# Paphiopedilum Ho Chi Minh album



## Hakone (Nov 5, 2012)

First time on the paphiopedilum world , from friend ( Germany )


----------



## reivilos (Nov 5, 2012)

Hello Hakone,
Actually this is not the first time...
Hopefully mine will flower soon.


----------



## Dido (Nov 5, 2012)

reivilos said:


> Hello Hakone,
> Actually this is not the first time...
> Hopefully mine will flower soon.



If not who was the first???

Hakone so you was viisiting Popow the last days...

Are the micranthum from him too.


----------



## Hakone (Nov 5, 2012)

mine


----------



## reivilos (Nov 5, 2012)

Dido said:


> If not whio was the first???
> 
> Hakone so you was viisiting Popow the last days...
> 
> Are the micranthum from him too.



I saw a few adult ones at LCDO a few months ago - though no longer flowering.
So this may not be a world premiere.


----------



## Ozpaph (Nov 5, 2012)

looks like deli 'album'


----------



## Roth (Nov 5, 2012)

No improvement over the parents in fact, so not really worth anything...


----------



## Susie11 (Nov 5, 2012)

Cute.


----------



## wjs2nd (Nov 5, 2012)

Roth said:


> No improvement over the parents in fact, so not really worth anything...



Althought I think Roth is being very blunt (no offense). I do agree. I'm not sure I see the advantage to this hybrid.


----------



## Hakone (Nov 5, 2012)

paphiopedilum vietnamense album sill alive ?


----------



## reivilos (Nov 5, 2012)

wjs2nd said:


> Althought I think Roth is being very blunt (no offense). I do agree. I'm not sure I see the advantage to this hybrid.



Maybe it's this one alone. I was told this hybrid should come out as an improved delenatii alba. Bigger, rounder.


----------



## wjs2nd (Nov 5, 2012)

I see, thanks for clarifying. It my just need some line-breeding to bring out those traits.


----------



## busypotter (Nov 5, 2012)

Ho Chi Minh is my favorite,. in album should there be more pink tint????


----------



## NYEric (Nov 5, 2012)

No, album from both parents seem to lack color pigment. I disagree that it is not an improvement. The status of the vietnamense album [dead] proves this!


----------



## Hakone (Nov 5, 2012)

Was do you mean precisely ?


----------



## NYEric (Nov 5, 2012)

I mean the hybrid is an improvement. The fact that the hybrid has improved vigor compared to the vietnamense album (which has gone the way of the dinosaur mostly) shows this.


----------



## Hakone (Nov 5, 2012)

the question is . What I get from paph. Ho Chi Minh album selfing ?
or what about crossing paph. Ho Chi Minh album x delenatii album ?


----------



## Hakone (Nov 5, 2012)

NYEric said:


> I mean the hybrid is an improvement. The fact that the hybrid has improved vigor compared to the vietnamense album (which has gone the way of the dinosaur mostly) shows this.



you are right


----------



## NYEric (Nov 5, 2012)

Klar!


----------



## Berthold (Nov 5, 2012)

Hakone said:


> the question is . What I get from paph. Ho Chi Minh album selfing ?
> or what about crossing paph. Ho Chi Minh album x delenatii album ?



You can rebreed vietnamense album. But better is crossing of Ho Chi Minh album for that.


----------



## Roth (Nov 5, 2012)

Vietnamense album are still alive around the world, divisions from the original as well as blooming size seedlings. 

However, we feel what I always said, to keep a species 'alive' in the collection, there is a need to have wild plants nonstop, which is abnormal. Paph. vietnamense is not available from the wild in quantities anymore ( the collectors do not want to collect for very cheap), so the quantity of seedlings on the market has dropped considerably. At a time, it was so common to see seedlings offered... 

Vietnamense usually has a lifespan in culture of a couple of years, they bloom once, sometimes, but rarely twice, then they die. That's why I always said that people do not know how to grow most paph species.

As for the hybrid, there are delenatii album that are equally good, if not better even...


----------



## labskaus (Nov 6, 2012)

reivilos said:


> Maybe it's this one alone. I was told this hybrid should come out as an improved delenatii alba. Bigger, rounder.



I like this flower and I hope my seedlings will come out similar.

I agree with the "Bigger than delenatii"-goal. I want to see something that is larger than the delenatiis on the market, and something with better shape than most vietnamienses. Hybrid vigor doesn't hurt. As a bonus, the flower Hakone is showing has a very nice stem, much improved over vietnamiense.

Remember, this just one example of the cross. They may be better ones coming.


----------



## Hakone (Nov 6, 2012)

labskaus said:


> I like this flower and I hope my seedlings will come out similar.
> 
> I agree with the "Bigger than delenatii"-goal. I want to see something that is larger than the delenatiis on the market, and something with better shape than most vietnamienses. Hybrid vigor doesn't hurt. As a bonus, the flower Hakone is showing has a very nice stem, much improved over vietnamiense.
> 
> Remember, this just one example of the cross. They may be better ones coming.



Thank God I hear now a correctly , objectively superior Comment .

Thanks you very much


----------



## Erythrone (Nov 7, 2012)

Roth said:


> Vietnamense usually has a lifespan in culture of a couple of years, they bloom once, sometimes, but rarely twice, then they die. That's why I always said that people do not know how to grow most paph species.



And how can people grow this species correctly?


----------



## Drorchid (Nov 7, 2012)

Roth said:


> No improvement over the parents in fact, so not really worth anything...



I would gladly take it! And I think it IS am improvement over either parent, it has combined the best traits of both; the shape from delenatii album, and the size of vietnamense album, compared to a pure denetatii album it is probably larger in size, so that is an improvement, and compared to vietnamese (which tends to be pretty floppy in shape), the shape has improved! A winner in my opinion!

Robert


----------



## Hakone (Nov 7, 2012)

Please wait until all the seedlings bloom, then you can make a judgment.


----------



## e-spice (Nov 8, 2012)

Very nice and a well grown plant!


----------



## JeanLux (Nov 9, 2012)

Roth said:


> ...
> 
> *Vietnamense usually has a lifespan in culture of a couple of years, they bloom once, sometimes, but rarely twice, then they die*. That's why I always said that people do not know how to grow most paph species.
> 
> ...



You must be talking about vietn. album?

I got my 2 first vietn. in 2006 and they are still there, very alive, even after a serious sunburn last year! I hope to see them spiking very soon for their 5th blooming!! 

And I def. do not have the green thumb!!

Jean


----------



## Roth (Nov 9, 2012)

JeanLux said:


> You must be talking about vietn. album?
> 
> I got my 2 first vietn. in 2006 and they are still there, very alive, even after a serious sunburn last year! I hope to see them spiking very soon for their 5th blooming!!
> 
> ...



No, the normal vietnamense even... Klinge had 3000 mature plants from seeds in 2004, then another 1500 plants in 2007. Clements, about 2000 in 2006, and there were more in Germany. 

There were nearly a thousand seedlings of vietnamense album sold all around the world as well, starting in 2006, as well.

The original import of Vietnamense in Europe was about 3000 plants, in the 90's. 

All those plants are gone...

Back to the HCM album, I would be curious to know the flower size exactly. There are some excellent delenatii album as well that could well rival with that one, that's why I do not think it is really an improvement. 

Even if the size was improved, it means we will have a lot of FCCs delenatii album in the coming years too... The plants are similar to delenatii album in all respects.


----------



## Erythrone (Nov 9, 2012)

JeanLux said:


> You must be talking about vietn. album?
> 
> I got my 2 first vietn. in 2006 and they are still there, very alive, even after a serious sunburn last year! I hope to see them spiking very soon for their 5th blooming!!
> 
> ...




I remember seeing pictures of your plants and they are just gorgeous and vigourous. So there are people in the world that are able to grow P. vietnamense well!!! I think you grow then on the cool side, don't you?


----------



## JeanLux (Nov 10, 2012)

Erythrone said:


> I remember seeing pictures of your plants and they are just gorgeous and vigourous. So there are people in the world that are able to grow P. vietnamense well!!!* I think you grow then on the cool side, don't you?*



Not esp. cool Lise! Even if they are not at the warmest place in my gh (would be near the heating devices), they are growing in light shade of Catts, vandas and Phrags!! I try to keep my gh at min. 15 Celsius during winter; in summer I get up to 35 Celsius  !!! 

And as already written in my vietn. threads I find them very, very forgiving ! One is in low spike now, another one looks like coming up with several spikes ; they should hurry up because last year they bloomed in december!

Jean


----------



## Hakone (Nov 10, 2012)

My photo shows the only Paph. HCM album blooming the first time on the world. I hope that we can distinguish between HCM album and delenatii album .


----------



## Erythrone (Nov 10, 2012)

JeanLux said:


> Not esp. cool Lise! Even if they are not at the warmest place in my gh (would be near the heating devices), they are growing in light shade of Catts, vandas and Phrags!! I try to keep my gh at min. 15 Celsius during winter; in summer I get up to 35 Celsius  !!!
> 
> And as already written in my vietn. threads I find them very, very forgiving ! One is in low spike now, another one looks like coming up with several spikes ; they should hurry up because last year they bloomed in december!
> 
> Jean



Merci, Jean!

Since many grower seems to grow all there Paphs at a min of 18 even in winter, I wonder if this is what makes de the difference.


----------

