# Pot sizes



## Stone (Oct 27, 2011)

Hi all.
Just new to this forum so please exuse if this subject has already been looked at.
It seems to me that we all want to grow the best plants possible.The largest
plants with lots of growths and flowers supported by a massive root system.
Dosen't it stand to reason that we need to find a way to pot up paphs in a 
large pot with a long lasting mix that will allow the plant a free root run without the need for disturbing the thing every year or two?
I've only been growing paphs seriously for a couple of years but I've been growing all kinds of epiphytes for 25 years and my best and biggest plants
are growing on slabs or in baskets undisturbed for 10 years or more.
I have always read to keep paphs in small pots and repot often but I'm not so convinced. Any thoughts?


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## paphioboy (Oct 27, 2011)

IMHO it does depend on what type of paph. Multifloras can be potted in large pots using a totally inorganic mix (stones, rocks, charcoal) and repotted very infrequently, but the Maudiae/barbata types which prefer a more organic mix (as they grow in leaf litter naturally) do respond better to frequent repotting using a finer organic mix (bark/cocohusk/sphagnum, what have you...)


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## Mocchaccino (Oct 27, 2011)

Larger pots for smaller Paphs -> More potting mixes -> moisture retained for a longer time -> accelerates degradation of potting mixes -> increase risk of root rot 

This is how I rationalize the reason


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## Stone (Oct 27, 2011)

Yes that makes sense, what about brachys charlsworthii etc/


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## Stone (Oct 27, 2011)

Tanaka has brachys and parvys growing in the same pot for upwards of 10 years and they're huge!


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## paworsport (Oct 28, 2011)

for roth and roth hybrid, it is important to have space to the roots. If not it will slow down the growth of the plant. So not to repot in a small pot...


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## Mocchaccino (Oct 28, 2011)

paworsport said:


> for roth and roth hybrid, it is important to have space to the roots. If not it will slow down the growth of the plant. So not to repot in a small pot...



I'm not sure if you refer to mature growths. However this might not be true in my case. I got a roth seedling, 12" wide or so, responding well and actively growing leaves in a small pot.


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## Rick (Oct 28, 2011)

Pot size has more to do with watering habits, type of potting mix, ability to repot, and nutrition.

For instance with my old high K nutrition, using CHC based media I couldn't get barbata to do well no matter how tight I eventually reppoted into . Using bark mixes with sand they did fine in 2 inch aircone pots for 2-3 growth blooming size plants.

Now with low K nutrition, I have barbata types in 6" baskets growing like crazy in sphagnum and rock mix.

Similarly I could only get multis to do well in CHC mixes with only very tight potting. A 24" span plant in a 2" basket. Now with low K I'm increasing pot size using both 8' baskets and 4" aircone pots and getting much better growth.

Using the search functions you might check out mine and Bjorns threads on basket systems.


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## Ray (Oct 29, 2011)

I don't quite grasp how the nutrition plays a role - but it apparently does - but I put more of the "weight" of the matter on the medium.

I can put stuff in large pots in S/H culture, because the LECA spreads the moisture around uniformly. If I try that with most bark-based mixes, the top and perimeter dry rapidly, but a soppy core remains in the middle of the root mass - a real problem.


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## NYEric (Oct 29, 2011)

I use a mixed media generally. Bark, coconut husk chips and a little sphagnum for a natural component, aliflor (expanded clay balls) and perlite, to keep air-spaces, rockwool cubes and diatomite to keep moisture, and charcoal to filter. I have started adding Aussie Gold to get more fines in the mix. I would like to try live moss but the effect might be bad in my apartment.


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## Rick (Oct 29, 2011)

Ray said:


> I don't quite grasp how the nutrition plays a role -



Goes back to differential retention of the various nutrients from fertilizing. The old debate on ion exchange capacity of different media.

The CHC in particular is big on retaining monovalent cations. K in particular. So if you fertilize with a standard high K fertilizer the CHC loads up faster than lots of other media.

If you use a low K fertilizer (with supplemented Ca/Mg) you can extend the age of the CHC much longer before it becomes "stale or sour". The Orchiata barks are already shot full of Ca/Mg so are inherently more resistant to impacts of high K fertilizers.

But all organic media will do this to different extent. I would suspect that the inert media used for SH are almost impervious to this effect (besides being resistant to general decomposition).


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## cnycharles (Oct 29, 2011)

NYEric said:


> I would like to try live moss but the effect might be bad in my apartment.



if anyone uses live moss that they've gathered from the woods, make sure that you kill any bugs, eggs or fungi etc that might be living in it (ouch). forest millipedes invaded one shelf when I tried to use moss for ancistrochilus


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## SlipperFan (Oct 29, 2011)

@Charles -- how do you kill the bugs, eggs and fungi without killing the moss? I've been interested in trying that, also.


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## cnycharles (Oct 29, 2011)

welllllll, I have read that you can dip orchids/plants in hot water of a certain temp, and it will kill bugs. I've read the research on the internet a while back but don't remember where it was. alternately, you could try dipping everything in hydrogen peroxide, which can be used for the same thing. testing of course to see if it kills the moss. also, ray has a product called sucrashield that is supposed to desiccate many bugs and their eggs, and another novel fungicide that works like an oil. freezing usually doesn't kill moss so you could freeze to kill bugs and hopefully eggs..

also ray has on his website/catalog a product that is likely moss spores which you can sift onto a mount or clay pot or something. I guess you could prepare a surface and grow your own moss and make sure that it doesn't get contaminated by anything. I don't know how you could prevent bacteria from being in moss you collect. maybe there is a resource somewhere online where someone mentions how to 'clean' wild-collected moss


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## SlipperFan (Oct 29, 2011)

Interesting ideas. Thanks, Charles.

I have read about that moss that Ray sells. That really is an interesting idea.


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## Ray (Oct 31, 2011)

Thanks, Rick.

Sorry for the slow response - just got power back after the freak storm.


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## Rick (Oct 31, 2011)

Ray said:


> Thanks, Rick.
> 
> just got power back after the freak storm.



How did you hold up?


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## NYEric (Oct 31, 2011)

cnycharles said:


> if anyone uses live moss that they've gathered from the woods, make sure that you kill any bugs, eggs or fungi etc that might be living in it (ouch). forest millipedes invaded one shelf when I tried to use moss for ancistrochilus



BTW, I still have that box of LIVE MOSS THAT YOU GATHERED FROM THE WOODS for me last year!!!!!!, I haven't opened it yet. oke:


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## cnycharles (Oct 31, 2011)

might want to nuke it first 

I think you can use any of that moss for 'non-live' uses if you let it dry out, wet it and then dry it out again. anything with eggs or such would probably hatch and then die. lots of people use dried non-sphagnum moss for potting, but I guess it's better to treat it


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## Stone (Oct 31, 2011)

Thanks for the feedback everyone.
Shame I'm asleep while you're all typing. Interesting to note that some are using mesh pots and the like. I've been experimenting with some 4'' mesh pots
and find that because they are drying out at least 3 times faster than usual
I can use a much finer mix inc. moss oak leaves etc and even cultivate live moss on the pot surface without worrying about the the roots not getting 
enough air. I can also water the crap out of them hence I can feed more so 
that's got to be a good thing no? At least for the leafmold eaters.


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## Rick (Oct 31, 2011)

Stone said:


> Thanks for the feedback everyone.
> Shame I'm asleep while you're all typing. Interesting to note that some are using mesh pots and the like. I've been experimenting with some 4'' mesh pots
> and find that because they are drying out at least 3 times faster than usual
> I can use a much finer mix inc. moss oak leaves etc and even cultivate live moss on the pot surface without worrying about the the roots not getting
> ...



Might check your humidity levels before getting too excited about pot types.

Low air humidity is a pretty basic stress on orchids. It should stay above 50%, and my best results are when the GH stays above 70%. At that point my mounted plants (no pots or substrate) are doing great with just a fast misting every day, and baskets stay damp for 3 or so days in a row without heavy watering.

But I'm a heavy handed watering fool, so the baskets are very forgiving of frequent watering.


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## Stone (Oct 31, 2011)

Yes Rick,Humidity is always between 50 and 70 and mist once or twice a day 
when the weather is fine


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## Ray (Nov 1, 2011)

Rick said:


> How did you hold up?



No losses.

Battery backup in the GH (heater and fans only) gave me plenty of time to get the auxiliary heater up. We managed to get through it with a space heater on our back porch.

It sure was nice to get heat and hot water, though, so we could take a shower!

(Today, the shop the "fixed" my generator is picking it up to try again...)


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