# Paph. hainanense



## abax (Aug 26, 2013)

I just received this plant in low bud and it's a lovely two growth plant, however, it's potted in Aussie Gold. The medium retains far too much
moisture in my greenhouse and I'm afraid the bud is going to blast. Would
it be a terrible thing to repot into the medium I normally use and a clay
pot? This is a replacement plant for one that arrived from the same vendor
also in AG and only had two rotted roots. I'm actually afraid to pull it out
of the plastic pot because I think I might find rotted roots again.


----------



## Trithor (Aug 26, 2013)

I have a firm rule, all new plants are re-potted into my growing mix before I move them into the greenhouse. If the plant is in advanced bud, I may move it into the house to enjoy the bloom before I re-pot it. I re-pot all plants for a number of reasons, 
It gives me an opportunity to inspect the whole plant, and if roots are few I place it in an area that has lower light, less water and good air circulation for a month or so, then I move it into general population.
I am sure that this is how slugs get into my greenhouse. (this is not an accusation of commercials)
I have had a number of sad experiences where the mix was not suitable for my watering schedule and I lost the plants. I find it difficult to treat a plant individually once it is mixed in to the greenhouse population, so in my opinion, better safe than sorry, besides in by far the majority of cases the bud continues to develop unhindered by the re-potting process.


----------



## SlipperFan (Aug 26, 2013)

I agree -- low bud should not be a problem for re-potting.


----------



## Eric Muehlbauer (Aug 26, 2013)

Especially with paphs, I always think bare-root shipping is the best. Saves the grower a little in packing and shipping costs, and alerts them to any problems with the roots. I usually repot paphs after I receive them, and it would certainly make things simpler to just pot them up when they arrive.


----------



## abax (Aug 26, 2013)

I usually do repot immediately, but am a bit worried about the bud. I think
I'll take your advice and repot. The first one that had rotted roots is settling in well in Orchiata and a clay pot. Perhaps the replacement will
too. I truly dislike Aussie Gold and don't understand its use for Paphs.


----------



## Gcroz (Sep 2, 2013)

I was the vendor to which Abax has cast their comments. I freely admit that. I will add, to this thread, that mediums are often a matter of personal preference. Despite many comments on this board, I have had tremendous success with that medium (look at my photo postings). Of late I have found Aussie Gold's product control to be very poor, hence my switch to Orchiata. As to comments regarding "bare root" shipping, I, personally, have received far to many plants with broken off root systems, thus i do not like that. I will also add that I am able and willing willing to do so at the request of the purchaser.

I will add, that Abax received a plant, in spike, at no charge to them after their initial plant arrived in less than acceptable condition. I continue to stand by my plants! I mean no hostility or disrespect to Abax, they have been more than honest with me and I hope they feel i have been honest with them. I will state that I'm stating all this in response to what consider to be an air of hostility to vendors on this site.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 2, 2013)

I disagree with your last comment. I don't think as a community this forum has been hostile to vendors. Occasionally someone may have had an unrealistic expectation but I think flaming vendors has been avoided here.


----------



## Gcroz (Sep 2, 2013)

NYEric said:


> I disagree with your last comment. I don't think as a community this forum has been hostile to vendors. Occasionally someone may have had an unrealistic expectation but I think flaming vendors has been avoided here.



Eric, I state that as my opinion. I base that on negative posts I have seen over the years on this board. As I stated, this particular buyer was a joy to work with, and we always stand by or plants. 

That being said, there has been many "hostile" words against vendors, regarding pricing, potting, maturity, etc. of plants. I sell on eBay, and live in fear of comments from this board, even when I'm trying to sell my best. Just ask Heather!


----------



## abax (Sep 2, 2013)

GCroz, I never referred to you by name. I was slambasting Aussie Gold
actually. Let me say here that the TWO plants I received were beautiful
little plants and one would never know that the roots were a bit lacking by
looking at the top growth of the plants. The bud on the replacement did
blast, but I feel it was my fault for not repotting into a more suitable
medium for my greenhouse conditions. I think both shipping and packing
were excellent and communication extremely friendly and responsive. Both plants are now in Orchiata and doing very well...developing new
roots quickly.

I hope all is well with your family GCroz.


----------



## Gcroz (Sep 3, 2013)

abax said:


> GCroz, I never referred to you by name. I was slambasting Aussie Gold
> actually. Let me say here that the TWO plants I received were beautiful
> little plants and one would never know that the roots were a bit lacking by
> looking at the top growth of the plants. The bud on the replacement did
> ...




I hope you understand that I chose to admit that I was the vendor, by my own free will. I wanted to make sure that anyone that purchased from us in the future would understand that we stand by our plants. If there is an issue, we want to make sure that everyone goes away happy from the transaction. Abax, we chose to "out" ourselves, you were a joy to transact with. We just felt that we would prefer to be known by our service, not by hiding. We hope you understand.


----------



## abax (Sep 3, 2013)

I most emphatically do understand and we will do business again.

I do want to repeat that I am so sorry about your grandmother. I never
knew my paternal grandparents who were killed in German concentration
camps and I think you are so fortunate to have had time with such an
accomplished woman.


----------



## Trithor (Sep 3, 2013)

I must say, that I don't think there is an air of hostility towards vendors on this site at all. It is easy to perceive hostility when people are very passionate about their hobby/interest. Often there are unrealistic expectations. I have often received plants in less than perfect condition, but I accept that posting plants around the world is a less than ideal way of moving them. I repot any plant that I receive, not because I don't trust the vendor, but because I firmly believe that it is better to have all your plants in a mix which suits your own watering and feeding. Some years ago I had a disaster with a batch of plants that were potted in 'rockwool'. It was not immediately apparent that they were in that medium at all, and I had a large number of other plants that I had collected at the same time. I just added them to the collection and thought nothing of it until I noticed that some plants were not happy. Unfortunately by that time they were too far gone to save. I have also had pests and weeds introduced in unclean medium (please don't take that as hostility. I fully understand that in a large production facility it is not always possible to examine every single plant, and also not all suppliers are the same. Simple reality) I have also found that some plants arrive with few roots, weather it is a function of how the vendor grows, or just the luck of the draw is beside the point, and it does not worry me too much unless there are no roots at all. If you unpot the plant, find the plant to have few roots, it is possible to treat the plant a bit differently till it sets better roots, and then move it into general prison population. However if you are unaware of the situation, the stress of mailing the plant, a change in growing conditions and treatment, and in some cases a change in hemisphere can be too much for the plant (much easier to save yourself the trouble and heartache and simply toss it on the compost heap on arrival.
I think it is important to realise that often people save up, shop around and then look forward to the arrival of the new 'love'. Interpretation of size and condition can become an emotive issue, especially if the plant is not as dreamed. Added to that situation is the misinterpretation of an intended observation on a problem, often made worse by the fact that this forum is international and English is not everyones first language.
(just a few thoughts, or not, from the forums resident clown)


----------



## Cheyenne (Sep 3, 2013)

Couldn't of said it better myself. I agree on all points.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 3, 2013)

Gcroz said:


> Eric, I state that as my opinion. .. I sell on eBay, and live in fear of comments from this board, even when I'm trying to sell my best. Just ask Heather!



Fear us!!!


----------



## John M (Sep 3, 2013)

NYEric said:


> Fear us!!!



'Guess you're not ever planning to buy anything from Gcroz?


----------



## Trithor (Sep 4, 2013)

John M said:


> 'Guess you're not ever planning to buy anything from Gcroz?



:rollhappy:
Reading Eric's comment in light of most of his comments, he is stirring with typical Eric humour, not so?


----------



## John M (Sep 4, 2013)

Trithor said:


> :rollhappy:
> Reading Eric's comment in light of most of his comments, he is stirring with typical Eric humour, not so?



Yes, probably so....if you can call that humour. I guess I just sympathise with Gcroz when it comes to his serious concern for his business reputation.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 4, 2013)

John M said:


> Yes, probably so....if you can call that humour. I guess I just sympathise with Gcroz when it comes to his serious concern for his business reputation.


I make plant deals with everyone, similar to what I offered you. Yes, it was humor; and as noted the original post did not mention the vendor only the difficulty with a certain media.


----------



## John M (Sep 4, 2013)

NYEric said:


> I make plant deals with everyone, similar to what I offered you. *What deal? When have you and I ever talked about a plant deal?* Yes, it was humor; and as noted the original post did not mention the vendor only the difficulty with a certain media. *So what? I don't understand your point. Your "Fear Us" comment was directed at Gcroz, personally....and he had just explained to us that he does worry about the way his reputation is affected and the potential damage that can be done by ST members. So, you think adding salt to a wound is humour. Personally, I don't think it's funny. In my view, which I am entitled to, jokes that poke at a sensitive subject for someone, are not humour; they're just mean-spirited. Although, knowing your sense of humour, I understand you probably didn't mean it that way. I know that you're not a mean person. Nevertheless, what you said could be misinterpreted by somebody with a particular sensitivity and if you push the "right" button, you could find yourself being rejected if you ever want to be a customer. Sometimes, as a vendor, I'd rather not deal with someone who delights in poking fun at me and/or pushing my buttons.
> 
> It would've been a lot nicer if instead of (humorously?), threatening Gcroz with future damage to his reputation ("Fear Us!"), you'd instead made a positive comment, expressed appreciation that he posted and that it's good to know he stands behind his plants because we like to support conscientious vendors like him.*


..


----------



## Gcroz (Sep 4, 2013)

John M, I certainly appreciate your comments and concerns. Due to recent events in my life, my time is very limited and I haven't really had a chance to respond to this thread. 

I did not take NYEric's comments in any way other than the way I perceive they were offered- a humorous and good natured poke at me. I certainly do worry about my business reputation and I was very concerned when Abax's first plant arrived with rotted roots. I took the corrective measures I felt necessary in order to do right by the customer, and took steps to decrease the chances of a repeat. On a side note, I have seen that the rest of the Paph. hainanense plants have nice new roots coming along!

I worry about comments on this site, or any orchid related forum, because the internet is the 21st century version of the bathroom wall. There is little, if any, filter, and little if any chance of negative comments ever being forgotten. Think of how hard it is to test the veracity of comments made online? Think of how many mean spirited, and or bored people, delight in destroying others online. I think, and hope, everyone can see my point.

I love this forum, will continue to post here. I'll probably continue to make myself look like an ass on occasion as well. But, I feel that admitting that Abax's problem plant came from us was the right thing to do.

Abax, how is the second plant? Have you had a chance to look at the roots yet?


----------



## Gcroz (Sep 4, 2013)

Oh, and btw, I'm happy to do business with NYEric anytime. Especially if he's making another Canada run


----------



## Eric Muehlbauer (Sep 4, 2013)

FWIW, I was very happy with the plants I purchased from GCroz. I also repotted, once temperatures cooled down...but all roots were healthy, and it looks like my Magic Lantern is spiking.


----------



## abax (Sep 4, 2013)

Oh yeah, both plants are sending out new roots rather quickly. I love, love,
love the foliage...just beautiful. In passing, I think you'll be glad you
are trying Orchiata. I've been using it about a year and have seen a great
deal of improvement in my Paphs. in very humid conditions.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 4, 2013)

Dear John.and Gary. I did not mean anything personally. I cannot speak for us it was just a saying, no threat intended. . BTW, I'm not going to flame you but please remember the plant offers I made to you after the fire.. Nuff said.


----------



## John M (Sep 4, 2013)

Hi Eric,

My original comment was not meant to be taken as such a heavy slap on you. I seem to have been a bit misunderstood....as I was only commenting that you might be misunderstood too. I posted because it just crossed my mind that poking at a person's vulnerability, even in jest, might be misinterpreted. That's all. 

I never had a fire. I had a freeze over 5 years ago. I have kept records of everyone who rallied and made a donation of plants or cash and your name is not there. I also re-read the thread that Heather started at the time and while you did post, I see no post from you about a plant deal being offered. Maybe it was in a p.m? However, I know that I did not turn down any donations; so, could you please explain what you are refering to? I'm sorry that I don't remember anything about it. A lot of water has passed under the bridge since then and my mind is occupied with a lot of new worries and concerns.


----------



## Trithor (Sep 5, 2013)

Wow, did this ever spin out of control! Please remind me never to get involved in a thread like this again! I have reread all the comments and cannot comprehend how things got so tense, as I don't think any comments made were intended in a nasty way. It saddens me incredibly.
Eric, I really don't believe you intended your comment to have been taken quite as literally as it was (I certainly never expected the result)


----------



## John M (Sep 5, 2013)

Gary. Don't be sad. It happens. It's one of the problems with communicating via text only....and not being able to hear inflections in one's voice or see body language. It's been reported that about 80% of communication is done via body language. We are at a disadvantage in that regard on the forum. I think that we're still all good. No worries.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 5, 2013)

You're right I meant freeze. I offered you some phrags and you refused due to paperwork issues. Not for no reason. No big deal.


----------



## John M (Sep 6, 2013)

NYEric said:


> You're right I meant freeze. I offered you some phrags and you refused due to paperwork issues. Not for no reason. No big deal.



With more time to think and your confirmation above, the memory is coming back; but, it's a bit fuzzy. It involved seedlings, didn't it.... buying flasks from Chuck and/or Tom and sharing the seedlings; or, something similar to that? I can't remember the details. Sorry. 

Anyway....of course, it was nice of you to try and think of a way to help me acquire some replacement plants.....and it was too bad that the utter impossibility of getting a CITES export permit immediately nixed that idea in the bud.

BTW: The word "refuse" implies that I didn't want any plants, which of course, isn't really true. I didn't refuse; I declined the offer to go that route.

But, I am still wondering why you even brought it up now? It seems out of place in the context of this discussion. Why did you ask me: "BTW, I'm not going to flame you but please remember the plant offers I made to you after the fire.. Nuff said." The term "Nuff said" indicates that you're irritated with me; presumably over the fact that I didn't enjoy or understand your (humorous), dig at Gcroz. Well, sorry about that; but, why drag up a deal that never happened from 5 years ago, in a defensive way - against my gentle criticism of your devilish crack at Gcroz?


----------

