# what's your preventive spray routine?



## Chris (Mar 19, 2009)

If your plants are free of pests and you want to keep it that way, how often are you spraying on a regular basis? What's a good product to use in this manner? 

I'd like to begin following a good preventive routine, but I'm not sure where to start. 

Thanks for your advice,
Chris


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## parvi_17 (Mar 20, 2009)

I have found pretty good success with neem oil. I spray it about every 3 months or so, and I very rarely get any pests, just the occasional mealy. When I see those, I pick them off by hand and immediately quarantine the affected plant and spray it with insecticidal soap once a week for 3 weeks before returning it to its spot. I haven't ever had a major problem in my 6 years experience growing tropical orchids, with these practices. Mind you, my collection hasn't reached a good size until the past couple of years, and larger collections tend to have more problems. You have to be especially careful when you bring new plants in.


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## KyushuCalanthe (Mar 20, 2009)

Some folks use Physan routinely.


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## Bolero (Mar 20, 2009)

I use a systemic during the warmer months called Rogor. It's extremely toxic so I am being careful now using it......I never used to be.

But I find I don't get scale and haven't seen a mealy in years. I don't stop the pests completely but it's a good regime and most of my plants have minimal damage.


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## goldenrose (Mar 20, 2009)

Chris said:


> .......I'd like to begin following a good preventive routine, but I'm not sure where to start. Thanks for your advice,Chris



What's your growing area? Those of us with GH can use different chemicals vs. those that are growing in their homes. If one uses the same product over & over won't the insects start to develope resistance? I would think some type of rotation is a good idea.

http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4969&highlight=fire+mealy+killer&page=5


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## likespaphs (Mar 20, 2009)

a release of beneficial insects can provide the same relief without pesticides.


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## nikv (Mar 20, 2009)

I semi-regularly spray my plants with neem oil. And anytime I see a little bugger, I spray every plant in the vicinity with it.


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## NYEric (Mar 20, 2009)

Since I live w/ my plants I was only using alcohol to wipe off bugs. My collection got too big to manage that way and I started to have lots of problems I used Merit 75 for three applications then I started using Neem oil solution. I still have to check and occasionally find a patch of soft mealies so I use alcohol to wipe them off and spray the plant [including the media] w/ neem solution.


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## Chris (Mar 20, 2009)

goldenrose said:


> What's your growing area?



I grow inside my home and have about 15 plants, all paphs. I like the idea of something less toxic like neem oil. 

BTW, I think it's really neat that Eric literally lives with his plants inside a New York City apartment. How cool is that.


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## Clark (Mar 20, 2009)

I also grow inside the home. Growing orchards for 2+ yrs. Previous to the 
recent aphid problem, I only had use sticky traps for the knats. One plant
always has scale, and as Eric used to, alcohol swipes once in a while.
For me, I lay the sticky trap horizontal on the 'soil'. I couldn't catch the 
knats using the metal holder. Good luck, Clark.


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## Eric Muehlbauer (Mar 20, 2009)

I add a little physan to my water every few weeks....indoors, I spray when needed, carefully, as I also live with my plants. For scale, sunspray or pyrethrin with some added sunspray oil.....same for mealies on epiphytes...but for those nasty mealies on paphs, I spot spray with bifenthrin. Outdoors, I sometimes spray everything with Phyton....usually about 2 or 3 times during a summer. Last year i tried spraying with harpin a few times...not sure if it did anything. Take care, Eric


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## cnycharles (Mar 20, 2009)

remember if you only have a few plants and see some bugs, you can also go to either the sink or the bathroom/shower to use water to wash them off. getting a small hose/mister that will hook to your kitchen sink works very well for blasting off critters, then if you want to spray something there are less things to hope to kill (or not). I was reminded by someone at work that some mealybugs hide in the soil as well as under leaves and such, and that the bugs wander places that are solid and probably wouldn't get sprayed. if you have some mealys or others and are going to spray you would need to spray pots, around them and under, and wherever/whatever the surrounding shelves or plastic is around the plant area to try and get everything


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## Wendy (Mar 20, 2009)

Horticultural Oil or Insecticidal soap.


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## Yoyo_Jo (Mar 20, 2009)

I've been using neem oil, and recently picked up Endall II. I swab mealies with alcohol on a q-tip, or sometimes I just jab them with toothpicks. :viking:

I find some of my plants don't like insecticidal soap, so I'm a bit careful about using that.


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## Hera (Mar 21, 2009)

Bayer Rose and FLower spray. I've been lucky though. No major outbreaks in the summer. I spray twice before I bring them in for the winter. I dosen't seem to harm the plants and has been effective.


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## Ray (Mar 21, 2009)

Preventive use of insecticides should be avoided, as that is precisely how resistant strains are developed.


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## Chris (Mar 21, 2009)

Ray said:


> Preventive use of insecticides should be avoided


What's a better approach, Ray? I mean, besides crossing your fingers...


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## likespaphs (Mar 21, 2009)

beneficial insects or spraying at the first appearance of the pest.

(Ray, thanks for phrasing that so succinctly.)


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## Elena (Mar 21, 2009)

I don't spray routinely to avoid any resistant superbugs. Plus I grow indoors, have two cats and like to keep any chemicals to a minimum.

My preventative routine consists of quarantining any new plants. New additions get inspected for visible pests, re-potted, sprayed with a systemic pesticide/arachnicide and kept away from the rest of the plants for a few weeks.


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## Yoyo_Jo (Mar 21, 2009)

I guess I didn't read the title of this thread properly. I don't use chemicals _preventatively_; only when I see a problem.


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## parvi_17 (Mar 22, 2009)

I do spray with neem oil routinely, partly because it keeps the leaves looking healthy. I only use chemicals when I have a problem. I like neem oil because it is a natural product, and I don't think I'm going to be developing some kind of superbug by spraying neem oil occasionally on my little household collection of plants.


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## Ray (Mar 22, 2009)

In my opinion, neem oil's primary benefit is as an _antifeedant_. In other words, as it discourages bugs from selecting treated plants to feed upon, they simply go elsewhere, or stay in such a small population that they are easily manageable.

When I *do* have to spray, I treat thoroughly for at least three consecutive sprayings, I rotate products so that I use a different killing mode the next time, and I like to use an insect growth regulator at the same time, so that immature critters won't mature and reproduce.


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## Clark (Mar 22, 2009)

Ray said:


> Preventive use of insecticides should be avoided, as that is precisely how resistant strains are developed.



I.P.M.!


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## Mrs. Paph (Mar 24, 2009)

Yep, I'd have to agree - Integrated Pest Management, in short: do your best not to introduce new pests to your growing area, keep an eye out for pests and make sure you identify exactly what they are (just an icky nuisance, or something like mealies that would wreck havoc if not treated effectively), and if they are something nasty, hopefully catching them early allows you to do things like just using an alcohol swab to get rid of them from small collections. If you do find something late and it's widespread, then think about insecticidal soaps, growth regulators and stronger insecticides. I can't recommend any particular chemicals, b/c I'm just not the nuke'em sort about using chemicals until I really need to, so not enough experience to have favorites to recommend!


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## Chris (Apr 4, 2009)

The consensus seems to be against prophylactic spraying. As a beginner, I'm grateful for the replies and will follow your collective lead. But I have to ask another question - what about Koopowitz? I just read in his Tropical Slipper Orchids:

"I have not had good success with some of the 'organic' products that are often touted, such as light mineral oils and neem oil. I routinely spray my collection every three months and this seems to keep pests under control."


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## cnycharles (Apr 5, 2009)

it depends a lot on what each person considers 'keeping a pest under control', and this is taken into account before someone should be spraying and with what rate of chemical. to some, control is keeping a population of bugs down to a few here or there, while someone trying to sell plants at a grocery store or florists shop control would mean complete eradication and no signs of old bugs on plants (no skin casings or eggs) which would make public think living bugs were still there. people can be freaked out by two whitefly flying out of a plant at a store because could assume infestation though two only would not likely be cause for concern of a plant being in danger.


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## NYEric (Apr 5, 2009)

I find that even w/ preventative spraying w/ Neem and other insecticides you still have to go thru the collection and check for small pockets of pests hidden away from sight. I have photos of really healthy looking plants but when you turn them over and look close..!!!


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## goldenrose (Apr 5, 2009)

This is what I learned at the first orchid club meeting I attended today, the guy swears by it!
1/4c. lowfat milk
a squirt of dishwashing soap
3/4c. water


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## cnycharles (Apr 5, 2009)

NYEric said:


> I find that even w/ preventative spraying w/ Neem and other insecticides you still have to go thru the collection and check for small pockets of pests hidden away from sight. I have photos of really healthy looking plants but when you turn them over and look close..!!!



oh, thanks for reminding me that I have to pot up the paph bellatulum (that had mealys hidden under the leaves  ) that I sprayed a little while back


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## SlipperFan (Apr 5, 2009)

goldenrose said:


> This is what I learned at the first orchid club meeting I attended today, the guy swears by it!
> 1/4c. lowfat milk
> a squirt of dishwashing soap
> 3/4c. water


Please explain use.


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## NYEric (Apr 5, 2009)

Wash w/ soap and water; then drink milk to settle ulcer caused by stubborn, unrelenting pests! :evil:


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## likespaphs (Apr 6, 2009)

i think Eric's being a little silly...

mix them all together and spray on plants. 
milk will clean leaves and there's been some speculation it can keep out virus, the soap will dehydrate and kill pests.
at least, that's i think it'd be used....


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## goldenrose (Apr 6, 2009)

goldenrose said:


> This is what I learned at the first orchid club meeting I attended today, the guy swears by it!
> 1/4c. lowfat milk
> a squirt of dishwashing soap
> 3/4c. water





SlipperFan said:


> Please explain use.


That's the recipe, put in a spray bottle & spray away! He claimed they don't like it. My guess is the soap is a spreader/sticker/wetting agent, the fat in the milk would smother to a degree? 



NYEric said:


> Wash w/ soap and water; then drink milk to settle ulcer caused by stubborn, unrelenting pests! :evil:


:rollhappy: I have to agree, seems like it would be a chaser, if you start soon enough & are using it as a preventative, I imagine it could work. If the insects have a hold, then I wouldn't place any bets on it!


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## SlipperFan (Apr 6, 2009)

Let's see: milk polishes the leaves, leaving them shiny and maybe a little slippery. Soap will smother insects. And of course water makes it all sprayable. Interesting concept.

Have you tried it, Rose?


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## goldenrose (Apr 6, 2009)

I took 2 plants for the show table & used straight milk to clean 'em up - they looked great! This afternoon I noticed a few scale on the spike of my pyschopsis but had alcohol handy. I've used enstar II & decathalon, several times, so think things are under control. I'm almost done repotting my whole collection & there were only a couple of plants that had a couple of mealies.
I will certainly give it a try, if needed, in between the big guns!


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## SlipperFan (Apr 6, 2009)

I've used milk for years to clean my plants for shows. It gets the hard water spots off (as well as dust, etc.) and makes the leaves nice and shiny.

You are ambitious, Rose. I've been doing a little potting as needed, but I'm waiting for warmer weather to do the most part outside.


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