# Paph.gigantifolium



## iweyshen (Jun 5, 2011)

DSW:3.9cm


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## Braem (Jun 5, 2011)

That is a nice one! I described the species .... it looks nice than the type I had .. I wish you would try to self it and make the seedlings available


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## John Boy (Jun 5, 2011)

out of this world stunning!


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## ehanes7612 (Jun 5, 2011)

Braem said:


> That is a nice one! I described the species .... it looks nice than the type I had .. I wish you would try to self it and make the seedlings available



i second that


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## Paul (Jun 5, 2011)

very nice!!!


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## Shiva (Jun 5, 2011)

Beautiful!


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## KyushuCalanthe (Jun 5, 2011)

OK, not to inflame this thread, but if you did produce seedlings, wouldn't they still be illegal in the states?

Beautiful flower BTW.


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## goldenrose (Jun 5, 2011)

:clap::clap: :drool::drool::drool: :clap::clap:


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## John Boy (Jun 5, 2011)

IMHO this issue should be overcome by you folks ignoring it. (But that's just me). I've had enough of these people standing around (if they'd be standing....hanging about is more like it) in the way of preseving these plants by propagation.....


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## paphioboy (Jun 5, 2011)

Beautiful gigantifolium....


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## NYEric (Jun 5, 2011)

I'm not really into multis, but I'd like to have one. Oh heck the OP are at the door!


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## W. Beetus (Jun 5, 2011)

Such an interesting species! Nice.


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## Ernie (Jun 5, 2011)

Cool! I never realized how dark the backs of the sepals are in this species. The buds look almost black!


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## Howzat (Jun 5, 2011)

I have always been a supporter of exsitu propagation, and selfing this beautiful specimen of gigantifolium gets my vote. YES.


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## raymond (Jun 5, 2011)

very nice flowers


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## Rick (Jun 5, 2011)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> OK, not to inflame this thread, but if you did produce seedlings, wouldn't they still be illegal in the states?
> 
> Beautiful flower BTW.



Donate flasks to a rescue center, and keep moving the rest as P. supardii var 'wink wink':wink:


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## John M (Jun 6, 2011)

Awesome flowers! Congratulations!



KyushuCalanthe said:


> OK, not to inflame this thread, but if you did produce seedlings, wouldn't they still be illegal in the states?
> 
> Beautiful flower BTW.



I don't think Iweyshen needs to care about that. He's located in Taiwan, isn't he? 

Iwewshen; if you do produce flasks, please add me to your customer list! I'd love some seedlings from that plant!:clap:


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## John M (Jun 6, 2011)

BTW: Does anybody know what happened to Sam Tsui's plants that were confiscated? As I understand it, they were imported completely legally with all the correct paperwork that was required at the time; but, at some point later, some bureaucratic nit-wit decided that they should not have been allowed and Sam's plants were taken from him by USFW. Where did these plants go? Did the authorities send them to a rescue centre? Did they destroy them?


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## ehanes7612 (Jun 6, 2011)

John M said:


> BTW: Does anybody know what happened to Sam Tsui's plants that were confiscated? As I understand it, they were imported completely legally with all the correct paperwork that was required at the time; but, at some point later, some bureaucratic nit-wit decided that they should not have been allowed and Sam's plants were taken from him by USFW. Where did these plants go? Did the authorities send them to a rescue centre? Did they destroy them?



Sam selfed gigantifolium 'dark warrior' and was allowed to sell the seedlings..they are out there


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## Braem (Jun 6, 2011)

Rick said:


> Donate flasks to a rescue center, and keep moving the rest as P. supardii var 'wink wink':wink:


Don't tell ... Don't ask --- label them with a name of a "legal species" or a "hybrid".


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## quietaustralian (Jun 6, 2011)

Nice!


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## ehanes7612 (Jun 6, 2011)

http://slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12985&page=2


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## PaulS (Jun 6, 2011)

WOW! The colour and texture on the back of the sepals is lovely. 

I am hoping to get some gigantifolium crosses in the next few months, I hope the parents were as gorgeous as this.


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## Fabrice (Jun 6, 2011)

Very nice specie! I like it.


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## SlipperKing (Jun 6, 2011)

Just a beautiful species. Thanks for posting, it good to have more photos available. How about a whole plant shot??


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## Evergreen (Jun 6, 2011)

Gorgeous :clap: Yes, please show a whole plant photo if you can


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## John Boy (Jun 6, 2011)

I#d love to see that too!


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## carrilloenglish (Jun 6, 2011)

I agree, I would love to see a whole plant photo too for size perspective.


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## NYEric (Jun 6, 2011)




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## Rick (Jun 6, 2011)

ehanes7612 said:


> Sam selfed gigantifolium 'dark warrior' and was allowed to sell the seedlings..they are out there



Most dispersed to non-comercial entities.

They are out there, as are seedlings from Glenn Decker


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## polyantha (Jun 6, 2011)

IMHO there is no Paph out there with such unique flowers. Take the dorsal sepal: the inside is green, outside is dark purple. Or compare the very broad stripes on the dorsal to the other muliflorals. And the white ovary: there are only two species with that colour: gig. and sand. But if you ask me, it looks much more spectacular on gigantifolium, because the contrast to the dark purple is just an eye catcher.


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## eOrchids (Jun 6, 2011)

Like the coloring on this one!


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## Marc (Jun 6, 2011)

A very impressive specimen!!!!


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## Rick (Jun 6, 2011)

polyantha said:


> IMHO there is no Paph out there with such unique flowers. Take the dorsal sepal: the inside is green, outside is dark purple. Or compare the very broad stripes on the dorsal to the other muliflorals. And the white ovary: there are only two species with that colour: gig. and sand. But if you ask me, it looks much more spectacular on gigantifolium, because the contrast to the dark purple is just an eye catcher.



Foliage wise the plant is much more like kolopak than any of the other multi species. Big flat wide somewhat wavy and floppy leaves. No where near as rigid as stonei supardii or roth.

But 99.9% of what customs and USDA get to see are non blooming plants that all look the same to them, so the name printed on the tag is the only identifier. 5-10 years when it blooms who knows where that plant will be? And unless you make a big $ ruckus about it, everything stays under the radar.


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## Mathias (Jun 6, 2011)

Awesome! :clap::clap:


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## SlipperFan (Jun 6, 2011)

Braem said:


> That is a nice one! I described the species .... it looks nice than the type I had .. I wish you would try to self it and make the seedlings available





ehanes7612 said:


> i second that


Me three!



Braem said:


> Don't tell ... Don't ask --- label them with a name of a "legal species" or a "hybrid".





Rick said:


> Donate flasks to a rescue center, and keep moving the rest as P. supardii var 'wink wink':wink:


And then someone gets it awarded as "legal" or "wink wink" and we have another mess on registrations. Oh, I know -- you are both being facetious.:evil:


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## Rick (Jun 7, 2011)

SlipperFan said:


> Me three!
> 
> 
> 
> And then someone gets it awarded as "legal" or "wink wink" and we have another mess on registrations. Oh, I know -- you are both being facetious.:evil:



They need to be patient and keep it away from AOS judging until it gets as common as lowii. They can't put us all in jail!


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## Howzat (Jun 7, 2011)

Rick said:


> They need to be patient and keep it away from AOS judging until it gets as common as lowii. They can't put us all in jail!


Well guys, it looks like that US based members can start a petition to AOS/or any orchids conservation institutions to make representation to the USDA or USWF to change the USACITES interpretation of what is actually legal/illegal. I think it is only the authorities in USA that still classify seedlings illegal if the parents are yet to be legalised?? It is an understatement to say that the situation there is farcical. Hope your authorities do not try to change ours.


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## Marc (Jun 7, 2011)

Howzat said:


> Well guys, it looks like that US based members can start a petition to AOS/or any orchids conservation institutions to make representation to the USDA or USWF to change the USACITES interpretation of what is actually legal/illegal. I think it is only the authorities in USA that still classify seedlings illegal if the parents are yet to be legalised?? It is an understatement to say that the situation there is farcical. Hope your authorities do not try to change ours.



I've allready heard of US lobbying within CITES to have them take over their ridiculous stance on this subject so it applies to CITES worldwide.


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## Rick (Jun 7, 2011)

The situation with flasked seedlings from countries outside of Vietnam is not clear to me.

Gigantifolium is from Sulawesii (Indonesia). Are they are CITES signatory? If so, then plants in the hands Taiwan breeders may be "legal enough" to allow flasks of legal seedlings into the US without worrying about "wink wink".

Kind of like the present thaianum condition (though that species is Thai origin).

As it stands, there have been releases of flasked seedlings from Sam T. and Glenn D. into the hobby in the US.

Hopefully people are succesful in raising them, and will breed them as they flower.


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## Braem (Jun 7, 2011)

SlipperFan said:


> Me three!
> 
> 
> 
> And then someone gets it awarded as "legal" or "wink wink" and we have another mess on registrations. Oh, I know -- you are both being facetious.:evil:


It is simply not possible to have a bigger mess at registrations as there already it ...


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## Rick (Jun 7, 2011)

Braem said:


> It is simply not possible to have a bigger mess at registrations as there already it ...



I'd agree with that!

The Orchid Show priority is so much different from most foks growing or "conservation" priorities, I would not want to use the AOS or RHS registers for taxonomic purposes.


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## polyantha (Jun 7, 2011)

Rick said:


> Hopefully people are succesful in raising them, and will breed them as they flower.



It is not a difficult plant if you give it enough water, humidity (in nature it is growing close to brooks) and keep it warm. It does not need the same light conditions as the other multis. You should give it relatively low light.


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## Clark (Jun 7, 2011)

Eye candy!

Dark Warrior could not handle New Jersey. The stress was unbearable, and was suicidal after 2 months.
Thought my thumbs were greener.


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## Rick (Jun 7, 2011)

polyantha said:


> It is not a difficult plant if you give it enough water, humidity (in nature it is growing close to brooks) and keep it warm. It does not need the same light conditions as the other multis. You should give it relatively low light.



My seedlings really went nuts after going to the sphag/basket system. Epsom salt spiking (or reducing potassium) was also very helpful.

Light levels about the same as for supardii or sanderianum.


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## Wendy (Jun 7, 2011)

I just love this species. Mine is still a wee baby.


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## Eric Muehlbauer (Jun 7, 2011)

It had been legal, and seedlings were sold by Sam Tsui. Then all of a sudden, USFW decided that a mistake was made, and the plants weren't legal after all...Sam got royally screwed.


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## Roth (Jun 8, 2011)

Eric Muehlbauer said:


> It had been legal, and seedlings were sold by Sam Tsui. Then all of a sudden, USFW decided that a mistake was made, and the plants weren't legal after all...Sam got royally screwed.



The story is different in fact, even if Sam has been screwed definitely.

The plants were imported with a CITES export/import, including sanderianum. The sanderianum were indeed fresh wild plants (sent by Orchidwoods/ Au Yong Nang Yip of Kuching), shipped to Hawaii. The importer had to agree that ALL the plants from the shipment were from the wild, which canceled all the export/import CITES, that were deemed to be for art propagated plants. Then, the gigantifolium CITES has been canceled as well, making Sam motherplant and a few others illegal immediately. Sam bought from the importer with a copy of the CITES, but the importer had to give all of his customers address. Legally they were 'right', now it has been a mess because Sam propagated really that species...


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## Marc (Jun 8, 2011)

Roth said:


> The story is different in fact, even if Sam has been screwed definitely.
> 
> The plants were imported with a CITES export/import, including sanderianum. The sanderianum were indeed fresh wild plants (sent by Orchidwoods/ Au Yong Nang Yip of Kuching), shipped to Hawaii. The importer had to agree that ALL the plants from the shipment were from the wild, which canceled all the export/import CITES, that were deemed to be for art propagated plants. Then, the gigantifolium CITES has been canceled as well, making Sam motherplant and a few others illegal immediately. Sam bought from the importer with a copy of the CITES, but the importer had to give all of his customers address. Legally they were 'right', now it has been a mess because Sam propagated really that species...



Roth you keep amazing me with stuff you know about a lot of events that took place in the Orchidworld.

I'm curious how you obtained all this information.


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## SlipperKing (Jun 8, 2011)

Try this Marc
http://www.waorchids.iinet.net.au/Xavier_Garreau_de_Loubresse.htm


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## bigleaf (Jun 8, 2011)

gorgeous flowers.


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