# I've been re-bitten by the nobilior bug



## ChrisFL (Jan 15, 2009)

Aside from my other orchidarium-bound collection of mainly Bulbos, I am extremely obsessed with collecting high quality cultivars of C. nobilior. Undeniably my favorite orchid species, to me it's the perfect orchid, small in stature, huge flowers, incredible fragrance, highly specialized succulent growth and flowering habit. I had no place to grow them in Texas, but I'm working on setting up a new grow area using a 400 watt MV lamp. 

_Cattleya nobilior_ 'D. Rafael Wenzel' x self 4N
_Cattleya nobilior_ coerulea 'Francisco' x '#1'
_Cattleya nobilior_ 'Saturn' (sibling of 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS).


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## JeanLux (Jan 16, 2009)

'great' small specie!!! Can you show pictures of the plants?? Jean


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## P-chan (Jan 16, 2009)

They sound awesome! I would love to see photos!


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## goldenrose (Jan 16, 2009)

..... too many enablers! 
Sounds _*real good *_to me too! Show us more!


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## ChrisFL (Jan 16, 2009)

This is _C. nobilior_ coerulea 'Francisco' x '#1'

This is amongst rarest and most highly sought coerulea Cattleya species. There was only one found in nature thus far, with very poor shape. It was selfed, and the first generation yielded relatively well known cultivars, 'Luar do Sertao', 'Papagaio Verde', 'Loboda' and 'Francisco' among them, none of them had outstanding form yet, certainly nothing close to typical award winning nobiliors. Sibling crosses from this first generation are what are available now when you buy _C. nobilior_ coerulea, anything from Miranda or H&R. Enough have been made that seedling prices have come way down. When I invested in two sibling seedlings about a year ago, prices were significantly higher for a healthy vigorous seedling. I kept one, and another Slippertalk member you all know fairly well now has the other. The form on this generation, based on what has bloomed out in the last 12 months, ranges from awful to good, and the picture on Miranda's website, 

http://www.mirandaorchids.com/Images2/DV_Cattleya_nobilior_6027.jpg

being one of the best. Neither of the ones I originally bought has bloomed yet, so I have no idea whether my cultivar or the one I let go are any good yet. Be aware though, some breeders have cheated, and there are "claimed" coeruleas that are actually XMesquitae, with walkeriana in the background. Here is my plant:


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## ChrisFL (Jan 16, 2009)

Here's _C. nobilior_ 'Saturn' (sibling of 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS).

This plant is from Michael Sinn's breeding stock collection, and certainly feels like a 4N, with very thick leathery leaves, although I have no way of knowing for sure. Along with the other two plants, this one sat neglected on my entryway for 6 months, however this plant became infested with scale, and I lost three back bulbs. Looks like its finally turning the corner of recovery. 

Here's a pic of 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS (I have plans in the future to purchase a division of this cultivar, but right now I can't afford it):

http://www.canaimaorchids.com/gallery/c_nobilior_canaimas_tamara_am_aos_lg.jpg

Here's the plant:


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## ChrisFL (Jan 16, 2009)

And, finally, the seedling of _C. nobilior_ 'D. Rafael Wenzel' x self 4N

For bifoliate catt people, the D. R. Wenzel cultivar needs no introduction. It's a giant, flat, full shaped flower. Selfing it in the past has yielded some truly stunning results, like this one:

http://www.orchid.url.tw/myflowers/cattleya/cattleyanobilior24.jpg

So my fingers are crossed that this seedling grows into something worth owning and hopefully showing. Again, neglect set it back several months if not more than a year, but it responded immediately to being placed back in the warmth and light.


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## nikv (Jan 16, 2009)

I've been wanting one of these ever since I read an article about them in _Orchids_ a year or two ago. But every time I bid on one on eBay, I end up outbid. And I'm not willing to spend a lot of money on a plant that I'm not sure I can grow well. But maybe some day . . . .


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## JeanLux (Jan 16, 2009)

good luck with yours!!! I have 1 nobilior amaliae growing since 2005 without too much enthusiasm!!! Jean


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## ChrisFL (Jan 16, 2009)

nikv said:


> I've been wanting one of these ever since I read an article about them in _Orchids_ a year or two ago. But every time I bid on one on eBay, I end up outbid. And I'm not willing to spend a lot of money on a plant that I'm not sure I can grow well. But maybe some day . . . .



The reputation nobiliors have for being easy to kill is a perfect example of people "over-loving" their orchids. The three you see in the picture, including the seedling that is less than 2" tall, sat in low light with no direct water, complete neglect, for six months because I was focusing on my orchidarium and never made time to figure out what to do with them. Aside from the scale on the one plant, they did fine, just were dormant. Mount them, water them daily in the summer and fall, weekly in the spring and just enough to keep the bulbs from becoming overly desiccated in the winter, with light as bright as you can get it without burning. They lead a brutal existence in the wild, especially the amaliae variety.


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## nikv (Jan 16, 2009)

Hmmm . . . . I found nobilior being offered by Andy's Orchids for only $20.00 each. I'm very tempted to place an order.

http://www.andysorchids.com/pictureframe.asp?pic=%20images/Species/6200med.jpg&PicId=6200&PicNam=Cattleya%20-%20nobilior


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## ChrisFL (Jan 16, 2009)

Don't. The plant in the picture is not a nobilior, even though it's tagged as such. It's a walkeriana or Xmesquitae

If you want to buy a true nobilior, you can't beat Francisco Miranda:

http://mirandaorchids.com/cattleyaVGA.htm


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## nikv (Jan 16, 2009)

ChrisFL,

Thanks for the link!

Best Regards,
Nik


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## SlipperFan (Jan 16, 2009)

Those are very sweet -- good luck growing them!


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## NYEric (Jan 16, 2009)

Good Luck.


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## biothanasis (Jan 18, 2009)

they look very cute (although big...) Good luck...!


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## ChrisFL (Jan 23, 2009)

I just ordered 2 var. amaliae outcrossed with another amaliae and a tipo seedling, 'Luciana' x 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP. 

I also switched to growing in sphagnum moss.


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## ChrisFL (Feb 10, 2009)

Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP x self 4N (2" seedling)
Cattleya nobilior v. coerulea 'Francisco' x '#1' (NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'Saturn' (sibling of 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS, NBS).
Cattleya nobilior v. amaliae (seedling #1 from outcross, NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. amaliae (seedling #2 from outcross, NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP x 'Luciana' (3" seedling)
Cattleya nobilior v. coerulea 'Francisco' x '#1' (purchased in bud). 

Cattleya walkeriana 'Dona Yolanda' x v. coerulea (NBS)


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## SlipperFan (Feb 10, 2009)

Wouldn't it be fun to see these all bloom together?


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## ChrisFL (Feb 20, 2009)

Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP x self 4N (2" seedling)
Cattleya nobilior v. coerulea 'Francisco' x '#1' (NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'Saturn' (sibling of 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS, NBS).
Cattleya nobilior v. amaliae (seedling #1 from outcross, NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. amaliae (seedling #2 from outcross, NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP x 'Luciana' (3" seedling)
Cattleya nobilior v. coerulea 'Francisco' x '#1' (purchased in bud). 
Cattleya nobilior v. caerulea '1' x '4' (3" seedling from Antonio Schmidt breeding). 

Cattleya walkeriana 'Dona Yolanda' x v. coerulea (NBS)

Cattleya violacea 'Muse' FCC/AOS (2" mc)
Cattleya violacea 'Canaima's Pechi' AM/SVCN x 'Muse' FCC/AOS


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## ChrisFL (Jul 3, 2009)

I've recently added an original division division of C. nobilior v. tipo 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS to this list. Although it is in bad shape, it is beginning to grow.


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## ChrisFL (Jul 7, 2009)

Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP x self 4N (2" seedling)
Cattleya nobilior v. caerulea 'Francisco' x '#1' (NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'Saturn' (sibling of 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS, NBS).
Cattleya nobilior v. amaliae (seedling #1 from outcross, NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. amaliae (seedling #2 from outcross, NBS)
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'D. Rafael Wenzel' SM/JGP x 'Luciana' (3" seedling)
Cattleya nobilior v. caerulea 'Kassandra' ('Francisco' x '#1') (purchased in bud, enormous flower, shape could improve). 
Cattleya nobilior v. caerulea '1' x '4' (3" seedling from Antonio Schmidt breeding). 
Cattleya nobilior v. tipo 'Canaima's Tamara' AM/AOS (original division)

Cattleya walkeriana v. caerulea 'Dona Yolanda' x v. caerulea (NBS)
Cattleya walkeriana v. tipo 'Dayane Wenzel' HCC/AOS, SM/JOGA (original division)

Cattleya violacea 'Muse' FCC/AOS (2" mc)
Cattleya violacea 'Canaima's Pechi' AM/SVCN x 'Muse' FCC/AOS


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## Delego (Jul 8, 2009)

Thanks for all the culture advice, do they seem to grow like walkerianas? (culture wise)


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