# need help identifying a phal. problem. please help



## pappipaph (Dec 8, 2009)

ok so i went out for thanksgiving and came back to an orchid who's leaves fell right off with very little black spots perfectly oval and moldy looking.

than a couple days later another plant the same thing on another but the leaves didnt have black spots. they just started breaking like the large purple phal. in the pics. 

the purple one both spikes have lots of life in them but the leaves are just falling off. but the roots are growing really well and the flowers are blooming and a second spike from the second spike 

would a lot of low 50's and a cold high of 70 be a contributing factor?


http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080662.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080663.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080664.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080665.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080666.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080667.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080668.jpg
http://i273.photobucket.com/albums/jj228/pluggsNfunn/orchids/PC080669.jpg


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## Choodles (Dec 8, 2009)

I wouldn't think the temps swings alone would cause this- I have temps like that and have never seen this. 

I am a little curious about the light level- it seems quite high (looks like direct sun, and the leaves are pretty red.)

I know with a lot of non-orchids, leaf-drop is a defense against drought- have these plants gone dry, or had a combination of drying wind + high light?

I dunno, but this is interesting...hopefully someone has more to offer than I do (wouldn't take much, now would it?)


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## pappipaph (Dec 8, 2009)

Choodles said:


> I wouldn't think the temps swings alone would cause this- I have temps like that and have never seen this.
> 
> I am a little curious about the light level- it seems quite high (looks like direct sun, and the leaves are pretty red.)
> 
> ...



well the direct light is for the pic only. usually under a very shady tree with alot of other orchids. but the red under its leaves has been there since i bought it. its red purple spotted underneath and bright green stiff leaves. 

i think you may be onto something though, the rainy conditions have dried out the air and it has been very windy, to the point i have moved my bulbo. and paph's inside late afternoon and night.


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## Ernie (Dec 8, 2009)

IMO that is on the cool side for modern Phal hybrids. They will take it well for short periods or intermittently, but not well long term. 

I sort of think some of the pix show the result of dessication. The lower leaves give up water for the plant, then if not rejuvinated in time drop off. Make sure you water DEEPLY with copious amounts of water, especially in those pots with the bigger bark that looks crusty white on top. Could also be mineral deposits (from hard water or overfert or not enough flushing) damaging some of the roots deeper in the pot. 

-Ernie


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## SlipperFan (Dec 8, 2009)

I agree -- cold and drying winds might be the cause. I'm glad to see new growth.


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## luvsorchids (Dec 8, 2009)

I agree with the above comments. Phals like these really shouldn't go below 60 degrees for any period of time.

Susan


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## NYEric (Dec 8, 2009)

Yes that is cold for Phals.


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## pappipaph (Dec 9, 2009)

*Hank you and I really appreciate the help*



SlipperFan said:


> I agree -- cold and drying winds might be the cause. I'm glad to see new growth.



thank you all who have replied really 

Well I have no room anywhere in my house with adequate
light and room for 40 orchids but I have an entry way to the back
house that fits all and has room for improving on for winter houseing
light is no issue there but my problem would be heat and air circulation 

Any ideas? It's a 6x8 room with a 7 foot ceiling


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## Ernie (Dec 9, 2009)

pappipaph said:


> light is no issue there but my problem would be heat and air circulation
> 
> Any ideas? It's a 6x8 room with a 7 foot ceiling



At risk of sounding annoying, I'll answer... a heater and a fan? 

To help more, we'll probably need some more details:
Where are you?
What's your outside low temp in winter and what's the low temp in this "room"?
Pictures would be very useful. 

-Captain Obvious


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## cnycharles (Dec 9, 2009)

I think if the plants/pots were wet or really wet when the cold winds started, and it then got down to 50, then that with the wind chill factor would have been much cooler than 50 to the plants (lots of evaporation). Then adding on further drying quickly which would concentrate any fertilizer on the outside of the bark (as already pointed out) and roots could almost pull water back through the roots along with possibly burning them.

If your winter lows are 50 and highs around 70 outside, then if you could put up a plastic wall to seal the 'room' the plants would be fine. I'm assuming from previous posts about buying cheap phal bellinas at markets means that you're in southeast asia somewhere! (certainly can't buy bellina with 10 flowers at lowes or wegmans here!)


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## Renegayde (Dec 9, 2009)

funny I thought he was in SoCal from a previous post and also one time had mentioned he bought some things at Trader Joes



pappipaph said:


> just wondering how long lasting Bulb. Elizabeth Ann "Buckleberry" blooms are.
> mine only about 2-3 weeks (only one and a half open) are already wilting but also a sudden drop in temp. as* socal *welcomes winter doesn't help.
> 
> we've got a huge drop in humidity and cold rain in store for the week.


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## Ernie (Dec 9, 2009)

Renegayde said:


> funny I thought he was in SoCal from a previous post and also one time had mentioned he bought some things at Trader Joes



Yep. Trader Joes (or any big box store) would explain funky root occurrences such as the dessication in disquise I see here. A lot of times the roots are bound in NZ sphag then bark is used to fill in so the plant is in a larger pot. I'd repot those suckers immediately into something I was comfortable growing in. ... and add the heater and fan of course. 

Pappipaph, please introduce yourself and tell us about your plants and conditions. How long have you been growing orchids? What grows well for you? What have you re-bloomed yourself? I think there is a deeper, possibly simple problem we can help with if you share a little background info. Don't be shy, we were all newbies once. 

-Ernie


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## pappipaph (Dec 9, 2009)

cnycharles said:


> I think if the plants/pots were wet or really wet when the cold winds started, and it then got down to 50, then that with the wind chill factor would have been much cooler than 50 to the plants (lots of evaporation). Then adding on further drying quickly which would concentrate any fertilizer on the outside of the bark (as already pointed out) and roots could almost pull water back through the roots along with possibly burning them.
> 
> If your winter lows are 50 and highs around 70 outside, then if you could put up a plastic wall to seal the 'room' the plants would be fine. I'm assuming from previous posts about buying cheap phal bellinas at markets means that you're in southeast asia somewhere! (certainly can't buy bellina with 10 flowers at lowes or wegmans here!)



i promise all my orchids have come from lowes and trader joes and homedepot. no joke. only my bulbo. elizabeth ann "buckeberry" and 2 phal's have come from normans orchids.


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## cnycharles (Dec 9, 2009)

(doh!) oh, I must've been thinking of noel; he was the one buying all the nice phal species (and from southeast asia). box store phals have most likely been extremely fertilized to get them to grow extremely quickly, so yes repotting everything right after getting them is a good idea


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## pappipaph (Dec 9, 2009)

oh i have never left a new buy in its original pot for that reason exactly. i had got a book from miricle grow because it gave basic tips and tricks but its not very helpful like all you wonderful orchid hobbiest with actual expierience


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## gonewild (Dec 9, 2009)

The Phals will survive better in low/no light than cold.
Move them into a warm room and don't worry about the light until you can fix the temperature problem.


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## Candace (Sep 23, 2010)

This post was "reported" to admin. I'm not seeing anything about it that would require any action by the moderators???


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## NYEric (Sep 23, 2010)

Normans!? check and treat for bugs!


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## goldenrose (Sep 23, 2010)

Candace said:


> This post was "reported" to admin. I'm not seeing anything about it that would require any action by the moderators???



Hmmm .... I got it too but not seeing anything requiring action either.


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## SlipperFan (Sep 23, 2010)

Candace said:


> This post was "reported" to admin. I'm not seeing anything about it that would require any action by the moderators???


Do you know the person who sent out the request? Not a name I'm familiar with.


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## Candace (Sep 23, 2010)

It doesn't matter, let's carry on. :>


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