# Are judges required to award?



## PHRAG (Jun 8, 2006)

Are judges required to award a plant at an event they judge? I was just wondering if there was ever a show, or judging event where judges couldn't agree or didn't see any plants worthy of award?


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## likespaphs (Jun 8, 2006)

as far as i know, the answer to that is no. they are only required to award when a plant meets the requirements.


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## Jmoney (Jun 8, 2006)

If it's "best in show" ribbon stuff, then I think they usually come up with something. I guess it would be hard to award "best paph" if no paphs were exhibited though.

AOS quality awards are done by merit (supposedly). If someone brings in a truckload of top quality plants I suppose they should all get awarded, although I imagine the judges would be more than little peeved at the extra work. poke poke.


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## Heather (Jun 8, 2006)

I sure hope so! :rollhappy: 

(Phrag knows I am trying to get his goat. baaaaaaaa.....) 
Just kidding!


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## PHRAG (Jun 8, 2006)

In your case Heather, I should start trying to bribe them to pass over your plants.


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## likespaphs (Jun 9, 2006)

oh, right...didn't think before posting. i'd like to claim it's a first, but...

show judges will always award plants (or so it seems). they may be 'required' to award a best in show and whatnot
aos judges, however, feel no such requirement
(at least, that's what i've infered....)


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## Rick (Jun 9, 2006)

There is no requirement to give either AOS awards or ribbon awards at an AOS sanctioned show.

But it is extremely unlikely that this will ever happen.

I recently went to a show in Alabama where only 3 AOS awards were given and none were the quality awards (AM, HCC, FCC).

There were tons of ribbon awards, but I have often seen the phenomena when although there are sufficient plants in a class to give a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd place not all places were awarded. You can feel good about a ribbon award even if your plant is the only one in its class. They are not given out by default.

If you show plants I suggest that you volunteer to clerk. You learn allot about judging that way.


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## littlefrog (Jun 9, 2006)

PHRAG said:


> Are judges required to award a plant at an event they judge? I was just wondering if there was ever a show, or judging event where judges couldn't agree or didn't see any plants worthy of award?



Happens on occasion. It should probably happen more frequently. A lot of the questionable awards I have gotten (I wouldn't have awarded them...) have been at very small shows. 

I have certainly been on teams that didn't award anything at a judging session. That happens all the time. And I've been to plenty of shows where I saw nothing worthy of pulling out of an exhibit for AOS judging.


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## British Bulldog (Jun 11, 2006)

*Judging*

I tried to answer a similar question once on the "other" forum and was told I was being to commercial????????????
As the longest serving RHS judge( I joined in 1971) and having judged with many different centers around the world, I can honestly say that, yes I have seen centers not award anything. 
I have seen plants given awards for the sake of having something being awarded and yes I have seen deadlock where disagreement was total.
No one is perfect. We all make mistakes(errors!!)
Judging is an extremely personal thing, of course no one judge is an expert in all genera. In my opinion there lies the problem.
Paul


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## WolfDog1 (C. Williams) (Oct 16, 2006)

*AOS awards - or NOT*

I have been to several shows where ZERO AOS awards were granted. Maybe here in the Northwest the judges are just really hard on the plants, or maybe the plants were just not good enough. I'm still pretty new to it all, and I think that ALL of my plants deserve awards, I have yet to garner an AOS quality award. I can think of 3 shows last year that I went to and no AOS awards were given.......lots of ribbons though.


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## slippertalker (Oct 16, 2006)

Usually there are awards at shows unless the plant count is low. The problem these days is that there are a lot of mericlones and mass produced plants that are exhibited. Many of them either have awards or have been screened many times previously. 
The days of large orchid companies with diverse breeding programs seems to be diminishing, and this will limit some awards. Of course the most popular genera of phalaenopsis, paphiopedilums, phragmipediums and cattleyas will continue to be bred especially by specialists.
Once plants have reached a certain level of excellence, it is difficult for them to improve. White phals or cats have reached this level, and we rarely see awards for them. 
On the other hand, red and yellow phals, red phrags, miniature cats,and paph species continue to improve........


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## Rick (Oct 16, 2006)

WolfDog1 said:


> I have been to several shows where ZERO AOS awards were granted. Maybe here in the Northwest the judges are just really hard on the plants, or maybe the plants were just not good enough. I'm still pretty new to it all, and I think that ALL of my plants deserve awards, I have yet to garner an AOS quality award. I can think of 3 shows last year that I went to and no AOS awards were given.......lots of ribbons though.



It can be a major uphill battle to get quality awards for the groups with lots of award history (paphs, phals and catts). I think its a great perspective to go through the old Awards Quarterly, or Wildcatt database to see what has been given in the past to the plants you are interested in.


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## Heather (Oct 16, 2006)

It's definitely a learning experience, as Rick said. You guys know I'm working on my ongoing database project and trying to break out the wildcatt data into pdfs for each of the plants I own. If anyone wants copies let me know. In the process, I'm ending up reading the data. Some plants, it's remarkable how many awards have been given over the years. 79 pages of St. Swithin to go edit. 

BTW - you judges out there need to learn how to spell. Or at least the editor of AQ needs to learn how to edit! SOOOOO many typos!


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## SlipperFan (Oct 16, 2006)

Hey, Paul -- welcome back!


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## Bolero (Oct 17, 2006)

*Judging*

I've been a student judge for just over 3 years (2 years to go) and it's not unusual for there to be no awards at a show. There doesn't have to be any plants awarded.

Often the best in show or runner up or whatever have actually already been awarded something in the past so they don't always revisit awarding the plant unless it seems much better than the last time (for instance taking a plant from HCC to AM).

We do look for exceptional plants though and I sometimes wished that we weren't so hard on some of them.

;-)


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## slippertalker (Oct 17, 2006)

Heather said:


> It's definitely a learning experience, as Rick said. You guys know I'm working on my ongoing database project and trying to break out the wildcatt data into pdfs for each of the plants I own. If anyone wants copies let me know. In the process, I'm ending up reading the data. Some plants, it's remarkable how many awards have been given over the years. 79 pages of St. Swithin to go edit.
> 
> BTW - you judges out there need to learn how to spell. Or at least the editor of AQ needs to learn how to edit! SOOOOO many typos!


\

Heather, 

I'm sure they would appreciate your help! Some people have a better eye for this than others........


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## WolfDog1 (C. Williams) (Oct 21, 2006)

I have found the whole judging process very interesting. I have been to several judges meetings in my area and the plants are always different. I've also sat in on some of the judging at shows I've been to. 

It's very interesting to me to see how the judges go about scoring the different plants/flowers. The times I've been present, there has been a pretty high level of concensus on the plants being scored. It's also nice to hear the comments the judges make about the plants. 

I've learned a lot simply by being present and interacting with the AOS judges that I have met. I have a lot of respect for the time and energy they have put in to not only becoming a judge, but staying current as well. I would say that the level of commitment it takes is commendable.


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