# Recycling Christmas Trees?



## cyp8472 (Dec 11, 2008)

Last spring I thought about recycling my christmas tree (fraser fir) and using it for my cyps or any woodland plants I have. The pyro in me decided to stick with tradition and burn it!:evil: Nothing like seeing a 20 ft flame from a single tree to start off the new year. I was thinking on using the needles or shredding it up and adding it to mixes. Maybe as a mulch? Compost? Anybody have thoughts on this.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 11, 2008)

I'm probably in the minority, but I shudder at the thought of killing trees to celebrate any holiday. Why not use a living tree?


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## cyp8472 (Dec 11, 2008)

Trust it kills me to cut one down but it is tradtion. It is literally the only thing I kill each year with the exception of anything that threatens my plants. That is why I want to use it to benifit my plants instead of burning it.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 11, 2008)

It was traditional to have slaves awhile back, also.


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## parvi_17 (Dec 12, 2008)

I don't see why it would hurt the plants to use the material in this way, unless there is some harmful property of Christmas trees I don't know about.

I'm not sure it is appropriate to compare trees to slavery... and anyway Christmas trees are farmed, unless you actually go out and cut one down off your property.


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## Candace (Dec 12, 2008)

If you've got a woodchipper, you could cut it up for mulch. Otherwise, in this area there are groups, that for a small donation(usually Boy Scouts) will recycle them. We used to go to a cut your own tree farm every season when the kids were small. Nice memories. Then the allergist had a conniption when he found out we got a live tree every year:< Being a mind over matter gal who doesn't want to live life in a bubble, I ignored his advice and the following year got a cut tree again. What stopped the practice is that year the live tree also brought in a couple hugely gross spiders and some trails of ants.

I bought a fake tree that same year on clearance and we are now allergy and pest free:> Nothing beats the smell of a nice 'real' tree, though.


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## NYEric (Dec 12, 2008)

If you must cut a tree for the holiday tradition, re-using the fir tree as mulch would lower the local pH; which I believe is benificial to cyps. I would much rather get a live mini-tree or one of those rosemary bushes cut into x-mas tree shape that they sell at Home Depot. 



You really are a woman after my own heart, I look forward to the day when we can meet.


SlipperFan said:


> It was traditional to have slaves awhile back, also.


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## Inverness (Dec 12, 2008)

*Christmas Trees*

From another perspective, Christmas trees are produced on farms for the express purpose of harvest with a planned replanting strategy. This really isn't any different than any other vegetable crop.

Chipping up the tree and using it as mulch is probably the best course of action. While various conifer barks are used in orchid potting mixes, tree chips are primarily wood plus green needles; not the most stable growth environment for orchids.

Ken B.


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## Candace (Dec 12, 2008)

> From another perspective, Christmas trees are produced on farms for the express purpose of harvest with a planned replanting strategy. This really isn't any different than any other vegetable crop.



I agree.


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## nikv (Dec 12, 2008)

For what it's worth, I use an artificial pre-lit tree for indoors and then I purchase a real wreath for the front door. I figure that they didn't have to cut down the tree to make the wreath; rather, it was made from the trimmings of other people's trees. Does that make any sense?


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## NYEric (Dec 12, 2008)

That wreath must look good w/ all the snow!


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## nikv (Dec 12, 2008)

^ ^
Having grown up in Minnesota, I've already fulfilled my lifetime quota of snow. I'd much rather be running around in t-shirts and shorts than deal with another white Christmas.


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## NYEric (Dec 12, 2008)

I remember when I started skiing and we all would be hyper anxious about getting some snow. Now I wouldn't care if I never saw any.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 12, 2008)

Inverness said:


> From another perspective, Christmas trees are produced on farms for the express purpose of harvest with a planned replanting strategy. This really isn't any different than any other vegetable crop.


If the trees were a crop for feeding animals or people, I might agree. But perhaps the land could be better used for more constructive purposes.


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## PaphMadMan (Dec 12, 2008)

Commercially produced Christmas trees have possibly been treated with pesticides during production, and coloring agents and flame retardants after harvest. Probably nothing that would hurt distributed as landscape mulch but I wouldn't want to concentrate it around my orchids.


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## Inverness (Dec 15, 2008)

Slipperfan, your line of thinking would seem to cast the commercial production of orchid plants in a somewhat undesirable light.

Ken B.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 15, 2008)

Inverness said:


> Slipperfan, your line of thinking would seem to cast the commercial production of orchid plants in a somewhat undesirable light.
> 
> Ken B.


Orchids aren't grown to die.


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## PaphMadMan (Dec 16, 2008)

SlipperFan said:


> Orchids aren't grown to die.



Most orchid plants sold are mass market plants in bloom or bud, and just get tossed out or die a slow death after flowering... They ARE grown to die. Just like Christmas trees and cut flowers and other florist plants, grown for temporary decoration and discarded. And Christmas tree plantations provide some wildlife habitat, often on land that isn't suitable for other crops, and with less environmental detriment. I personally don't celebrate Christmas, but the trees are at least as reasonable as any other purely decorative crop.


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## NYEric (Dec 16, 2008)

I don't know about that, I'd have to see production numbers.


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## Inverness (Dec 16, 2008)

The current largest pot plant producer of orchids in the USA is Matsui Nursery. They have over 2.5 million square feet of greenhouse space (just under sixty acres) and they've recently added an additional half million square feet. These houses contain approximately 10 million orchid plants in various phases of production. This is only one of many commercial orchid producers in the USA. Matsui's target audience are the mass marketers, not orchid hobbyists. Few (if any) of their plants are sold with labels. I'm not offering any criticism, but this is factual info. Also, according to USDA stats, orchids are the number two pot plant crop, poinsettias are number one.

Ken Brewer


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## goldenrose (Dec 16, 2008)

OMG! Interesting - where are they located? Cal? Fla?


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## Candace (Dec 16, 2008)

Rose, Matsui is here in CA.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 16, 2008)

I never said I was in favor of mass-marketing orchids, either. In fact, I think selling no-names en masse to big box stores is one of the reasons why orchid nurseries are struggling, some having gone out of business. 

A waste of land is a waste of land.


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## goldenrose (Dec 16, 2008)

Candace said:


> Rose, Matsui is here in CA.


No surprise, I still can't imagine what 60 acres of GH look like. They're only a couple hours from me.


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## Candace (Dec 16, 2008)

Your wish is my command madame. Click on the link.

http://www.matsuinursery.net/


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## goldenrose (Dec 16, 2008)

Thanks Candace - unbelievable! Now imagine trying to run/operate a place like that!


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## Candace (Dec 16, 2008)

I'd get severly lost and spend several hours trying to find my way out. Also, I don't think my one, rechargeable battery sprayer would be sufficient.

I consider daylilies, poinsettias and a variety of other plants as crops as well. I doubt many of them make it a year out of the commercial g.h.


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## Inverness (Dec 17, 2008)

For those who are interested in large greenhouse operations, here's a link. Not all are orchids, but this shows the largest in the greenhouse industry today. Notice that even for its size Matsui is 19th on the list.

http://www.greenhousegrower.com/specialreports/top100/?storyid=545

Ken B.


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## biothanasis (Dec 17, 2008)

This in Matsui is vast!!!! I cannot imagine how big the first one is!!!! Almost 4 times bigger than this in MAtsui!!! Demand is what makes them like that, right???


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## goldenrose (Dec 17, 2008)

Just send out the search party for Candace & me on the first one! Looks like we'll have to pack meals for the day!


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## NYEric (Dec 18, 2008)

What about me!?


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## goldenrose (Dec 18, 2008)

Is that for the search party? the trip? or the meals?


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## NYEric (Dec 19, 2008)

The trip and the meals!!


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## cnycharles (Dec 21, 2008)

definitely the highest percentages of orchids now are grown with the expectation that the buyer will not be able to or not be interested in keeping it alive too long after buying. of course many people would have a vague interest in their purchase staying around, but I think most of the wholesalers are not expecting the plants to stay alive. actually that would probably cut in their production/sales numbers, so they would rather they stayed alive for a decent amount of time so that if/when it dies it will be the owners fault and not the sellers fault (unfortunately I think lowes has a policy where any plant that dies in a year from purchase can be taken back for a refund. I say unfortunately because ultimately plants that get brought back give retailers an avenue to try and not pay more money to the wholesaler) tons of orchids that get brought to big stores end up in their back dumpster because many don't care for them properly or at all, and if there isn't a local orchid fanatic nearby who lurks waiting for the clearance sales then they get dumped.

there are a good number of christmas trees sold, but nothing at all like the number of orchids now grown for the pot plant industry. I've seen a good number of lucky trees in tree farms where the owner never managed to get them sold and they have grown up, but in larger farms they probably just get chipped up or the boughs sold for wreaths and things like that.


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## cnycharles (Dec 21, 2008)

goldenrose said:


> Thanks Candace - unbelievable! Now imagine trying to run/operate a place like that!



lots of automation! when our site was still part of hines horticulture they owned a site called lovell farms in florida (when hines was losing ground they sold most of the free space down there around the houses for ungodly sums of money, i think the only year they showed a profit!) that between two sites (one I think over 180 acres and the other making up the rest with some space not being under glass or plastic, maybe shade cloth only) they had over 200 acres total. our company growing consultant told us that truckloads of 25 lb bags of fertilizer would arrive pretty much every week and that many pallets would be used each day. I hate to think about how many unlucky growers would have to be spraying chemicals every day in that heat and humidity......  though better them than me)
can't even imagine the amount of water needed and the runoff


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## NYEric (Dec 22, 2008)

That's it; I'm giving up orchids!


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## cyp8472 (Dec 22, 2008)

cnycharles said:


> I think most of the wholesalers are not expecting the plants to stay alive. actually that would probably cut in their production/sales numbers, so they would rather they stayed alive for a decent amount of time so that if/when it dies it will be the owners fault and not the sellers fault (unfortunately I think lowes has a policy where any plant that dies in a year from purchase can be taken back for a refund. I say unfortunately because ultimately plants that get brought back give retailers an avenue to try and not pay more money to the wholesaler) tons of orchids that get brought to big stores end up in their back dumpster because many don't care for them properly or at all, and if there isn't a local orchid fanatic nearby who lurks waiting for the clearance sales then they get dumped.



I agree because for some one works at lowes and in charge of the greenhouse no less, I have to convice people they are not hard to take care of but on one hand I have killed tons of these orchids and almost none where I get any where else. I make sure no one leaves without getting at least a 10 min course on how to grow them from my expirence. I get people coming back for more so I must do something right. I have never thrown away an orchid from my store that wasn't completely dead and it does not happen often. I buy them when I forced to throw them away and even have other LNS from other stores call me before they throw them. I have saved so many I had to start giving them away. I also give really good deals to socity members looking. But I find interesting in the almost two years i have worked there I have sold hundreds of orchids and I can count the number of orchids that come back to our store on one hand and still have room. I have heard horror stories from others and i am trying to change it.


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## NYEric (Dec 22, 2008)

I appreciate that you educate people; hopefully some 'orchid enthusiasts' will result from your effort.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 22, 2008)

Good for you, Charles. I suspect you are quite unique in the "big box stores."


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