# cyps in pots 2014



## monocotman (Mar 21, 2014)

Hi,

first flowers this year as you would expect are from formosanum.
This was a new plant last year as a result of a swap and it arrived as two large rhizomes.
It put up just four stems last year when establishing but this year is more like it, about 13 stems with 10 flowers.

Regards,

David


----------



## eggshells (Mar 21, 2014)

Amazing. Someday I will have to try this one. I'm just trying to figure out how to cultivate this genus on pots. These wont be able to stand our winters.


----------



## Brabantia (Mar 21, 2014)

Very nice! and *the* habitual question: which substrate do you use. I need to repot two cypripedium reginae (see my today post about).


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Mar 21, 2014)

Looks great David. Mine have broken the soil as well, but are at least 2 weeks from flowering, maybe 3. 

Brabantia, this plant seems to be a bit more greedy than most species Cyps for nutrients, so I have mine in a mix of native volcanic loam, pumice, and organic matter. Does fine. In pots however I'd use a more inorganic mix and up the fertilizing.


----------



## monocotman (Mar 22, 2014)

*cyp culture*

Brabantia,

there is plenty of discussion of pot culture in the cyps in pots threads from previous years (2012 and 2013).
I grow in oversized plastic pots in almost 100% inorganics - super coarse perlite plus a bit of orchid bark.
I find reginae is a potentially a large grower and to reach a size needs plenty of feed.
Quarter rate of the usual feeds is recommended but you can go a bit higher especially in spring whne the are just beginning their growth,

Regards,

David


----------



## SlipperFan (Mar 22, 2014)

So delicate and beautiful.


----------



## Dido (Mar 23, 2014)

a great and nice one congrats 
mine will need a few days, but I think my planipetalum will be faster this year


----------



## NYEric (Mar 24, 2014)

Amazing. This year I will try Cyps in Pots indoors and outside.


----------



## monocotman (Apr 10, 2014)

*Cyp segawai*

Hi,

a lovely and diminutive species now more freely available with seed grown plants.
This one is about 6 inches high and flowering for the first time after settling down last year and producing a growth no more than 2 inches high.
No special treatment, the usual perlite compost,

Regards,

David


----------



## Dido (Apr 10, 2014)

nice one congrats


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 10, 2014)

David, is it truly that green in person, or just a trick of the photo? It is great this plant is being propagated in large numbers now since it is said to be a near ghost in the wild anymore


----------



## monocotman (Apr 11, 2014)

Tom,
the flower has only just opened and is pretty green.
It may well develop more of a yellow tone as it matures,
David


----------



## monocotman (Apr 18, 2014)

*Inge and Michael alba*

Hi,

start of the usual hybrids brings Inge and Michael alba.
Inge took a real set back 4 years ago when I repotted it and it is only just now really starting to motor. 
Probably about mid 20's growths and about half the flowers now out. Nice red margin to the lip.
Michael alba is not really alba - more 'light green'. The flowers don't fade to white over time. 
Michael is a grex that takes it's time to show it's true potential.
Early flowerings on young plants have weak stems and small flowers.
As the plant get bigger the stems strengthen and develop multiple flowers.
The final photo shows the plants growing on the north side of the greenhouse.
I'm feeding every week and watering probably twice a week. The flowers needed a bit of fleece protection from the odd frost this week.
I've spaced the pots out a bit more this year and there are more younger plants growing under the staging.
One or two suffered last year due to being overshadowed by other plants.

Regards,

David


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 19, 2014)

Awesome as always. You grow Cyps like weeds!


----------



## JPMC (Apr 19, 2014)

monocotman said:


> Hi,
> 
> start of the usual hybrids brings Inge and Michael alba.
> Inge took a real set back 4 years ago when I repotted it and it is only just now really starting to motor.
> ...



Amazingly healthy group of plants. Wish I had the room to try growing on this scale.


----------



## monocotman (Apr 23, 2014)

*this week's update*

Updates showing the last week's growth.
Since the nights warmed up at the end of last week and we lost the threat of frost the shoots have really started to move.
The 2nd photo shows 'Gabriela' and 'Sabine alba' approaching full bloom.
Between them there are somewhere around 55 flowers.
Gabriela has so many shoots that I've had to support them with thin stakes as they develop otherwise the ones on the edge run
out of room and get pushed over.
I'll remove them when the shoots are fully developed and stronger.
The last photo is the hybrid 'Ursel'. Nice smallish yellow flowers,
David


----------



## NYEric (Apr 23, 2014)

Super-nice! :smitten:


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 23, 2014)

monocotman said:


> Gabriela has so many shoots that I've had to support them with thin stakes as they develop otherwise the ones on the edge run
> out of room and get pushed over. I'll remove them when the shoots are fully developed and stronger.



I hate that when that happens :rollhappy:


----------



## Dido (Apr 25, 2014)

Nice flowers


----------



## monocotman (Apr 26, 2014)

*a couple of new ones*

Hi,

this first cyp is my new favourite.
A seedling Sabine alba flowering for the first time.
This one has all the dominant characteristics of a macranthos and not a fasciolatum.
The plant is a decent height, probably just over a foot high. 
My other Sabine clones are all shorter, although they tend to get taller as the plants mature.
However the main plus point is the flower. 
It is big, about the size of a large tibeticum, so far appears to be completely albino and looks like a huge macranthos. 
There is nothing elongated about the lip like most other clones of Sabine.
It has only just opened so may whiten over the coming days.
Second up we have fasciolatum growing well for the first time in several years.
It was repotted in 2009, didn't like the cold winter of 2010 and took several years to recover. 
Now nine growths with seven flowers and will probably need another repot next autumn,
Regards,
David


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 26, 2014)

Nice David. That Sabine alba looks very close to GPH Tom Velardi, the cross between Sabine and macranthos alba. I've never seen the flower, but Ron Burch claims it is the largest Cyp flower he has ever seen. I don't know though, I saw some huge tibeticums in Sichuan that may rival its size.


----------



## monocotman (Apr 26, 2014)

*sabine crosses*

Tom,

I'll check with Frank Schmidt about the plant.
Interesting what you say about the cross between tibeticum and Sabine -Frank has named the cross Theophanu and has seedlings available this year. However he told me that they were all 'normal' colours.
Maybe a few were white and I got lucky!
Or he made the cross both with Sabine and Sabine alba.
He's also made a similar cross - Mathilde (Sabine x macranthos var hotei) and these are also dark.

David


----------



## Erythrone (Apr 26, 2014)

wonderful plants David! And tank you for all your comments about the plants!!!!! Useful information!


----------



## Dido (Apr 26, 2014)

Great one hope mine flowers the next years too


----------



## monocotman (Apr 28, 2014)

*sabine alba?*

Tom,

I've contacted Frank Schmidt the breeder of this plant with a photo and he tells me it is definitely a Sabine alba
Apparently 50% of this cross were the usual Sabine semi alba - mainly white with a bit of colour around the inner rim of the lip where it folds into the cup.
The other 50% were true albas.
Anyway I lucked out with this one!
The flower is very much tibeticum in shape and size but a true alba and on a tall stem. 
About the best you could hope for from the cross.
I'm trying to find out a bit more about the individual plants used.
I'll post another photo when the other flower is open,

Regards,

David


----------



## monocotman (Apr 29, 2014)

*mature Gabriela and Michael*

Hi,

both these are now their best.
Gabriela has about 35 flowers and Michael a few less.
Michael has a bit less flower power than other hybrids but makes up for it with the delicate veining.
I'm not sure how big these hybrids will get before they start to go backwards.
Pixi is now up to 55 shoots.
We've left Michael Wienert's dictum of splitting when 10-15 shoots behind us a long time ago.

Regards,

David


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 29, 2014)

David,

I think you are pushing the physical limit of growing Cyps in one single clump. You do see the occasional picture of C. reginae with a hundred stems or C. parviflorum with not quite so many, but that's about it. Also, what will you grow them in (a whisky barrel?), and how will you handle them during repotting, etc. Still, it is fantastic to see how far you can push them :clap:

BTW, the macranthos parent for GPH Tom Velardi was an alba form, but the Sabine parent was the pink type.


----------



## monocotman (Apr 30, 2014)

*upper plant size*

Tom,

you may be right about plant size.
I think the limit will be when the shoots at the edge have not enough room to grow apart from sideways!
I've heard that Peter Corkhill used to grow his biggest plants in polystyrene fish crates - big and very light.
It will depend on the size of the individual shoots, there is huge variation from the tiny parviflorum hybrids like Maria to the biggest kentuckiense like Lucy Pinkepank.
The alba story is interesting as regards whether it is dominant, partially dominant or recessive.
Most of the crosses between macranthos alba and different species seem to be 'semi albas' with a few albas here and there.
This particular Sabine cross is segregating 1:1 alba : semi alba.
It seems to be almost down to individual plants at to what the outcome will be.
Eventually I'd like to cross this Sabine with one of the x ventricosum albas to produce maybe a 100% alba cross.

Regards,

David


----------



## monocotman (Apr 30, 2014)

*parents of this sabine alba cross*

Tom,

I've just heard from Frank and the fasciolatum used was a good yellow form whilst the macranthos alba was a wild collected plant from near Vladivostock.
These particular albas are tall - 40-50 cm with large flowers, close in height to the forms known as mandschuricum.
They may possibly have a bit of x ventricosum blood in them.
Most of this cross turned out to be tall like the macranthos parent.

Regards,

david


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 30, 2014)

David,

Ah, those "mandschuricum" plants indeed have hybrid blood IMO, so what exactly is in the mix with such hybrids, one can only guess. If I remember right, the plant Ron used was also of that type, not a typical macranthos alba.

Polystyrene crates do make great growing containers - they use them all the time for Cyps in Japan. They are especially good for ranging species like japonicum and formosanum.


----------



## tenman (Apr 30, 2014)

All quite amazing!


----------



## Dido (May 1, 2014)

nice flowers as usual


----------



## monocotman (May 6, 2014)

*a few more*

Hi,

three more today.
First up a mature 'normal' form of Sabine, originally from Frosch.
Next up is the true alba form of Sabine with both flowers out.
I think it is a knockout.
Lastly a nice deep coloured maranthos seedling which has the 'baikal' form as one of the parents,

Regards,

david


----------



## Dido (May 7, 2014)

nice display only can see wow


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (May 7, 2014)

Really nice. I too love the pale Sabine. That is one I just can't quite keep going here and I've tried a couple times. Great macranthos too - such lovely color!


----------



## monocotman (May 11, 2014)

*henryi, froschii and ventricosum*

Hi,

this henryi has taken a few years to take off but this year there are four large growths with a total of 13 flowers. The largest growth has four in a line.

Next up is froschii. Again it grows a bit bigger each year, another growth, larger flowers. It is still pretty short - about 4-5 inches high.

Last is ventricosum pale. A frosch plant and fairly vigorous. It is starting to produce two flowers per stem as the plant matures.

Regards,

David


----------



## Dido (May 11, 2014)

All are beautifull, 
oh well hope all mine get into such big once like yours


----------



## Erythrone (May 11, 2014)

wonderful!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (May 11, 2014)

All are wonderfully grown. Nice henryi! The froschii too is spendid - one of the nicest things about this plant is its small stature combined with those lovely big blooms. But, the ventricosum is a really great clone - I love the white flower with that splash of red-purple around the center. A real beauty!

Keep 'em coming please :clap:


----------



## Spaph (May 11, 2014)

Superb growing!!


----------



## monocotman (May 13, 2014)

*a few big un's*

Hi,

these three plants are now pretty big, the Sunny is in about a 12 inch pot which used a hold a shrub.
The two Lucy Pinkepank (kentuckiense x tibeticum) clones have huge flowers with the lips about 4 inches across. 

Regards,

David


----------



## SlipperFan (May 13, 2014)

Wow!


----------



## Spaph (May 13, 2014)

Awesome, what a display!


----------



## Dido (May 14, 2014)

really great once for sure


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (May 14, 2014)

Wow, Lucy P is just out of this world.


----------



## NYEric (May 14, 2014)

I would love to have pots like that down in the garden. thanks for sharing.


----------



## monocotman (May 19, 2014)

*a couple of successes*

Hi,

a couple that have done well this year.
First up is Pixi with about 55 growths and 30 flowers.
It continues to increase quickly each year!
The buds on the edge flower better than the ones in the middle.
Next is a large flowered tibeticum with 22 growths and 18 flowers.
About my favourite species. It increases well for a species,

Regards,

David


----------



## Leo Schordje (May 19, 2014)

Wonder, truly spectacular specimens. You really have your culture down to an art. I am venturing back into cyps this year and am giving your mostly perlite media a try. Its great that an 8 or 10 inch pot of perlite, doesn't weigh much. My biggest issue seems to be wintering the plants. Wintered outside, I always have rot issues, wintered in an unheated well house, the temps are too warm, they break dormancy too early, and spring growth is weak. I will have to rethink what I will do this coming autumn.


----------



## eggshells (May 19, 2014)

Amazing specimen! This will be my goal Someday.


----------



## Linus_Cello (May 19, 2014)

Leo Schordje said:


> Wonder, truly spectacular specimens. You really have your culture down to an art. I am venturing back into cyps this year and am giving your mostly perlite media a try. Its great that an 8 or 10 inch pot of perlite, doesn't weigh much. My biggest issue seems to be wintering the plants. Wintered outside, I always have rot issues, wintered in an unheated well house, the temps are too warm, they break dormancy too early, and spring growth is weak. I will have to rethink what I will do this coming autumn.



What do you do in the winter outside? What about wrapping the pot in a freezer bag or trash bag (or two) and burying the pot in leaves?


----------



## monocotman (May 20, 2014)

*Overwintering cyps*

Linus,
mine are left and pretty much forgotten in an unheated garage from late october until late february.
Normally it gets down to minus 5 at the lowest the pots do not freeze through.
With your much harsher winters I would have thought burying them outside would be a good idea,
David


----------



## eggshells (May 20, 2014)

David, Do you think it would be a good idea to leave it in the unheated garage. But put the pot in a cooler lined with insulation? Our winter can get to -40. Im just thinking of cultivating native cyps in pots like pubescens, and reginae for now.


----------



## monocotman (May 20, 2014)

I don't know. It depends on how good the insulation is.
Maybe a chest freezer that is beyond its useful life would also work to keep out the worst of the frost,
David


----------



## Erythrone (May 20, 2014)

eggshells said:


> David, Do you think it would be a good idea to leave it in the unheated garage. But put the pot in a cooler lined with insulation? Our winter can get to -40. Im just thinking of cultivating native cyps in pots like pubescens, and reginae for now.



It reminds me someone who tried to keep its grafted roses in pot in a shed, thinking they will be protected. The plants all died...

For hardy plants like the yellow Cyp, I suggest just to put the pots on the groud under white fabric (texcel) and a sheet of plastic. Or if you are like me, you will cover with 3 layers and add a plastic sheet...And remember snow cover is a must... This is how many nursery protect their plants in our region. 

I have many hundreds of perennials to protect each fall. Amongs them are some orchids. But remember mouses can be a disaster... They ate my Goodyera last winter....  And I did not see my Spiranthes yet


----------



## Linus_Cello (May 20, 2014)

So again, putting each pot in a freezer bag or trash bag would help protect against mice?


----------



## KyushuCalanthe (May 21, 2014)

Wow David, that tibeticum is fantastic. :clap:

Linus, I wouldn't recommend using bags outside since they could trap water and cause rot problems. I knew someone who used to plant all his cyps in beds with underground hardware cloth cages and covers. Ron Burch told me once that soil perfector keeps voles and mice from digging into outdoor beds - I guess it is just too hard to dig through for them.


----------



## labskaus (May 21, 2014)

David, your plants are outstanding, I've never seen such an excellent culture in pots before.

You're lucking, though, since you can provide good conditions in winter (cold) and your summers don't get too hot.
In winters here my Cyps would die outside (they did in my first year here) in pots, and in summer they suffer from heat. Temperatures in my cold GH are still too high, with 4-8°C in winter. I need to find another solution for the winters.


----------



## Erythrone (May 21, 2014)

Linus_Cello said:


> So again, putting each pot in a freezer bag or trash bag would help protect against mice?




For me, keeping hardy perennials in pot is much easier outdoors than in the frigde. For mice control outdoors, under "blankets", rodenticide is ann absolute necessity! And you can use "chicken wire fence" to protect valuable perennials. But I must say all my Cyps are now on the ground...


----------



## eggshells (May 21, 2014)

Erythrone said:


> It reminds me someone who tried to keep its grafted roses in pot in a shed, thinking they will be protected. The plants all died...
> 
> For hardy plants like the yellow Cyp, I suggest just to put the pots on the groud under white fabric (texcel) and a sheet of plastic. Or if you are like me, you will cover with 3 layers and add a plastic sheet...And remember snow cover is a must... This is how many nursery protect their plants in our region.
> 
> I have many hundreds of perennials to protect each fall. Amongs them are some orchids. But remember mouses can be a disaster... They ate my Goodyera last winter....  And I did not see my Spiranthes yet



OKay. I will cover in plastic and burlap in the fall. Is mulch still a must if I do this?


----------



## monocotman (May 21, 2014)

*a few more*

Hi,

thanks for the comments.
A couple more as we get towards the end of the season.
First up is Philipp.
This one was one of the first plants I bought in 2006 and when it
flowers well there is a good red picotee edge to the lip and staminode.
Next is Dietrich which has a good scent to go with the growths that usually have two flowers each.
The last photo shows the two with Pixi sitting next to the tomatoes in the greenhouse.
They are in there as we have heavy rain forecast overnight and I don't want them battered!

Regards,

David


----------



## Dido (May 21, 2014)

Great one love them
Your tibeticum and Pixi are a show


----------



## Erythrone (May 21, 2014)

If you plan to mulch the pots before covering them with burlap and plastic, no problem. The secret is to keep the plants rather dry and cool for winter. You don't want them to stay in ice sheet. Under some weather conditions, mulch can be compact, very wet and "full of ice blocks". If there is no snow cover over it, it can be very cold on the pots. Also, even hardy plants can die if they stay under ice in winter. 

I don't know a lot about your winters. I guess they are colder than ours, very windy, somewhat less snowy. Which Canadian zone is your garden?

But what I know is that you can do miracle with hardiness zone if you are careful with protection. 

You must protect the plants only after several hard frosts. Here, I do this in mid or late November. I guess early to mid Nov would be OK for you. The burlap must be dry for good insulation. Try to chose an area protected from the winds and where snow cover is good. The protection must always be light color to avoid overheating during warmer days of winter... I guess you know what I mean... That is why white is the best choice. And don't forget Mickey Mouse...


----------



## Erythrone (May 21, 2014)

monocotman said:


> Hi,
> 
> thanks for the comments.
> A couple more as we get towards the end of the season.
> ...



No pictures....:sob:


----------



## Leo Schordje (May 23, 2014)

I need to try a Lucy Pinkepank, it looks outstanding. All your Cyps are outstanding. I've had some thoughts on what to do next winter, if I have success I'll post the results. Silence, means I failed. 

Not trying to hijack this thread. 

I don't think cold alone is an issue, even for Cyps from more southern climates like Cyp kentuckiensis and Cyp californiacum. Bill Steele is a part time commercial cyp breeder in far northwestern Minnesota, zone 3. (he has had temps as low as -42 F). He winters his cyps outdoors in his large prepared beds. I believe he does use hardware cloth (mesh) to protect from rodents. He has a lot of growing info on his webpage. He too uses a mix for his pots that is mostly perlite. http://www.spanglecreeklabs.com/index.html


----------



## monocotman (May 24, 2014)

*cyp culture*

Leo - good luck with your project.
One of the thing people do not talk about much with cyps in pots of perlite is the advantage of not needing to repot much.
They do not like repotting or moving and I reckon that they take 2 years to settle down to grow quickly again.
If you overpot in perlite you can safely leave then for 5 years during which they have time to really get a head of steam and grow big,
Regards,
David


----------



## PotomacV (Oct 30, 2014)

monocotman said:


> Linus,
> mine are left and pretty much forgotten in an unheated garage from late october until late february.
> Normally it gets down to minus 5 at the lowest the pots do not freeze through.
> With your much harsher winters I would have thought burying them outside would be a good idea,
> David



Hi David,
You leave your pots in the garage for the winter. Do you water them at all between late October and late Feb? 
Marcus


----------



## monocotman (Oct 30, 2014)

*watering*

Marcus,
I don't think it matters much. Most years I don't give them anything, occasionally I do. I cannot see any difference between the two,
David


----------



## PotomacV (Oct 30, 2014)

Thanks David. If I don't water them in the winter. will the roots dry out completely?

Marcus


----------



## monocotman (Oct 31, 2014)

It depends on how big your pots ar and how long the plants have been in them.
I use big pots - mostly at least 3 litre so they dry out very slowly,
David


----------



## PotomacV (Oct 31, 2014)

I see. Thank you very much. After seeing your beautiful pictures, I bought several Cypripediums recently to give it a try. Hope I can grow mine successfully.


----------



## Linus_Cello (Oct 31, 2014)

Though I bury mine in leaves for the winter (no garage), I do put mine in garbage bags, which does help to prevent excessive drying. You might want to do that.


----------



## PotomacV (Oct 31, 2014)

Hi Linus_Cello,
I am also in DC area. You put the pots in the garbage bags and tie the bags, right? Will this prevent the air circulation for the roots? Do they need that? Is the only air inside the plastic bags enough for the whole winter?
Marcus


----------



## Linus_Cello (Oct 31, 2014)

PotomacV said:


> Hi Linus_Cello,
> I am also in DC area. You put the pots in the garbage bags and tie the bags, right? Will this prevent the air circulation for the roots? Do they need that? Is the only air inside the plastic bags enough for the whole winter?
> Marcus



I think there's enough circulation since the media is very rocky. From: http://www.gardensatposthill.com/website/Cypripedium overview.htm

In raising Cypripedium seedlings, the only difference fro tropical orchids is that Cypripedium must have winter. The easiest way to provide winter for potted plants is to make sure the medium is moist but not wet, then to place the pot into a plastic bag and into the refrigerator for 4 months (5 months is better for most Asian species except for Cypripedium formosanum which comes from a warmer climate). Make sure the pot is placed where the seedlings will not freeze and thaw. Alternatively, pots may be placed in an unheated garage or other area where temperatures will not change rapidly.


----------



## PotomacV (Nov 1, 2014)

Thank you for the information.
Marcus


----------



## Linus_Cello (Nov 3, 2014)

You're welcome.
You should come to the paph forum. Too bad you didn't go this past February, we had Ron Burch speak on cyps. I don't think next year's PF will have a cyp presenter.
http://ncos.us/ncos/paph.htm


----------



## NYEric (Nov 3, 2014)

Help!
I got 3 large Cyps and some inorganic media from [email protected] I want to put them in pots, but cannot cool the pots down in the apartment. I was going to just put them outside in the garden but now all this talk has me worried about water getting to them. Should I pot them up, water and feed once, them put them in bags outside?


----------



## Linus_Cello (Nov 3, 2014)

Depends on the Cyps. The chinese cyps need to be more dry in the winter. North American cyps are ok with more moisture.
Yes, I would pot them, water (I don't think you need to feed now), put them in a bag, and bury them in leaves.


----------



## NYEric (Nov 3, 2014)

I can't bury the pots, should I insulate (wrap) them?


----------



## Linus_Cello (Nov 3, 2014)

NYEric said:


> I can't bury the pots, should I insulate (wrap) them?



What about the community garden you use?


----------



## NYEric (Nov 3, 2014)

Hmm, OK, I will do that tomorrow.


----------

