# Hung Sheng Eagle confusion



## Redtwist (Sep 11, 2016)

I recently bought a yp of what I thought (and still hope) is a Paph.HSEagle. Good news is its growing well, but I noticed today it is labelled as roth x gig, whereas the bluenanta database lists HSE as gig x roth. Further confusion, as looking at vendors sites and threads here I see both combinations referred to as HSE by different people!
So I guess quick questions: 1) which is the correct pod/pollen order for HSE and 2) if I have the 'wrong' one does anyone know what differences I can expect? (Therefore should I get myself the other if I want a good HSE? Which I do...big time.)

Chris


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## cattmad (Sep 11, 2016)

yes it is still Hung Sheng Eagle.

The cross can be made either way (Gig x roth or roth X gig), doesn't matter which way the cross was made it is still Hung Sheng Eagle


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## Redtwist (Sep 11, 2016)

Thanks cattmad, thats a relief. Hopefully it'll turn out a good one.

Showing my ignorance here - are all registered hybrids given the same name whichever way round the parents are? I always assumed they would yield different results (esp. if there was a great difference in the the parents forms) and therefore might be given different names.


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## Happypaphy7 (Sep 11, 2016)

Yes.

Whichever way a cross is made, as long as the two parents involved are the same, they are the same cross. 

I know some say it makes a difference, but in reality, it makes hardly any difference in results.


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## Redtwist (Sep 12, 2016)

Thanks for clearing that up!

Can't believe I actually shied away from some purchases, thinking they werent the same quality cross! The future is brighter now :rollhappy:


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## phraggy (Sep 12, 2016)

Not to worry mine was labelled the same as yours. Hope it turns out to be as good if not better than mine.

Ed


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## Ray (Sep 12, 2016)

I can't claim to know exactly what, but it is my understanding that there are some traits - color and size, likely others - that are predominately influenced by mitochondrial DNA, contributed by the seed parent.


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## Redtwist (Sep 12, 2016)

Ray said:


> I can't claim to know exactly what, but it is my understanding that there are some traits - color and size, likely others - that are predominately influenced by mitochondrial DNA, contributed by the seed parent.



Yes, my understanding (based on hazy recollections from various orchid books!) was that generally pollen parents influenced colour and pattern, whilst pod parents influenced form and size. But I expect that has been debunked by the advent of DNA science.

Just by observation, in the case of HSEagles, some do seem to have thinner, more rothlike horizontal petals, like your lovely example Ed (I'll be happy enough with that!) whilst others I've seen posted are more rounded, thicker in the petals like gigantifolium. I wonder if that is a subtle difference caused the parental order, or is it not that simple?


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## Ozpaph (Sep 13, 2016)

Ray is correct (at least in humans), mitochondrial DNA is maternal. If that's true for orchids - the pod parent (ie first parent listed on the 'X' (cross)).
Some breeders do believe it makes a difference which is pod vs pollen parent.


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## NYEric (Sep 15, 2016)

My seed parent definitely gave me his hairline!


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## Ryan Young (Sep 15, 2016)

Ozpaph said:


> Ray is correct (at least in humans), mitochondrial DNA is maternal. If that's true for orchids - the pod parent (ie first parent listed on the 'X' (cross)).
> Some breeders do believe it makes a difference which is pod vs pollen parent.


In some miltoniopsis crosses, it definitely makes a difference which is the pod vs. pollen parent, a breeder I know showed me the difference on his cross pollinated batch, one pod gave larger flowers consistently, the other pod consistently smaller ones, (same parents) genetics is a funny thing.


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## Redtwist (Sep 17, 2016)

Ryan Young said:


> In some miltoniopsis crosses, it definitely makes a difference which is the pod vs. pollen parent, a breeder I know showed me the difference on his cross pollinated batch, one pod gave larger flowers consistently, the other pod consistently smaller ones, (same parents) genetics is a funny thing.



It would be interesting if people could post some pics of a few well known paph hybrids each way round for comparison. Not scientific, but it might be possible to see some subtle differences. If anyone reading this thread has a HSEagle that is gigxroth (to compare with Eds rothxgig) that would be a good start.


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