# Halloween Orchid



## Drorchid (Oct 31, 2006)

This morning I noticed a cool orchid in bloom here in the greenhouse that I have never seen bloom before. It reminded me of some creepy insect/centipede with legs that was about ready to jump on you. The flowers are pretty big; about 4 inches across, and 7 inches from side to side.

The name of the species is Aeranthes henricii. It is native to Madagascar.






















Enjoy and Happy Halloween!


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

Do you have these for sale?


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## Heather (Oct 31, 2006)

I will take that over a creepy centipede ANY day!


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## Drorchid (Oct 31, 2006)

No unfortunately we do not have any for sale yet, but I will make a sib cross, as there is another plant coming into bloom; so hopefully we will have some babies in the future.

Robert


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

So very fitting, that for Halloween, you trick us with a photo of a cool plant we can't have yet.


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## Drorchid (Oct 31, 2006)

Yep it was a trick....., but in a few years from now it will be a treat.....

Robert


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## paphjoint (Oct 31, 2006)

Very nice creepy orchid -


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## NYEric (Oct 31, 2006)

Does it have night/fragrance?


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## Drorchid (Oct 31, 2006)

I am not sure, I am guessing it does....I guess I will have to stay overnight here to smell it....

Robert


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## silence882 (Oct 31, 2006)

Very cool! (and I don't often say that for a non-slipper)

The flower definitely has a Jack-O'-Lantern look to it.

--Stephen


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

Does anyone else see a green moth shape in the lip of this orchid? Would it be a stretch to think this plant might be pollenated when a moth tries to land on/mate with what it thinks is another moth? Totally talking out of my range of knowledge here.

In this photo the shape is most obvious to me...


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## Drorchid (Oct 31, 2006)

Yes from that picture the lip does resemble a green moth but my guess would be that the moth would go more after the nectar in the spur. I am guessing the moth that pollinated this flower has a very long proboscis (tong) that will fit in the long spur. I am not sure if this orchid has nectar there or not, sometimes orchid flowers mimic other flowers and fool the insect in thinking it has food, but at the same time the insect will still pollinate the flower. Most of these white/green Aeranthes/Angraecum species are moth pollinated and have white or green flowers that are fragrant at night to attract their pollinators. I don't think their lips are supposed to resemble the pollinator.

Robert


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

So it's just a really well shaped landing pad.


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## kentuckiense (Oct 31, 2006)

PHRAG said:


> So it's just a really well shaped landing pad.



Yup! It really fits the bill of being moth pollinated.

1. strong scent (I'm guessing)
2. long nectary
3. white (moths tend to be nocturnal)

Think about virtually all Angraecums, Florida's ghost orchid, etc.


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## Heather (Oct 31, 2006)

These are some of my favorite plants for pollinator stories.


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## SlipperFan (Oct 31, 2006)

Interesting plant. And thread.


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

I was looking for proof of my hair-brained theory and stumbled across a neat slideshow of Madagascar. Orchids in situ are so cool. You might recognize the plant in the first photo...

http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2064364600083306767PKCxgD


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## Heather (Oct 31, 2006)

Hey! Where's the superimposed moth photo??? I'm waiting....


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

I am working on it secretly. Better to be thought crazy, than open your mouth and remove all doubt.

:crazy:


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## Heather (Oct 31, 2006)

Well, you know who to share it with.


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## Rick (Oct 31, 2006)

PHRAG said:


> So it's just a really well shaped landing pad.



It's hard to say if the moth would even land on it.

The moths that drink pollen and are responsible for pollenating angrecums are sphinx or hawk moths. They tend to stay in flight during feeding and hover like hummingbirds in front of the flower.


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## PHRAG (Oct 31, 2006)

Somebody want to fund a research trip to Madagascar so we can see if a moth lands on this bad boy? Will also need a night vision camera and a five gallon bucket of DEET. 

Email me if interested.


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## Greenpaph (Oct 31, 2006)

I love it!

thanks


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## Drorchid (Nov 1, 2006)

I am in for it. It sounds like an interesting project....and I have always wanted to go to Madagascar!

Robert


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## streetmorrisart (Nov 1, 2006)

I have too! Word has it we'd all better get there quickly though. Their forests are disappearing in a hurry...very sad. That place is in a bad way from the recent explosion of HIV/AIDS as well. 

The henricii is spectacular, Robert. I love Aeranthes (all Angraecoids in fact)--I only have a little imerinensis so far...when I was choosing which of the genus to start with I read in a number of places that henricii is kind of a b to grow, especially when it's small. Your plant makes me want to take the challenge more than ever though!

In my little black and white Fred Hillerman book, the members of this genus are listed as having no night scent, but I’ve noticed that some of the other angraecoids he mentions have none do. I have to imagine he saw a pretty sizeable sampling of each species by the time he wrote that book, so that makes it even more weird. I feel like a moron suggesting that he could be mistaken given his level of expertise in the area, but it’s hard to imagine that flower isn’t night-fragrant for all the reasons everyone has already cited. Here’s a link to the book in question in case anyone’s interested; if you like Aeranthes, Angraecum, Aerangis, it’s a must (especially for the price—I picked mine up used for even less):

http://www.hoosierorchid.com/category.asp?sku=b5


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## NYEric (Nov 1, 2006)

*Research*

Ummm.. Didn't Darwin do this?


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## Drorchid (Nov 1, 2006)

Darwin speculated that Angraecum sesquipedale got pollinated by a moth with a very long proboscis (tong) that had the same length as the spur of the sesquipedale flower. Years later the pollinator of the A. sesquipedale got discovered.....and it was a moth with a very long proboscis so Darwin was right.

In this research we want to find out if the moth actually lands on the lip and perhaps tries to mate with it, or if if just hovers like a hummingbird and tries to suck up the nectar...

Robert


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## NYEric (Nov 1, 2006)

*Observation*

You know, it really does look like a moth. Madagascar must be the most wonderfull place, distinct mammals, day geckos, chamelions, orchids, etc. It's too bad someone hasn't help the population to develope more economic growth from understanding and propagating the native flora/fauna.


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## Shadow (Nov 2, 2006)

Very nice unusual looking flowers!


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## Park Bear (Nov 2, 2006)

great looking orchid


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## Shadow (Nov 2, 2006)

Here are some pictures
http://www.orchids.mu/Species/Angraecum/Images/Xanthopan_morgani_praedicta_180_1.jpg

http://perso.orange.fr/cryptozoo/dossiers/xanthopan.jpg

It looks like sometimes it sits on the lip, sometimes no. Can somebody read this article? http://perso.orange.fr/cryptozoo/dossiers/papillon.htm


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## Rick (Nov 2, 2006)

There's an article in the new OD by Joyce Stewart on Aerangis sp.

There are a couple of paragraphs on moth pollination:

The two moth families that like Aerangis are Noctuidae and Sphingidae (hawkmoths). The Noctuidae prefer to sit on the lip and feed, while the hawkmoths prefer to feed while hovering.

It could well be that our Holloween orchid helps out a Noctuidae moth??


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## PHRAG (Nov 3, 2006)

Ok, be patient with me. I am learning and will probably end up embarassing myself by posting this, but here it goes... 

I understand that it is probably the scent of the nectary that attracts the moth to the orchid. But now we know that there are moths in the family that pollenate these orchids that do land on the orchid to feed. The moth that pollenates the Angraecum sesquipedale hovers, because it has a super long nectary to navigate with its super long probiscus. If you look at the photo above of this moth feeding, you will notice that the nectary of sesquipedale appears to be a straight tube. The nectary of the Aeranthes we are discussing does not. Look at this photo...







You will notice that there are two "pouches" on the nectary of the Aeranthes. I want to assert that the moth that pollenates this flower lands to feed, and these pouches have evolved to allow the moth to unfurl it's probiscus after landing. The nectary on the Aeranthes appears to be not nearly as long as the nectary on Ang. sesquipedale, so the moth probably has a much shorter probiscus.

Now, if this is true, and the moth does land to feed, and the pouches do allow the moth room to navigate a medium to small probiscus, then I have the following question to answer. Why is the lip shaped like a moth? I just did an image search on google for the Noctuidae moth, and found photos and drawings of these moths. The one thing I noticed is that the shape of the wing of most of these moths is almost exactly the same shape as the edge of the lip on this orchid. I can mock up a photoshop image that shows this if you want, but I don't think it's necessary. It is very obvious to me that the lip is shaped just like a moth. It even has "fringe" on the edge of the lip, just like most moths have fringe on the edge of their wing. 

So why is the lip shaped like a moth? Evolution shows us that plants have "changed" color to match their environment after plants that stood out were eaten by foraging animals. Lithops taught me that. The plants that were the wrong color were eaten, therefore the plants that were well hidden passed along their color to the next generation. 

Is it so unbelievable to think that this orchid might have a lip shaped like a moth, because over time the plants that had a lip shaped more like a moth were pollenated, and the plants with a lip not shaped like a moth were not pollenated? Why would a moth be more likely to pollenate a plant that had a lip shaped like a moth? The only theory I can come up with is that there must be a predator that is less likely to find a moth when it is settled on a plant that mimics it's shape. 

I may be way off base here, overthinking the process of evolution. But every bit of information I find out about moths, Aeranthes, Madagascar and evolution brings up more questions. Now I really want one of these plants. : )


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## PHRAG (Nov 3, 2006)

More than this even, the Aeranthes seems to be shaped as a kind of refuge for a moth to land in. The petals hang over and form a bit of a cave. As much as Robert noted that the plant looks like an alien bug, I notice that this shape is very agressive in shielding the area near the opening to the nectary. Just what I see anyway.


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## PHRAG (Nov 3, 2006)

Ok, after discussing this with Zach some more and being enlightened by some evolutionary theory, here is my new idea...

The moth that feeds on this plant could have switched from hovering to landing on the lip to avoid predation, possibly by bats. Over time, the plants with larger lips were more successfully pollenated, because the moth had an easier time landing. Eventually, the lip evolved into a moth shaped landing pad with upturned edges to make the most attractive spot for moth pollenators. The nectary evolved in much the same way. As moths began landing, the wider nectary was easier to feed on, and thus more attractive to the moth. Over time, the chamber formed on the nectary to give the moth room to unfurl the probiscis without trouble.

Now, if I could only go to Madagascar to see pollination in real life and prove that this theory is correct. I would just have to be careful not to get struck in the head by a bat.


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## Heather (Nov 3, 2006)

PHRAG said:


> I would just have to be careful not to get struck in the head by a bat.



:rollhappy:

(I'm sorry. I cannot help it!)


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## PHRAG (Nov 3, 2006)

You laugh because secretly you want to see me get hit in the head by a bat.


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## NYEric (Nov 3, 2006)

Maybe it's just me but I'm confused Is the "super long probiscus" for feeding, or is the leave shaped like another moth for mating, or is the moth hiding, or ??? By the way, in NY we call it a bat massage.


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## Shadow (Nov 3, 2006)

It looks like we have the second Darvin here. :clap:


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## Rick (Nov 3, 2006)

I think you also need to consider what a moth actually sees, and smells. You have allot more visual acuity than a moth, so the flower or lip may actually look allot more like a moth to you than to a moth. This may be especially true at night when it probably just sees the white parts. The moth is most likely lured to the flower initially by scent, and the visual component of the flower may look like no more than a target or tunnel. The petals may be aranged to help center the moth and provide tactile guidance as it trys to climb into the tunnel.

It would be very cool to get this on film. The first time footage of the comet orchid pollination used motion detectors around the flower to sense the incoming moth to trigger the video camera.


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