# Lc. Dinard 'Blue Heaven' AM/AOS 蓝色天堂



## Calvin_Tiong (Sep 25, 2020)




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## monocotman (Sep 26, 2020)

Beautiful. I need to find one of these in Europe but they are rare!
This, along with George King ‘serendipity’ are my two favourite complex hybrids.
David


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## Guldal (Sep 27, 2020)

What gorgeous display of colours as well as form!


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## Ozpaph (Sep 29, 2020)

It doesnt look very blue in the photo???


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## Just1more (Sep 29, 2020)

Stunning. Blooms. I love the colors. I’d call it Lavendar Blue (sing dilly, dilly) and the lip I’d call gorgeous! I must get one of these Cattleyas!!!


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## SouthPark (Sep 29, 2020)

Ozpaph said:


> It doesn't look very blue in the photo???



I think that back in the 'old' days, they didn't know what the word 'blue' actually meant. There is definitely a range where 99% of regular sighted people will agree that a particular 'blue' falls into the 'blue' category - or within range of BLUE. Violet, pinky violet, purple etc. is certainly not anywhere in range of blue.

Naturally - just like fuzzy logic or borderline cases (or close to border) ----- there can be situations where the colour is undecided. But for many cases where a flower is clearly not anywhere near 'blue' ------ they shouldn't have put the word 'blue' in the name (- although, it's their choice, but a poor choice heheh).

Aside from the cultivar name (with the word blue) ------ totally agree --- beautiful and outstanding result! Very nice flowers!


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## Ozpaph (Sep 30, 2020)

I should have led with - lovely flower especially the velvet lip. Apologies


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## Ozpaph (Sep 30, 2020)

Just1more said:


> I’d call it Lavendar Blue (sing dilly, dilly)


showing your age (or mine).....


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## SouthPark (Sep 30, 2020)

Ozpaph said:


> I should have led with - lovely flower especially the velvet lip. Apologies



You should have heheheheh. Accepted (apologies accepted)


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## SouthPark (Sep 30, 2020)

Just1more said:


> Lavendar Blue (sing dilly, dilly)



Cindy's dress is indeed blue. I see skies of blue and clouds of white. Skies are blue, and the dreams that you dare to dream really do come true.


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## southernbelle (Sep 30, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> I think that back in the 'old' days, they didn't know what the word 'blue' actually meant. There is definitely a range where 99% of regular sighted people will agree that a particular 'blue' falls into the 'blue' category - or within range of BLUE. Violet, pinky violet, purple etc. is certainly not anywhere in range of blue.
> 
> Naturally - just like fuzzy logic or borderline cases (or close to border) ----- there can be situations where the colour is undecided. But for many cases where a flower is clearly anywhere near 'blue' ------ they shouldn't have put the word 'blue' in the name (- although, it's their choice, but a poor choice heheh).
> 
> Aside from the cultivar name (with the word blue) ------ totally agree --- beautiful and outstanding result! Very nice flowers!


Mine will sometimes bloom in late winter (Feb) and the flowers will be bluer and the lip wider than now. Mine does not have the petal and sepal form of this flower, very nice.


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## SouthPark (Sep 30, 2020)

southernbelle said:


> Mine will sometimes bloom in late winter (Feb) and the flowers will be bluer and the lip wider than now. Mine does not have the petal and sepal form of this flower, very nice.



SB ----- nice! I would love to see pics of your flowers for the next flowering!!!


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## Just1more (Oct 1, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> You should have heheheheh. Accepted (apologies accepted)


Pd a price for my comment, eh? I’ve also been hummming Lavendar Blue in my head ever since making the comment


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## SouthPark (Oct 1, 2020)

Just1more said:


> Pd a price for my comment, eh? I’ve also been hummming Lavendar Blue in my head ever since making the comment



hahahaha. You really got that dilly dilly thing stuck in my head too now too!

❄

Earlier on ----- I think Ozpaph was just meaning ----- he/she should have opened proceedings with a comment about the beautiful flower, instead of starting out with a question about the colour hahaha.


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## southernbelle (Oct 2, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> SB ----- nice! I would love to see pics of your flowers for the next flowering!!!


My memory was wrong. It was an Oct bloom that was bluer. Here are the 3 past flowering’s 10/17; 2/19; 9/20.


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## SouthPark (Oct 2, 2020)

southernbelle said:


> My memory was wrong. It was an Oct bloom that was bluer. Here are the 3 past flowering’s 10/17; 2/19; 9/20.



Those photos are so beautiful!!!!!! Very nice captures SB! Thanks for posting them too. Very very nice to see those ones. Great shape and colours. The velvet pattern/texture is super appealing.


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## monocotman (Oct 3, 2020)

Fantastic. I continue to look for do one in Europe, but they as rare as hens teeth. There is one for sale regularly on eBay but I would not buy from that seller.


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## SouthPark (Oct 3, 2020)

They do exist over here in Australia. But true ----- hard to find I think - *rarer* than hens teeth.


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## southernbelle (Oct 3, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> Those photos are so beautiful!!!!!! Very nice captures SB! Thanks for posting them too. Very very nice to see those ones. Great shape and colours. The velvet pattern/texture is super appealing.


SP thank you, but I think your flower has nicer form. The second photo (with the name on it) was judged at the VOS show in Richmond in 2/2019 It got a red ribbon. The judges comments were that it should have more flowers (it had another, but the bud blasted) and that the petals were a bit too wavy. So they gave it a 2nd place ribbon. I was thrilled as it was the first time I had taken anything to a show. The lip on that one (Feb. bloom) was enormous and really velvety. Don’t know why it bloomed out of cycle.


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## SouthPark (Oct 3, 2020)

southernbelle said:


> SP thank you, but I think your flower has nicer form. The second photo (with the name on it) was judged at the VOS show in Richmond in 2/2019 It got a red ribbon. The judges comments were that it should have more flowers (it had another, but the bud blasted) and that the petals were a bit too wavy. So they gave it a 2nd place ribbon. I was thrilled as it was the first time I had taken anything to a show. The lip on that one (Feb. bloom) was enormous and really velvety. Don’t know why it bloomed out of cycle.



Most welcome!!! I haven't got a Dinard 'Blue Heaven' yet! ----- but from online searches, the 'Blue Heaven' does show up from at least some orchid club sites. I haven't seen 'Blue Heaven' for sale online - anywhere in Australia yet. Maybe same situation as what MM wrote. Rarer than hens teeth in Australia hehehe.

Second place is awesome. Cannot believe those criteria from those judges hahaha. Too wavey my foot. Wavy is natural and individual. The deep colour velvety lip is so nice. That is like orchid royalty!


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## southernbelle (Oct 3, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> Most welcome!!! I haven't got a Dinard 'Blue Heaven' yet! ----- but from online searches, the 'Blue Heaven' does show up from at least some orchid club sites. I haven't seen 'Blue Heaven' for sale online - anywhere in Australia yet. Maybe same situation as what MM wrote. Rarer than hens teeth in Australia hehehe.
> 
> Second place is awesome. Cannot believe those criteria from those judges hahaha. Too wavey my foot. Wavy is natural and individual. The deep colour velvety lip is so nice. That is like orchid royalty!


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## southernbelle (Oct 3, 2020)

SouthPark said:


> Most welcome!!! I haven't got a Dinard 'Blue Heaven' yet! ----- but from online searches, the 'Blue Heaven' does show up from at least some orchid club sites. I haven't seen 'Blue Heaven' for sale online - anywhere in Australia yet. Maybe same situation as what MM wrote. Rarer than hens teeth in Australia hehehe.
> 
> Second place is awesome. Cannot believe those criteria from those judges hahaha. Too wavey my foot. Wavy is natural and individual. The deep colour velvety lip is so nice. That is like orchid royalty!


Oh my, I was confused and thought I was talking to Calvin_Tiong, who posted the original photo. I’m sorry Calvin, I did not mean to hijack your thread. Your flower form is beautiful.


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## SouthPark (Oct 3, 2020)

southernbelle said:


> Oh my, I was confused and thought I was talking to Calvin_Tiong, who posted the original photo. I’m sorry Calvin, I did not mean to hijack your thread. Your flower form is beautiful.



No problem SB! I thought that was awesome how you posted more flower pics from this great cultivar. This thread is dedicated to that orchid. Good post and great pics.


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## DrLeslieEe (Oct 4, 2020)

Nice blooming Calvin.

There has been a lot of confusion when blue is applied to the Cattleya family (and most orchids in general). 

The correct term is coerulea or coerulescens (almost blue). 

This is define as a slate 'bluish' light lavender that has a grey cast over the pink tone. Imagine a pink or lavender pink sheet, and put a grey see-through paper over it and you will get the coerulea. 

This tone will be viewed differently based on the light shining on it. Morning and white LEDs will make it look 'bluish' while late afternoon sun and incandescent will bring out more reds and make it look for 'pinkish'. 

So depending on when and what light you use to take the photo, the camera will capture the bluish or pinkish tones. 

In judging, a flower is determined to be coerulea not based on the tag, but on the grey cast that subdues the lavender color of a typical Cattleya flower. 

In the case of Dinard, although not visually blue, it is considered a coerulea flower because the overall flower looks like a grey tone has been put over an otherwise pink-lavender flower. This is obvious if you put a normal lavender flower next to it.


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## SouthPark (Oct 4, 2020)

Great post by DLE! Those guys or girls back in the past could maybe have saved head-scratching by using a word like violet or violacea hehehe. Lavendacea would be pretty good too hehehe. The people back then had such a strong desire to get a blue coloured flower - that it just seems that they mentally or psychologically fooled themselves into thinking that they really got a blue haha.

What DLE posted was great though, as it touches on how those people got to the point of putting words blue into names of violet or lavender-colour-flowered orchids.

If I could go back in time to judge those people's name making decisions ----- 'fail' ----- zero marks heheh.


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## southernbelle (Oct 4, 2020)

DrLeslieEe said:


> Nice blooming Calvin.
> 
> There has been a lot of confusion when blue is applied to the Cattleya family (and most orchids in general).
> 
> ...


Thanks Leslie, very informative, as always. I appreciate your level of expertise and knowledge.


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