# Ph question?



## Hera (Dec 9, 2013)

Recently a friend tested my water and it showed a result of Ph 9.9. Can anyone educate me on how to adjust this down using citric acid and where can I buy it? I'm ordering a ph meter so that I can monitor this for every watering.


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## Stone (Dec 9, 2013)

Do you use the hose or a can for watering?
You can use citric, nitric (adds N, dangerous), Phosphoric (adds P), sulphuric (dangerous unless diluted), Oxalic (toxic but I used it ok).
Its recommended you change acids from time to time.
If you water with a can, just measure the amount held by the can, put the same amount into a bucket and CAREFULLY add the acid one drop at a time with an eye dropper. (don't use the dropper for your eyes!!) Stir and measure pH as you go. Take note of the quantity of acid required to bring the pH to the desired level. (5.5 to 6.5?) and your done.
If you want to water with the hose, you will need a large holding tank and a pump or some sort of injection set-up in the mains. If the acid is in powder form, you need to add a very small measured amount or make up a stock solution and use that when you need it.


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## cnycharles (Dec 9, 2013)

You can purchase citric acid at greenhouse supply places, and since it's used for food, some food/restaurant supply places. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## naoki (Dec 9, 2013)

pH 9.9! That seems to be extreme. Was your friend's meter calibrated well?

Is it well water or RO water? Some pH meter probes don't seem to work well with pure water (I don't know why). I vaguely remember that I had to use a cheaper probe for purer water. I use acetic acid (white vinegar from grocery store) for Cyp. acaule, so it could be another option.


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## Hera (Dec 9, 2013)

It is tap/ city water and we are going to test again to be sure of the results. I'm investing in a digital tester so that I can monitor every time I water. I thought the result was a bit extreme, but when I used simple test strips from the aquarium store, I got a result that was very alkaline. Like I said, we'll be checking again just to be sure.


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## phrag guy (Dec 9, 2013)

that sounds high for tap water,mine is around 6.8 0n the digital
A hydroponic store will have ph down or up. Once you mix your fertilizer in it changes again. I mix it with R.O. water to weaken it so I only use a drop per 2 litre can


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## Ray (Dec 9, 2013)

I sell citric acid, but if you want a local supply, look for "sour salt" as is sometime used in eastern European ethnic dishes (like a pinch in my Ukrainian grandmother's borscht).


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## ALToronto (Dec 9, 2013)

Does your water taste bitter? At 9.9, it would be. 

I don't think any municipal water pH is that high. Usually it's adjusted to a little above neutral so that the pipes don't rust, but I don't think anyone takes it above 8. Could the water or the container you placed it in have been contaminated with something? Maybe soap residue?


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## NYEric (Dec 9, 2013)

Hera said:


> Recently a friend tested my water and it showed a result of Ph 9.9.



9.9! How are you alive? Are you drinking soap?


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## Hera (Dec 9, 2013)

Yeah, the result is suspect. Still, worth investigating. When I had fish several years ago we usually tested around 6.8. We need to recalibrate and test again.


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## Rick (Dec 9, 2013)

ALToronto said:


> Does your water taste bitter? At 9.9, it would be.
> 
> I don't think any municipal water pH is that high. Usually it's adjusted to a little above neutral so that the pipes don't rust, but I don't think anyone takes it above 8. Could the water or the container you placed it in have been contaminated with something? Maybe soap residue?




Oklahoma City tap water typically comes off the mains at pH 10-11!!

BUT the alkalinity is very unstable since the gas balance is way off (all the CO2 stripped out). After 24 hours of simple aeration, the pH would drop to about 7.5 s.u.

Hera before adding any acids, try aerating the sample overnight and recheck the pH. Quite often bubbling some air through it will restore the gas balance (add CO2) and drop the pH to something easier to use.

Otherwise as Stone suggested a few drops of phosphoric or sulfuric (I'd probably prefer dilute sulfuric) will do the trick.


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## NYEric (Dec 9, 2013)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH

Yes, I would not drink that straight from the tap.


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## Stone (Dec 10, 2013)

My tap water was as high as pH10 for a few years and never less than about 8.5 before I moved. There was so much lime in it we complained to the water man and he told us to disconnect the meter and use as much as we wanted. It was during a drought and not enough rain came through the system to flush the lime from the concrete pipes. The plants still did well but I used fertilizers with ammonium and Urea and no Calcium or Magnesium at all!, but the leaves were always encrusted with Calcium carbonate that could not be removed so I think a soft water is best.


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## Ray (Dec 10, 2013)

Maybe we should do some blending. My well water is 4.7-5.3, so would "eat" copper pipes (nobody in this household will ever die from a copper deficiency!). We used to add a K2CO3 solution to neutralize it, but a few months ago I switch to a calcite/magnesite column.


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## Hera (Dec 10, 2013)

Update: I bought my own ph meter from the Hydroponic store and my tap measured at a whopping 10.65. I'll be adjusting down when I water now and hopefully this will stop the yellowing that I've seen in some of my paph and phrags. Thanks for all the help and info.


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## NYEric (Dec 10, 2013)

:rollhappy: 10.65!!!
Your pipes must be calcified!! Good luck.


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## Rick (Dec 10, 2013)

NYEric said:


> :rollhappy: 10.65!!!
> Your pipes must be calcified!! Good luck.



pH has nothing to do with calcium content.

Sodium hydroxide (caustic) and sodium carbonate (soda ash) can generate higher pH values than lime (calcium hydroxide) and provide 0 calcium or magnesium (the cations that make 'hardness').

often high pH waters have lower hardness values relative to alkalinity values. High hardness tends to temper the high pH caused by hydroxides and carbonates.


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## Rick (Dec 10, 2013)

Hera said:


> Update: I bought my own ph meter from the Hydroponic store and my tap measured at a whopping 10.65. I'll be adjusting down when I water now and hopefully this will stop the yellowing that I've seen in some of my paph and phrags. Thanks for all the help and info.



Have you tried aerating a sample?


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## Hera (Dec 10, 2013)

NYEric said:


> :rollhappy: 10.65!!!
> Your pipes must be calcified!! Good luck.



That's another issue altogether. We have hard water and we're on our third hot water tank since moving in fourteen years ago. Last I checked the TDS it was around 285. That was two years ago. I should invest in a TDS meter as well. 

Haven't aerated yet. Haven't had time with running the kids around.


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## gonewild (Dec 10, 2013)

Hera said:


> Update: I bought my own ph meter from the Hydroponic store and my tap measured at a whopping 10.65.



Better to use your friends meter!


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## RNCollins (Jan 17, 2014)

*TDS meter*



Hera said:


> That's another issue altogether. We have hard water and we're on our third hot water tank since moving in fourteen years ago. Last I checked the TDS it was around 285. That was two years ago. I should invest in a TDS meter as well.
> 
> Haven't aerated yet. Haven't had time with running the kids around.



Hi Hera,

I got this inexpensive TDS meter from Amazon. It seems to be pretty accurate and it has good ratings.

http://www.amazon.com/HM-Digital-TD...UTF8&qid=1389983587&sr=8-1&keywords=tds+meter

Carol


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