# Paph. concolor var. striatum.



## Kate Boyce-Miles (May 31, 2020)

Paph. concolor var. striatum in flower, which I acquired several weeks ago in low bud. I personally think that the flower is really cute, and makes me think of a smiling face.


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## Guldal (May 31, 2020)

You've got yourself a li'll beauty, there!


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (May 31, 2020)

Guldal said:


> You've got yourself a li'll beauty, there!


Thank you very much.


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## Paphluvr (May 31, 2020)

Nice one!


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (May 31, 2020)

Paphluvr said:


> Nice one!


Thank you.


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## SlipperKing (Jun 1, 2020)

Very nice to see. It's good to see this variety making a comeback. Just a few short years ago nobody had it or at least they weren't posting.


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## Ozpaph (Jun 1, 2020)

very pretty


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## GuRu (Jun 1, 2020)

Gorgeous flower, congrats. But......to pour some water into the wine Paph. concolor var. striatum isn't an officially described and accepted name. Have a look at http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl1.1/search?q=Paphiopedilum+concolor+var.+striatum


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## gego (Jun 1, 2020)

Very nice. Thanks for posting the plant. I have one but not so sure about the size of leaves.


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## Rockbend (Jun 1, 2020)

For decades I've grown these as P. concolor v. khanburii


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## Guldal (Jun 1, 2020)

GuRu said:


> Paph. concolor var. striatum isn't an officially described and accepted name



As in so many cases Rudolf might have a point here - strict botanically speaking, the striatums might just be sunk into synonymity with the typical form. 

But Kate, do not despair: we all know, what is meant by 'striatum'...and although it might be more precise to talk of a form (instead of a variety) as there are no other major morphological differences than the clearly delineated, middle striation of the dorsal and the petals to set it apart from the typical form, you might be home scot free by adding Hort. to the designation of your plant - meaning that its a hortonomical and not a botanical epithet:
Paph. concolor fma. striatum (Hort.).

'Keine Hexerei, nur Behändigheit' as they say South of the (danish) border!


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## GuRu (Jun 1, 2020)

Jens, thank you very much for your excellent assistance. I couldn't have explained it better.


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## Guldal (Jun 1, 2020)

GuRu said:


> I couldn't have explained it better.



Much obliged!


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 1, 2020)

SlipperKing said:


> Very nice to see. It's good to see this variety making a comeback. Just a few short years ago nobody had it or at least they weren't posting.


Thank you.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 1, 2020)

Ozpaph said:


> very pretty


Thank you.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 1, 2020)

GuRu said:


> Gorgeous flower, congrats. But......to pour some water into the wine Paph. concolor var. striatum isn't an officially described and accepted name. Have a look at http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl1.1/search?q=Paphiopedilum+concolor+var.+striatum


Thank you, and also thank you for the info and link.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 1, 2020)

gego said:


> Very nice. Thanks for posting the plant. I have one but not so sure about the size of leaves.


Thank you.


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## KyushuCalanthe (Jun 1, 2020)

"a rose by any other name would smell as sweet"

Lovely flower, nice lighting on the photos too, especially the first.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 1, 2020)

Guldal said:


> As in so many cases Rudolf might have a point here - strict botanically speaking, the striatums might just be sunk into synonymity with the typical form.
> 
> But Kate, do not despair: we all know, what is meant by 'striatum'...and although it might be more precise to talk of a form (instead of a variety) as there are no other major morphological differences than the clearly delineated, middle striation of the dorsal and the petals to set it apart from the typical form, you might be home scot free by adding Hort. to the designation of your plant - meaning that its a hortonomical and not a botanical epithet:
> Paph. concolor fma. striatum (Hort.).
> ...



Thank you for the correction, I will post as Paph. concolor fma. striatum (Hort.) in the future.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 1, 2020)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> "a rose by any other name would smell as sweet"
> 
> Lovely flower, nice lighting on the photos too, especially the first.


Thank you, I took the photos in the evening sunlight.


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## werner.freitag (Jun 1, 2020)

very nice flower , congratulation !

regarding the name : the subspecies and varieties make a lot of sense to us, because they are really different !


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## gego (Jun 2, 2020)

So what is the real name for this plant?
Thanks


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## GuRu (Jun 2, 2020)

gego said:


> So what is the real name for this plant? Thanks



In strictly botanical sense *Paphiopedilum concolor *. Otherwise like Jens (Guldal) explained in his post or if you like this better Paphiopedilum concolor (striatum type)


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## GuRu (Jun 2, 2020)

werner.freitag said:


> .......regarding the name : the subspecies and varieties make a lot of sense to us, because they are really different !



Werner, I'm no nitpicker and I can understand your problem/request. On the one hand you can distinguish on the first sight a 'normal' Paph. concolor from a Paph. concolor (striatum type). But on the other hand, in strictly botanical sense, those difference(s) is/are within the variation of Paph. concolor. H.Koopowitz writes in his book 'TROPICAL SLIPPER ORCHIDS' on page 184_ 'Pfitzer (1903) recognized five varieties of this species.....Cribb(1998) suggests that the so-called varieties should treated more appropriately as forms'_ and G. Braem writes in his book 'PAPHIOPEDILUM' on page 51 _'Paphiopedilum concolor is...very variable. A series of varieties has been described....With the exception of the pure white form....non of these 'varieties' differs such an extent from the nominal form as to warrant them varietal status.'_ 
Who, if not we orchid enthusiasts in general and Paph enthusiasts in special, who are quite familiar with botanical names and rules, should try to use them in correct sense as good as possible.


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## Tony (Jun 2, 2020)

But what is correct? What makes Braem's adherence to lumper philosophy more valid than past authors' preference as splitters? I tend toward the splitters myself, it never hurts to maintain more information on our plants. Look at the mess with the praestans/glanduliferum/wilhelminae complex or adductum/anitum, every time someone lumps or splits them we end up with mislabeled plants that can be difficult or impossible to straighten back out.


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## GuRu (Jun 2, 2020)

Tony said:


> But what is correct? What makes Braem's adherence to lumper philosophy more valid than past authors' preference as splitters? I tend toward the splitters myself, it never hurts to maintain more information on our plants. Look at the mess with the praestans/glanduliferum/wilhelminae complex or adductum/anitum, every time someone lumps or splits them we end up with mislabeled plants that can be difficult or impossible to straighten back out.



Tony, with this contradiction botany has to struggle all time.
In the end it's everybody's own decition what he/she writes on the tag, more information or less information. For me myself the last instance is KEW - The Plant List http://www.theplantlist.org/
Also in official mediums, like this forum, you can use the name striatum, but you shouldn't use it as a variety.


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## GuRu (Jun 2, 2020)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> "a rose by any other name would smell as sweet" ......



Exactly Tom, that's true. Therefore I wrote in another thread when I cited analogously Mr. W. Richter.....Nature doesn't know names. Names are all man made and change, sometimes quickly.


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## Guldal (Jun 2, 2020)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> "a rose by any other name would smell as sweet"



A lovely quotation from The Poet - almost in a most buddhistic mode: "A finger pointing at the moon is not the moon. The finger is needed to know where to look for the moon, but if you mistake the finger for the moon itself, you will never know the real moon" (The Surangama Sutra)


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## Phred (Jun 2, 2020)

Guldal said:


> there are no other major morphological differences than the clearly delineated, middle striation of the dorsal and the petals to set it apart from the typical form


But I beg to differ... the leaves on all of my ‘striatum’ are vastly different than all of my concolor. I have a few dozen concolor as well as several concolor chlorophyllum. The leaves on ‘striatum’ are heavy like the leaves of bellatulum or josianae (previously concolor longipedilum). The underside of the leaf color and pattern are also very different. When I was told that ‘striatum’ were regular concolor I got ready to dispose of them all. If concolor the flowers would be considered inferior... especially for breeding. Then I decided to hold onto them. I know I’m in the minority but I think in time this will be sorted out... I personally I think striatum appears to be more like josianae (longipedilum) than regular concolor


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## DrLeslieEe (Jun 2, 2020)

It is best to maintain the different horticultural forms separately so as to trace a lineage during the breeding process. And to maintain the purity of that form until further notice.

Whether they will be officially recognized as separate varieties or species, many breed differently, like anitum vs adductum and wilheminae vs praestens. 

Not only are flowers slightly different, leaf morphology and genetic contributions can vary as well.

One cannot deny that when we see the progeny (WBW vs JB, where the dorsals are smaller and darker in WBW in general). The leaves of anitum are also completely different from adductum in terms of color and mottling pattern (not only the black dorsal on anitum vs the striped one on adductum). I use anitum as an example because the WCSP still lists it as a synonym of adductum, which it clearly isn't.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 2, 2020)

Phred said:


> But I beg to differ... the leaves on all of my ‘striatum’ are vastly different than all of my concolor. I have a few dozen concolor as well as several concolor chlorophyllum. The leaves on ‘striatum’ are heavy like the leaves of bellatulum or josianae (previously concolor longipedilum). The underside of the leaf color and pattern are also very different. When I was told that ‘striatum’ were regular concolor I got ready to dispose of them all. If concolor the flowers would be considered inferior... especially for breeding. Then I decided to hold onto them. I know I’m in the minority but I think in time this will be sorted out... I personally I think striatum appears to be more like josianae (longipedilum) than regular concolor
> View attachment 20445
> View attachment 20446


Beautiful Paphs. I notice you are growing them in terracotta pots? I have been thinking about doing that for some of my slipper orchids (I already do so for Cattleyas and Dendrobiums).


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 2, 2020)

DrLeslieEe said:


> It is best to maintain the different horticultural forms separately so as to trace a lineage during the breeding process. And to maintain the purity of that form until further notice.
> 
> Whether they will be officially recognized as separate varieties or species, many breed differently, like anitum vs adductum and wilheminae vs praestens.
> 
> ...


Is there much difference in the culture of anitum and adductum? Just interested as I would love to grow one of them. I personally prefer the look of anitum, but it would depend which would suit my conditions more.


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## Tony (Jun 2, 2020)

I haven't found any major difference in the two culturally, both grow alongside my other multis without any particular difficulty.


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## Kate Boyce-Miles (Jun 2, 2020)

Tony said:


> I haven't found any major difference in the two culturally, both grow alongside my other multis without any particular difficulty.


Thank you for your response, Tony.


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## DrLeslieEe (Jun 2, 2020)

Tony said:


> I haven't found any major difference in the two culturally, both grow alongside my other multis without any particular difficulty.


Tony, would you do a pic of leaves side by side for the adductum vs anitum, with longest leaf measurements? Also what cultural conditions are your MF with? Thanks


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## Tony (Jun 2, 2020)

My adductum are 21" and 18" ls, my largest anitum is 18" while the one that bloomed recently is 14". Anitum has more defined tesselation but it does show in adductum as well, leaf structure is completely different. Adductum could pass for a roths at a glance while anitum is much broader all the way to the leaf base.

I grow in a greenhouse, shaded with whitewash but bright inside, I don't have a dedicated light meter but using a phone app I see a typical minimum of about 1500 fc and the top shelf can see short peaks as high as 10,000 fc. I have my evaporative cooler set to kick on at 85° F but temps sometimes creep into the low to mid 90s. I aim for a minimum night temp of 70 during the summer and 60 in winter, though I've seen winter temps drop into the high 40s on the coldest nights. I try to keep humidity over 60%, but again it may vary some with spikes into the 90s during rain and dips during the hottest part of the day. I try to time my watering to minimize those dips.


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## werner.freitag (Jun 2, 2020)

very interesting discussion !
just 2 remarks:

I sense that there is a actual tendency to create new species rather than regard them as varieties etc. 
whatever, they varieties/species should have different names to be able to follow-up origin and breeding lines

the owner of a Paph nursery here in the mountains clearly identifies plants by the leaves when not in bloom
these guys know where the plants come from, we often dont !
I was recently getting some potentianum , tried to find data about their habitat, anybody knows ???


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## DrLeslieEe (Jun 3, 2020)

Thanks Tony for the pics and cultural tips. 

The anitum leaves are indeed unmistakable when you see them. I can recognize it immediately in a collection, almost as fast as I can recognize the randsii leaves or sometimes a mature sanderianum leaves. 

Like Werner said, most of the time people use leaves to ID the wild plants when most are not in bloom. 

PS reotentianum, its assume where callosum grows, it will thrive as well.


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## GuRu (Jun 3, 2020)

werner.freitag said:


> very interesting discussion !
> .......I was recently getting some potentianum , tried to find data about their habitat, anybody knows ???



Werner, that's a little bit off topic here and I hope Kate will forgive me, when I abuse her 'striatum' thread. There was an article about Paph. potentianum in 'Die Orchidee' 53(6) 2002 and I will copy the chapter about its origin here. I assume bei your name you are German or Austrian so I copy it in its original language. If I'm wrong feel free to tell me and I will translate this few sentences into English.

_"1996 schrieb HERBERT BILLENSTEINER vom Palmengarten Frankfurt im 'Journal für den Orchideenfreund" über die Existenz von derartigen Pflanzen im Süden Thailands. Sie sollen in einem Gebiet wachsen, welches zwischen den Vorkommen von Paph. callosum und Paph. barbatum liegt. Die Pflanzen des Paph. potentianum sollen an einem ungenannten Berg in einer Höhenlage vorkommen, welche zwischen den Höhenlagen der anderen beiden Arten liegt. Während Paph. callosum in der höheren kühleren Region wächst, befinden sich die Vorkommen von Paph. barbatum in der tiefer gelegenen wärmeren Region."_

That's all and I hope this helps at least a bit.


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## DrLeslieEe (Jun 3, 2020)

Hey Guru, thanks for excerpt. Could you please translate it for us English speakers lol? I want to be educated on this topic as well. Many thanks!


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## GuRu (Jun 3, 2020)

DrLeslieEe said:


> Hey GuRu, thanks for excerpt. Could you please translate it for us English speakers lol? I want to be educated on this topic as well. Many thanks!



Leslie, it's a pleasure. Excerpt from 'Die Orchidee' 53(6) 2002
_"In 1996 HERBERT BILLENSTEINER from the Palmengarten Frankfurt wrote in the 'Journal für den Orchideenfreund' about the existence of such plants in southern Thailand. They are supposed to grow in an area which is situated between the occurrences of Paph. callosum and Paph. barbatum. It is said that the plants of Paph. potentianum grow on an unnamed mountain at an altitude that lies between the altitudes of the other two species. While Paph. callosum grows in the higher, cooler region, the occurrence of Paph. barbatum lies in the lower, warmer region."_


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## DrLeslieEe (Jun 3, 2020)

Thanks Guru! Very helpful to understand now lol.


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## Phred (Jun 3, 2020)

Kate Boyce-Miles said:


> Beautiful Paphs. I notice you are growing them in terracotta pots? I have been thinking about doing that for some of my slipper orchids (I already do so for Cattleyas and Dendrobiums).


Hi Kate
Sorry for the delay. I grow in clay only because I’m in the house an for me it’s easier to ‘not’ over water in clay. Heat/air change how fast my plants dry out and the in-between times are the hardest for me. I do have about 1000 plants in plastic pots but they are seedlings and they are clear plastic so I can see what’s going on. If I had a greenhouse I would probably use plastic for all of my Paphiopedilum


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## werner.freitag (Jun 4, 2020)

good Google-translation:

In 1996, HERBERT BILLENSTEINER from the Palmengarten Frankfurt wrote in the 'Journal für die Orchideenfreund' about the existence of such plants in southern Thailand. They are said to grow in an area between the occurrences of Paph. Callosum and Paph. Barbatum. The plants of the Paph. potentianum are said to occur on an undisclosed mountain at an altitude that lies between the altitudes of the other two species. While Paph. callosum grows in the higher, cooler region, the occurrences of Paph. barbatum are in the lower, warmer region. "

this fits better to my understanding of callosum, barbatum and potentianum.
all 0ne species or varieties of callosum or?
and there is more in the callosum-world


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## werner.freitag (Jun 4, 2020)

*Variations of Paphiopedilum callosum in Vietnam* by AVERYANOW
available as PDF on Google 
he mentioned another habitat for potentianum

sorry, its off topic


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## GuRu (Jun 4, 2020)

werner.freitag said:


> good Google-translation:.......



Sorry Werner, but you are wrong. This translation didn't do Mr. Google  I'm in the comfortable situation to do such translations without any assistance.


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