# fern fiber



## Stone (Nov 24, 2011)

Has anyone tried osmunda/fern roots for things like lowii etc or for baskets?
Does it last longer than bark/chc?
I have some old books that say to mix it 50/50 with shpag/leaves. 
What about tree fern?


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## ehanes7612 (Nov 24, 2011)

Stone said:


> Has anyone tried osmunda/fern roots for things like lowii etc or for baskets?
> Does it last longer than bark/chc?
> I have some old books that say to mix it 50/50 with shpag/leaves.
> What about tree fern?



anything lasts longer than CHC :rollhappy:


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## jtrmd (Nov 24, 2011)

I never thought about trying paphs in tree fern fiber.Have any of you?


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## likespaphs (Nov 24, 2011)

isn't tree fern hard to come by anymore?


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## Stone (Nov 24, 2011)

likespaphs said:


> isn't tree fern hard to come by anymore?



Luckily I can get as much as I want for next to nothing but I don't know how long that situation will last.


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## jtrmd (Nov 24, 2011)

likespaphs said:


> isn't tree fern hard to come by anymore?



I have a trash bag full for now,but havent tried to buy it in a long time.


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## Rick (Nov 24, 2011)

I have a handful of plants mounted on tree fern plaques. It holds up OK.

CHC holds up fine for me in pots when I use it (especially aircone pots), but I quit using it for lack of consistent long term root growth. (In retrospect I think it was all due to K accumulation).

I have since started up using CHC again on a handful of lowii and callosum seedlings (which historically did poorly for me in CHC) and so far results are good while keeping the K away from them. But they haven't been in it for over a year yet.

I have some catts and encyclia that have been in the same chc mix for years.

But back to tree fern, its not a common enough option to add to the array of stuff I already experiment with to put it on the list.


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## Stone (Nov 24, 2011)

Rick said:


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## paphioboy (Nov 24, 2011)

I have heard from other growers that plants on tree fern mounts (non-paphs) grow very nicely for the first few years and then deteriorate quickly after some point. But I have seen very nice paphs in tree fern baskets. Hardy (from Indonesia) grows paphs in birds nest fern fibre and so did I.


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## Stone (Nov 24, 2011)

paphioboy said:


> I have heard from other growers that plants on tree fern mounts (non-paphs) grow very nicely for the first few years and then deteriorate quickly after some point. But I have seen very nice paphs in tree fern baskets. Hardy (from Indonesia) grows paphs in birds nest fern fibre and so did I.



I've had oncids. sophro. dends. etc. on tree fern mounts for years, one dockrillea linguiforme for almost 20 and they all thrive. The trick is to dunk them in some lime solution once or twice a year and let them get dry before watering. But paphs in pots?


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## paphioboy (Nov 24, 2011)

Stone said:


> I've had oncids. sophro. dends. etc. on tree fern mounts for years, one dockrillea linguiforme for almost 20 and they all thrive. The trick is to dunk them in some lime solution once or twice a year and let them get dry before watering. But paphs in pots?



Hmm.. Ok. I have seen tree fern fibre used for paphs, but usually in combination with other materials. I don't use it personally because I find it difficult to work with.


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## Rick (Nov 24, 2011)

Stone said:


> Rick said:
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## Kevin (Nov 24, 2011)

Stone said:


> Luckily I can get as much as I want for next to nothing but I don't know how long that situation will last.



Don't you have to kill the tree fern plant in order to get the fibre in which to pot your orchids?


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## Rick (Nov 24, 2011)

paphioboy said:


> I have heard from other growers that plants on tree fern mounts (non-paphs) grow very nicely for the first few years and then deteriorate quickly after some point. But I have seen very nice paphs in tree fern baskets. Hardy (from Indonesia) grows paphs in birds nest fern fibre and so did I.



Some of my earliest mounted plants from Andy's on fern mounts did just as you described above Paphioboy, but since I've taken out the K and uped the Ca/Mg the plants I still have on tree fern have really gone to town.

I have a Phal deliciosum on tree fern for over 5 years now. Getting huge shiny leaves. I think it had 3 or 4 branched spikes this year. It did look a little puny a few years back, but its another on my list of turnarounds for changing feeding regime.


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## Stone (Nov 25, 2011)

Kevin said:


> Don't you have to kill the tree fern plant in order to get the fibre in which to pot your orchids?



I don't personally kill the treeferns. They come from Tasmanian forests where people have licences to harvest them probably from logging areas.
You should see the size of some of these monsters. diam. at the base can be as much as 6 feet! with a height of 30 feet. It's heartbreaking to see them cut down and lying in the yard. The fiber I get is all the waist from the chain saw. Its burned otherwise. It is only a matter of time before they ban the harvest but while they're cutting wood, everything else comes down as well.

The same thing's going on in Indonesia on a massive scale but everything but the timber is burned.


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## Rick (Nov 25, 2011)

Stone said:


> The trick is to dunk them in some lime solution once or twice a year and let them get dry before watering. But paphs in pots?



I see a pattern here.

Orchiata - compost pine bark in Ca/Mg
CHC - soak in Ca/Mg
Tree Fern - Soak in Ca/Mg (or at least Ca depending on definition of "lime")

All three purge K from rooting matrix, and keep it out of long term contact with orchid roots.

Then you have ? paph species growing attached to limestone rock (which inherently contains no K).

I think you are answering your own questions Stone.


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## Kevin (Nov 25, 2011)

I wasn't suggesting that you personally cut the ferns down. I'm just from the point of view that using tree fern fibre is not environmentally sound. Reading your comments, though, it seems that the ferns are being cut down anyway, so why not use them? That seems sound, however you bring up another point, in that the reason they are being cut down is because of clear-cutting of the forest, which is not good. Is there any reforestation going on where they have clear-cut? I'd love to go to Tasmania some day to see massive ferns like that! Hope there are some left!


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## Stone (Nov 25, 2011)

Rick said:


> I see a pattern here.
> 
> Orchiata - compost pine bark in Ca/Mg
> CHC - soak in Ca/Mg
> ...



Its funny, when I get a batch of Tf/fiber I soak it over night in calcium hydroxide and a little Iron sulphate and then let it sit wet for a month or so before a rinsing. I do this to start the process of breaking down the various toxins found in fresh tree fern. NOW I see that I'm also drawing out K at the same time!

This forum is bloody addictive! I've gotta get off and do some work!!!!!!!!


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## Stone (Nov 25, 2011)

Kevin said:


> I wasn't suggesting that you personally cut the ferns down. I'm just from the point of view that using tree fern fibre is not environmentally sound. Reading your comments, though, it seems that the ferns are being cut down anyway, so why not use them? That seems sound, however you bring up another point, in that the reason they are being cut down is because of clear-cutting of the forest, which is not good. Is there any reforestation going on where they have clear-cut? I'd love to go to Tasmania some day to see massive ferns like that! Hope there are some left!



You'll be glad to know that they do replant Kevin, but we are talking about old- growth forest hundreds of years old.
They tell me that there are millions of ferns there, but they would!


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## Rick (Nov 25, 2011)

Stone said:


> This forum is bloody addictive! I've gotta get off and do some work!!!!!!!!



Holy crap its almost midnight! This forum is bloody addictive! I've gotta get off and get some sleep!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## NYEric (Nov 25, 2011)

Why!? :evil: 
Tree fern fiber is supposed to be a good mix but it has gotten hard to obtain.


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## Paul (Nov 25, 2011)

randsii responds very well here with Asplenium fiber.


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## gonewild (Nov 25, 2011)

Kevin said:


> Don't you have to kill the tree fern plant in order to get the fibre in which to pot your orchids?



They don't kill the ferns any "deader" than a fir or pine to get bark.


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## gonewild (Nov 25, 2011)

I remember seeing tears in the eyes of old growers when it was obvious there would be no more fern fiber to grow in (1960s). They hated the idea of what growing in redwood or fir bark would reduce their collections to.

Fern fiber is a excellent media.


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## Kevin (Nov 25, 2011)

gonewild said:


> They don't kill the ferns any "deader" than a fir or pine to get bark.



No, but fir or pine are trees that are also usable in other ways. The bark is a by-product of the lumber or paper industries. What are ferns of any kind good for to humans? 

Anyway, this isn't really on the topic of the thread - I just wanted to make these points. I don't use tree fern, but have had a few slabs for mounted orchids. Works as good as anything else. Haven't used it as a potting media.


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## gonewild (Nov 25, 2011)

Kevin said:


> What are ferns of any kind good for to humans?



It is very pretty wood. Tree Fern Products


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