# Little gray slugs



## myxodex (Nov 14, 2014)

I've got these yet again. My first experience with these was a few years back when I noticed that my some of my neofinetia's had missing root tips and my first thought was mechanical damage (aka me). On closer inspection I discovered that the root tips had been eaten off up to where the vellum starts and a neat little concave hole where they had hollowed out as much as they could reach.

I don't know whether they are a particular diminutive species (+/- 1 cm) or just juvenile slugs, but one thing I've noticed about them is that they are fast moving (for a slug that is), ... reach for the large bug-grabbing forceps and they've gone. Anyway now they're in my Paph patch and hide in the medium and they're taking out root tips again. Most annoyingly I got a Paph sangii v ayubianum two years back that I ordered in early winter in mild weather just before it got really cold and the plant got held up in transit somewhere between Germany and UK, and were not happy when I got them three weeks later. After dying back considerably, one shoot from the plant seemed determined to live, but with only stumps for roots. At seedling size this plucky little plant started making a new root after repotting ... then along came a little gray slug (strong expletives happened). I put a few slug pellets in all my pots. A few hours later I was checking my plants and I saw a little gray slug making a bee line down the outside of the sangii pot, and another coming out of another pot. They seem to be repelled by slug bait !? Not one dead slug. I was really hoping for dead slugs ... as one would.

I've also noticed that I have some other creepy crawlies in media of pots due for repotting, including milipedes. I've had enough putting up with pot wild life. I was wondering, based on some other threads here, whether drenching the pots with horticultural grade diatomite suspended in insecticidal soap solution might offer some control ? The two together ought to be synergistic but might also damage root tips ?


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## Ray (Nov 14, 2014)

See if you can find some Deadline M-Ps. It is a metaldehyde product that is registered for use in most states, a first for the U.S. It works on bush snails, too.


Ray Barkalow
firstrays.com


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## NYEric (Nov 14, 2014)

I sympathize w/ you. I am currently having a problem w/ a slug/snail. It only comes out at night and the only evidence is chewed leaves and the slime trail. I will make a copper fungicide solution and drench the area hoping it gets the varmit also.


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## cnycharles (Nov 14, 2014)

i've heard that if you can put zinc (copper) strips around table legs it can keep them from going up and down (for when your plants get clean). also, bugs hate being underwater; take them and put where you can drench the whole pot and fill up with water. bugs should come up and you nail them. i've also read where you can kill bugs by exposing plant/pot to hot water of a certain temp, for a short period and it only harms bugs. it was a while ago when I found this research thingy online so can't give specifics but searching might find it

*copper first popped into my head, but then i changed it to zinc
ray, good idea on the tanglefoot!


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## Ray (Nov 14, 2014)

Charles, I think that's copper, not zinc, but I suppose that might work, too.

I sell a lot of "Tree Tanglefoot" specifically for that purpose. It's a gel that contains castor bean extract, among other stuff, and is intended to put along city rooflines to keep pigeons at bay - it irritates their feet. It also serves as a good snail/slug/mouse barrier if placed on bench legs.


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## myxodex (Nov 14, 2014)

Thanks for the comments. @Ray, the slug pellets I used are those based on metaldehyde which work very well in the garden, although we don't use this anymore (toxic to dogs and cats). I just caught another slug (8mm long), these guys are small and the live in the potting mix and appear not to be interested in slug bait, ... that would just be too easy. 

There have been comments here about diatomaceous earth damaging roots and I was wandering if anyone has observed this or whether this was an extrapolation.


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## Ray (Nov 14, 2014)

Horticultural grade (sharp) diatomaceous earth for use as a slug repellent is intended as a barrier - i.e., sprinkled around so that the "foot" of the slug would be cut by it. I fail to see how that would affect a plant's roots, unless it's applied so heavily that it acts as a desiccant.


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## abax (Nov 15, 2014)

Orthene is a good first knock down on slugs as a drench. Then follow it up with the metaldehyde
product. The one I had was a wettable powder and
I sprayed and drenched. Did the trick on the little
bastids.


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## Bjorn (Nov 15, 2014)

Orthene against slugs??? Never heard of, if that is correct then....


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## limuhead (Nov 15, 2014)

Recently I have been raising chickens. A while back I bought a 3 lb. can of Gro Power Pure and Natural Granular Snail and Slug Away. I used the can on my Cymbidiums because I had a really bad bush snail infestation and I didn't want to risk poisoning my chickens. I sprinkled the stuff all over my plants, the snails vanished and I noticed that all my fungus problems were gone as well. The stuff works, is non toxic, and is a repellant, so the critters just bug out. I also tried it on my Phrags and it worked wonders, tons of roots and I haven't used fungicide in months; that's saying something considering I grow in the rain and in the winter it rains for days on end sometimes, or at very least daily. I think I've seen it on Ebay and Amazon as well.


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## Ray (Nov 15, 2014)

limuhead said:


> Gro Power Pure and Natural Granular Snail and Slug Away



Very cool.... The active ingredient is cinnamon oil, and the liquid spray version looks a lot like my Rise & Shine product.

I think I may have to do some experimenting, especially now that I have a source of cinnamon leaf oil, which seems even more powerful.


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## Erythrone (Nov 15, 2014)

Bjorn said:


> Orthene against slugs??? Never heard of, if that is correct then....



Neither do I


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## NYEric (Nov 15, 2014)

limuhead said:


> Gro Power Pure and Natural Granular Snail and Slug Away. I think I've seen it on Ebay and Amazon as well.


Thanks. Winter- in Hawaii! Hrmph!


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## abax (Nov 16, 2014)

Orthene works as a first knock down on bush snails. I used orthene before
I managed to find the metaldehyde and order it. Actually, it surprised me
as well. My memory might be getting a tad short, but someone on another
orchid forum suggested that acetate in orthene is helpful. I may have the
name "acetate" bungled with something else in my head. If so, forgive me. Anyhow, it worked.

Ray, where did you find cinnamon leaf oil? Sure would smell better than orthene or
metaldehyde.


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## myxodex (Nov 16, 2014)

Thanks for the replies, I now have some ideas to work with. I don't think I can get orthene here in the UK, it seems if it works then it's either banned or only certified green keepers can get it (connection between golf and political decision making ?). Also I could not find an outlet for Gro Power Pure and Natural in the UK, ... but, ... and thanks Limuhead and Ray for the info, I can get both cinnamon bark and leaf oils. I did a bit of google-fu and found some info that might be of use to those interested in cinnamon oil.

The cinnamon bark oil is mostly cinnamaldhyde (~ 97%) and the leaf oil is mostly eugenol (~87%) and these are both active against fungi and bacteria, although eugenol seems to be more broad spectrum and stronger than cinnamaldhyde (see link)

http://cinnamonvogue.com/DOWNLOADS/...n-leaf-and-bark-volatile-oils-oleoresins1.pdf

On the other hand cinnamaldhyde might be more potent against insects (see links)

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2004-07/acs-ok071504.php

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...age&q=cinnamon oil pesticide activity&f=false

@ Ray, you might want to be cautious with the leaf oil, eugenol, because at high doses it has herbicidal activity against some plants.

Finally a reference to cinnamon oil as a molluscicide 
http://www.wripmc.org/CenterProjects/Hollingsworth_IPM Issues_2010_Final.pdf

I also came across a youtube vid (sorry didn't save the link), of someone simmering together chilli, cinnamon, garlic and soap (hippie soap i think), straining it and using diluted as a garden spray to kill just about anything that moves ! Perhaps you don't have to be a green keeper after all 

Cheers,
Tim


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## Ray (Nov 16, 2014)

Tim,

I have used both cinnamaldehyde (extracted from bark independently with both water and alcohol) and eugenol on plants. I have no idea what the concentration is with the cinnamaldehyde, but for the leaf oil extract, I have used about a 1% oil (0.87% eugenol) solution in isopropanol, and seen no damage to the plants.

As an aside, I used the pure cinnamon leaf oil on toenail fungus, and it was knocked out in 6 weeks, as opposed to the 48 weeks required in the use of a topical pharmaceutical sold in the US.


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## cnycharles (Nov 16, 2014)

Angela, the orthene has acephate (close!  )


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## abax (Nov 16, 2014)

YES, acephate! Was thinking nail polish remover...oh my. Thank you, Charles, for reactivating my dead brain cells. Hope it lasts. :>)


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## cnycharles (Nov 17, 2014)

abax said:


> YES, acephate! Was thinking nail polish remover...oh my. Thank you, Charles, for reactivating my dead brain cells. Hope it lasts. :>)



You put nail polish on your slugs? ;rollhappy:
I'm sure brain cells aren't dead, just a little chilled from the latest deep freeze. Y'know, I've seen that women often won't wear hats when it gets cold; that might help  (jk)


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## myxodex (Nov 17, 2014)

Ray said:


> Tim,
> 
> I have used both cinnamaldehyde (extracted from bark independently with both water and alcohol) and eugenol on plants. I have no idea what the concentration is with the cinnamaldehyde, but for the leaf oil extract, I have used about a 1% oil (0.87% eugenol) solution in isopropanol, and seen no damage to the plants.
> 
> As an aside, I used the pure cinnamon leaf oil on toenail fungus, and it was knocked out in 6 weeks, as opposed to the 48 weeks required in the use of a topical pharmaceutical sold in the US.



Thanks Ray, this is very useful info. I wonder if any of these compounds enter into the plant to give some short term systemic protection or anti-feedant effects. There is an Indian scientist doing research into compounds from a bunch of different plant oils, including cinnamon, neem and others, looking for synergistic interactions. Even some of the big Pharma companies have been looking into the ayuvedic medicines for drug development ; e.g. the drug from green plantain that is a cure for gastric ulcers


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## limuhead (Dec 12, 2014)

NYEric said:


> Thanks. Winter- in Hawaii! Hrmph!



Yeah, winter is tragic around here, got down to 61 last night...


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## NYEric (Dec 12, 2014)

Suffer!


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