# Kimchee or ick-ee?



## cnycharles (Dec 24, 2016)

A few months ago i saw a foodie show called 'Simply Ming' where they featured a Los Angeles food truck restaurateur called Roy Choi. He made some amazing things and included his homemade stock kimchee in just about everything. Ming thought the kimchee was very good. 

I watch the Asian cooking shows with fascination but no background since all of my family basically produced early american settler variations, and nearby regional areas had many from europe and britain. I like cooking and have heard about the benefits of fermented foods so decided to give the recipe a try

Hard to track down a few items, but collected all the parts, put it together a few days before a two week vacation and let sit at room temp, then put in the refrigerator when i headed to the airport. Upon return i wasnt sure if the apt would be filled with ugly smells or if everything would be brown and mushy. I took the can out a few days ago and took to work. There are a few foodly adventurous people there and they'd been sampling various new mexico food i'd brought back. I warned that it could anywhere from 'decent' to 'awful' as a newbie   . They tried it, and those who said they'd had kimchee before told me it wasn't bad but maybe not as zingy fermented as some (it's still a baby)






Can in frig before heading to work. Deep mysteries reside inside 





View in top of can immediately after filling and pre fermentation

I'll take a few pics of product. I can post the recipe if people would like to see. Its probably a bit more expensive kimchee version to start with. One thing i would change after reading other recipes is use a glass container instead of aluminum. Used to have glass but need another. Metals can cause bitterness where contact


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## Ray (Dec 24, 2016)

I have a Korean niece (-in-law) who makes it, but I haven't had the guts to try it yet.


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## Happypaphy7 (Dec 24, 2016)

Every time I see white people who like Kimchee, I am rather surprised! 
I do see more in this big city and that is not as surprising. 

Back in college, I once had a jar of Kimchee in the fridge and the smell leaked out. Everyone hated me for that, and understandably so.
I never put Kimchee in the fridge any more after that. hahaha

Anyways, Charles, you are right in that storing Kimchee in the metal container will add unwanted taste, as with other food items.

I'm Korean so let me put in some info here.

First off, for those who are not familiar, Kimchee is VERY important side dish to majority of Korean people, but not me. 
Rice and Kimchee are eaten almost every meal ever single day of their life and they travel with them, which I find a bit odd. 
When my family visited, they brought their Kimchee even though this is NYC and there are stores and restaurants where they have Kimchee. 
It's the variation I guess, but still, a bit too much. More on the variation later in this post.
I prefer trying local foods when I travel.
I grew up with it but I had no problem not eating it for years! 
It is sort of like bread for Germans, I guess.

Now, the basic recipe for making the typical spicy red Kimchee is the same, but every family puts in ingredients in different amount to their liking, and their kids grow up with it. Korean moms do not measure ingredients with cups and spoons like they do here. It is a bit out of control and vague. They taste as they go and add more of this and that. but they eventually make it almost the same every time! I don't know how this is possible! lol

Also, there are regional variations. Some area they add fish and other sea food (raw) in their Kimchee. Not for me, with the exception of oyster Kimchee when fresh. Very good!!! 

Some people prefer fermented Kimchee, and some don't.
I'm in the latter group. I just don't like sour tastes. Sour old Kimchee does make a good ingredient to making certain other things though, fried rice, port stew...
My mother always made fresh Kimchee every week for me as that was the only Kimchee I would eat. The rest of the family preferred the fermented sour Kimchee. 

Charles, what recipe did you follow? Just curious. 

Also, I'm not sure if they are available in America, but in Korea, we have Kimchee refrigerator. 
My grandmother used a traditional method (farmers with land) where they would put Kimchee in a large jar (I don't know the name in English, but there are made out of clay and baked and glazed, nearly black in color) and keep them buried under ground with its mouth leveled just above the ground. 

There are funny stories from the 50s.
Korea was at war with US and UN soldiers backing the South and commies backing the North.
American soldiers saw these jars buried under the ground, and thought it was the old school style potty. They opened the jar lid and sit on it to poop.
Angry Korean grandma would chase after the soldiers with a big broom. lol

Anyways, my grandma had lots of these jars like everyone did back in the day. She would make Kimchee in them, and other things like bean paste, soy sauce, which is a by-product of making bean paste, and red pepper paste...All these are used for flavoring foods and basic ingredients for making Kimchee also.

Now I live in NYC. I rarely bring home a jar of Kimchee. No matter how tight I keep the jar, the smell sneak out and ruin everything else.
and my partner doesn't like the smell. I don't want to torture him. 

I eat Kimchee about three times a year or less. Other Koreans go, "What?? Why?". not a problem for me. I eat it when it is presented but do not seek it. 
So many other options here. haha


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## troy (Dec 24, 2016)

I like kim chee


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## NYEric (Dec 24, 2016)

Me too, your's looks good.


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## cnycharles (Dec 24, 2016)

I first heard of kimchi when watching MASH (korean war). People thought the people burying pots were planting land mines and destroyed them (but then the stink). I have two half gallon clay bean pots from relatives, and a five gallon clay covered crock that relatives used to brine pickles

Kimchi
Paste
1 cup kochukaru (Korean chili powder)
1 cup peeled onion
½ cup water
15 garlic cloves, peeled
¼ cup peeled and chopped fresh ginger
2 tablespoons kosher salt
2 tablespoons sugar
¼ cup plus 2 tablespoons fish sauce
2 tablespoons oyster sauce
2 tablespoons natural rice vinegar (not seasoned)
1 tablespoon soy sauce

Vegetables
4 cups water
1 tablespoon kosher salt
1 large napa cabbage
½ bunch fresh chives, cut into 1-inch batons
½ cup jarred oysters
1 tablespoon salted baby shrimp

Instructions:

1. Put all the ingredients for the paste in a blender, puree, and set aside.

2. In a bowl large enough to hold the cabbage, mix the water with the salt. Split the cabbage in half and soak it in the salted water for 2 to 3 hours at room temperature.

3. Drain the cabbage. Mix ½ cup of the paste, the chives, oysters, and salted shrimp and layer between the leaves of the cabbage. Coat the exterior of the cabbage with the remaining paste.

This is when you cut off a leaf and slurp.

4. Stuff the cabbage into a gallon-size glass pickle jar and seal tightly. If it doesn&rsquo;t fit, you can cut the cabbage in half again.

Keep the jar at room temperature for 2 days, then put it in the refrigerator. It will be ready to eat in about 2 weeks and can be kept refrigerated indefinitely.

The recipe said to keep leaves whole, but I may shred like most other recipes call for. The thought of dropping paste between individual leaves which didn't match my patience level at 10:30pn  

Need to buy large bag of korean ground red pepper or its going to be massively expensive to make

As a kid, i really liked pickled herring (still do) so odd smelling things if they tasted good weren't a problem. I did see the korean kimchi refrigerators online, quite dedicated! 

Dont mind typos, phone and web browsers/tapatalk goofing where autocorrect and trying to backspace or edit causes the app to freeze (every time)


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## Heather (Dec 24, 2016)

We love it! Thanks for the recipe. I usually buy it from Farmhouse Culture, and we get their Gut Shot too (kimchee juice - they have sauerkraut as well.) Trying to rebuild my husbands gut biome after the last few months!


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## Happypaphy7 (Dec 24, 2016)

Charles, 

So, among the listed ingredients you have there, all are universal (or basic necessary) except for the following : 

onion, ginger, oyster sauce, chive, oyster. 
All of these add strong flavor. With oyster added, you might not want to let your kimchee sit for too long. It will really taste weird. I don't know you might like it. 

Also, regarding the paste (for "standard" Kimchee), Koreans use thick base made by boiling ground sticky rice (there is a special variety for this purpose which is similar to short grain or sushi rice but still even different) in water.
It will be sort of like rice porridge. 
You add all those seasoning or flavoring agents in this base. 
Then, once the cabbage has been prepared (salted and rinsed good), you wear gloves and start adding this thick red paste on the cabbage, leaf by leaf.
Seal off, then store for about 18-21 days for fully fermented Kimchee, or for people like me, start eating right away.


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## cnycharles (Dec 25, 2016)

Interesting, using ground sticky rice as part of the nase, thanks for the info. 
I think the author/cook uses this recipe every day, and needs to have some strength to stand up to the sandwhoches and ither recipes he adds it to. Probably better to use it 'fresher' and make something more basic to ferment more. 
Periodically i have to take antibiotics to fend off some form of bronxhitis, etc and i think i need more good bacteria inside of me.


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## theorchidzone (Dec 26, 2016)

I like kimchee very much, but not sure I would want it every day. 
I made fried rice with it recently. Very good.
Kimchee with oysters fermenting sounds a little scary, at least to me. 
I love raw oysters. A friend recently asked how to know if a raw oyster has gone bad. My response "You'll know!"
Very informative thread.
Thanks!
JC


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## Happypaphy7 (Dec 26, 2016)

cnycharles said:


> Interesting, using ground sticky rice as part of the nase, thanks for the info.
> I think the author/cook uses this recipe every day, and needs to have some strength to stand up to the sandwhoches and ither recipes he adds it to. Probably better to use it 'fresher' and make something more basic to ferment more.
> Periodically i have to take antibiotics to fend off some form of bronxhitis, etc and i think i need more good bacteria inside of me.



Also, there is what we call "restaurant" Kimchee.
So far, nearly none of the Korean restaurants in 32nd street here seem to have it, but back in Korea, Kimchee in restaurant tend to be a lot sweeter and spicier than most home would have it.
I love it!

I think adding stuff like Oyster sauce also help intensify flavors for pro chefs.
I think some people use ground Korean pear as part of base mix, which makes Kimchee sweet. I can't imagine what it would be like for me, though.

Fermented Kimchee is shown to provide lots of good gut bacteria, which help with immune system, but I don't think it has anything to do with up in the chest?? Other than helping your overall body conditions and thus affecting the lungs and airways indirectly?


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## Happypaphy7 (Dec 26, 2016)

theorchidzone said:


> I like kimchee very much, but not sure I would want it every day.
> I made fried rice with it recently. Very good.
> Kimchee with oysters fermenting sounds a little scary, at least to me.
> I love raw oysters. A friend recently asked how to know if a raw oyster has gone bad. My response "You'll know!"
> ...



Stir frying kimchee with rice is very common and popular food in Korea, for both home and restaurant.
I haven't had the stuff for so long. but I'll never cook it here. I'll be getting complaints from the neighbors. lol


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## aquacorps (Dec 26, 2016)

I make it a few times a year. I cut up the napa cabbage in to 2" pieces. salt 2.25% by weight of cabbage. I also add some garlic, carrots and onion. add Korean chili powder, 14 cup or so of fish sauce. mash the mix down till it releases moisture. I add little water to cover if necessary. let it fermet for a few months. adding sprite or 7-up makes it the restraunt style. wish I lived closer to a H mart. lots of recipes on line. my german fermenting pot helps a lot.


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## cnycharles (Dec 26, 2016)

each time i get the bronchitis or similar thing I have to take antibiotics to clear up the fever junk. that's been a bunch of times and yesterday I think it took four hours for breakfast to get out of my stomach so there's definitely some good things needed back in there. they say yogurt is supposed to help rebuild your biome, but I was just eating a lot of yogurt for several months and I can't see that it did any rebuilding, maybe being helpful for the short time it's there

great information, thanks!


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## cnycharles (Dec 30, 2016)

Here's a jar that I gave to our site manager. He thinks it smells good; I think the flavor was a little 'strong', mixed some with a few boiled eggs. 







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## Paphluvr (Dec 30, 2016)

Geez, now that I've read this post I'm getting hungry for it again. Haven't had it in a long time. I tried making it once but don't remember the recipe being as complex as yours. The final product looks great.


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## NYEric (Dec 30, 2016)

cnycharles said:


> each time i get the bronchitis or similar thing I have to take antibiotics to clear up the fever junk. that's been a bunch of times and yesterday I think it took four hours for breakfast to get out of my stomach so there's definitely some good things needed back in there. they say yogurt is supposed to help rebuild your biome, but I was just eating a lot of yogurt for several months and I can't see that it did any rebuilding, maybe being helpful for the short time it's there
> 
> great information, thanks!



http://www.culturesforhealth.com/learn/milk-kefir/difference-between-kefir-yogurt/


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## cnycharles (Jan 1, 2017)

Thanks for the info


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## Happypaphy7 (Jan 2, 2017)

Again, the information contained in the link shared by Eric is basically the same thing as Kimchee and other fermented foods or any food items that will directly or indirectly help with the gut bacteria, which will help with our body's immune system.

I am not sure how this will affect distant organs like bronchi. Probably indirectly by boosting body's overall health and immune system. 

Anyways, regarding kefir, the article says the microorganisms found in it are mesophillic, so I don't understand how they can even survive inside our body which is significantly warmer than room temperature.

Another thing I always wondered about is, how do these little things survive the strong acidic condition of the stomach? I guess by being wrapped by food items??

When I was a kid, there was this brandnew product which was a yogurt with tiny capsules, which they claimed will keep the microorganisms safe from the stomach acid and help them reach the intestine safely. I don't know how true or efficient it actually is, but my family was a big fan of the product for a while. lol

By the way, I once read about the typical diet of people from around the world where average life span was well above the average life span of the general population. I remember one was in a little town in Japan, where the main diet was rice, steam cooked port, sea weeds, tofu, bean paste (this is fermented food) along with lots of other vegetable based diet. 
Another part was Bulgaria, where people ate lots of yogurt of certain type and I don't remember what else.
Common life style for both towns were they were agriculture oriented and people had very high physical activity into the very old age.

My great grandmother lived to be over 105. She was a farmer her whole life eating lots of typical traditional Korean foods. Bean paste (again, fermented food), Kim chee, lots of vegetables as season allowed, accessional meat (very little actually), fish every so often, sea weeds, tofu, fruits in the summer,,she went to the field to work until the day before she died. and she died in peace in her room. Very interesting part of this whole thing is that she was a very heavy smoker, too. I think she just had a longevity gene along with nicotine detoxifying gene. lol


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## cnycharles (Jan 2, 2017)

Not being rude, but why wanting to eat kimchi explained simply twice. When I get upper airway problems I end up needing antibiotics which kill my good microbes. To replace these, I need yogurt and kimchi. The probiotics are of no direct benefit to my airways (I could only hope....)


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## Happypaphy7 (Jan 3, 2017)

Duh, I'm sorry.
I get it. To re-establish the gut flora.


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## cnycharles (Jan 3, 2017)

Np


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## paphioboy (Jan 3, 2017)

We need a sample to taste before we pass judgement!  I love kimchi... kimchi fried rice.. yum


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## Heather (Jan 4, 2017)

Yeah we eat a lot of fermented foods, kefir, kraut, Kimchi, kombucha...apparently all that start with k! Lol. Cultures for Health is a great company!


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## cnycharles (Jan 4, 2017)

paphioboy said:


> We need a sample to taste before we pass judgement!  I love kimchi... kimchi fried rice.. yum



 i'll mail you some
I need to clean out my rice cooker bowl so i can make some rice, and mix together 
I might try making some kefir


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## Marco (Jan 6, 2017)

Kimchee is good...especially when its mixed with galbi or bulgogi and rice wrapped in a lettuce leaf..

Whats even better is the spicy tofu soup mixed with seafood...I don't know what its called though.


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## cnycharles (Jan 8, 2017)

Last night had some fresh rice mixed with kimchi, but not as kimchi fried rice. Recipes said I needed red chile paste so had to research that.... was a bit strong but pretty good

Saw recipe for kimchi butter for steak and meat, have to make some of that!


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## KyushuCalanthe (Jan 8, 2017)

Looks good Charles! When I Korea I enjoyed kimchi that was made with cucumbers in particular. Japanese kimchi tends to be sweeter and less spicy, but is great in soups and stir fries. For a real easy meal I stir fry cut up boneless chicken and kimchi and eat it as is - you could have it over rice it you need more calories.

We have a boiled dish here called nabe that is essentially a big pot of boiling broth that you put almost anything into - meats, dumplings, mushrooms, seafood, tofu, and of course tons of veggies. You put stuff in just long enough to retrieve it to eat on the spot, so the pot sits on the dinner table on a portable gas stove. The various items can be eaten as is, or with a bit of other sauces like ponzu and hot garnishes, etc. ANYWAY, one of my favorite broth stocks for this is kimchi. Very nice to have a meal like this on cold winter days - in fact such meals are one of the mainstays here in winter.


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