated hybrids with it as one of the parents?
This might in some way mark out the playing field, although not bring you much closer in revealing the true, botanical status of your beautifully flowered clone!


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## SouthPark (Nov 24, 2020)

Guldal ----- hahaha ..... absolutely loved that jeans description !!!!!!!! That definitely made my day hehe


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## Guldal (Nov 24, 2020)

I'm happy to have been of some entertainment value!
After the Cygnodes-incident, though, I promised myself to shapen up a bit lest the Admin prosecutes for lewd actions!


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