# calcium oxide for paph calcium supplement



## troy (Nov 17, 2015)

Is this absorbable?


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## Brabantia (Nov 17, 2015)

Calcium oxyde is very caustic .... its hydration releases a great quantity of heat. For these reasons, I would advise against the addition of this product in a substrate or even in suspension in the water used for watering. Why do want to use it? It is existing many other sources for Calcium.


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## troy (Nov 17, 2015)

I found it is one of the ingredients in a fertilizer I'm trying out


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## Brabantia (Nov 17, 2015)

troy said:


> I found it is one of the ingredients in a fertilizer I'm trying out


If Calcium nitrate (as for example) is present in a fertilyser its Calcium content is sometimes expressed in Calcium Oxyde (CaO). This does not mean that it contain these.


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## troy (Nov 17, 2015)

Atami has a fertilizer coco max A&B part mix it has as calcium oxide 7.57 percent although says derived from and the element symbol on the bottle is (Ca)


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## myxodex (Nov 26, 2015)

Troy, Brabantia is correct. Calcium oxide is reactive, and so unstable; in the presence of moisture and carbon dioxide from the air it will react to form a mixture of calcium hydroxide and calcium carbonate. 

The confusion arises because of a convention in expressing fertiliser ingredients. This is the "oxide convention" in which all elements except N are expressed as oxides; so K2O, P2O5, CaO, MgO, ... and so on. When they say "Ca as CaO" it means they are using the oxide convention for stating the calcium concentration as a weight percentage as CaO (rather than the weight percentage as Ca). It doesn't mean that they use CaO in the formulation. It originates from minerology in which the constituents of mined minerals are analysed and/or defined as a mixture of oxides. For understanding fertiliser nutrients I find it to be archaic, clumbersome and inconsistent,... but it is what folk have got used to and so there is bound to be some resistance to changing it. The requirements for the labelling of fertilisers varies in different countries and for me the Australian system of labelling on the basis of elemental percentages (eg. K and not K2O ) makes the most sense. 

Explained in wiki: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labeling_of_fertilizer

The oxide convention does have it's uses. I have done a bit of pottery and made up some of my own glazes using mineral ingredients such as feldspar, kaolin etc. together with metal oxides. In order to design ceramic glazes you need to know the balance of oxides in the final mix, and in this context the convention is consistent and makes sense as the ultimate "solvent" is a silicate glass, not water.


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## troy (Nov 26, 2015)

Thanks for the info myxodex


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## Ray (Nov 27, 2015)

Here in the US, the standard is to express all ingredients in elemental terms, except the P & K. Those are a leftover from an old, outdated analytical method that require the sample be "dead burnt" (i.e, to its final, stable, oxidized state).

I totally agree that all elemental analysis makes more sense, but no matter which way it is, as long as the methodology is consistently applied, it's fine.


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## Brabantia (Nov 27, 2015)

Ray said:


> Here in the US, the standard is to express all ingredients in elemental terms, except the P & K. Those are a leftover from an old, outdated analytical method that require the sample be "dead burnt" (i.e, to its final, stable, oxidized state).
> 
> I totally agree that all elemental analysis makes more sense, but no matter which way it is, as long as the methodology is consistently applied, it's fine.


I agree Ray but what about the scientific publications. When they write a ratio 3-1-2 NPK (as for example) is it 3-1-2 elemental or 3-1-2 N-P2O5-K2O? This not always very clear for me. Is it a difference between N/P/K , N:K , N-P-K?


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## troy (Nov 28, 2015)

I would mostly say, since I have used this product coco max with calcium oxide, I have noticed a white film precipitate on my medium and 3 of my paphs have burned out roots, roots that were actively growing before the fertilization of the coco max with calcium oxide, that I just noticed now to flush that are totally burned out dead, starting from october I've been feetilizing with 1/4 of what I have been, my conditions have not changed 60 at night 72 during the day


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## gonewild (Nov 28, 2015)

troy said:


> I would mostly say, since I have used this product coco max with calcium oxide, I have noticed a white film precipitate on my medium and 3 of my paphs have burned out roots, roots that were actively growing before the fertilization of the coco max with calcium oxide, that I just noticed now to flush that are totally burned out dead, starting from october I've been feetilizing with 1/4 of what I have been, my conditions have not changed 60 at night 72 during the day



The Calcium oxide is caustic. It is used to kill pathogens as a powder application. You would apply it to a weed to kill it. It probably raised the pH so high it burned roots much like if you applied strong acid.
Have you ever put you hands into wet cement and kept them there for a while while you worked? If you have you know how badly it hurt your skin, causing cracks that hurt like Hell. That is what it would do to a plants roots.
We use it as a foot sterilizer before entering our quarantine area.
Get the picture? Don't use it.


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## troy (Nov 28, 2015)

My thought was, since it's in a balanced solution it wouldn't be caustic, but my blooming harold koopowitz now has burned out roots, may not bloom now, and 2 other paphs not about to bloom that are noticeable now, I'm kind of irritated, I have been flushing all my phrags with ro/tap since I realized calcium oxide toxicity, I also have a phrag silver eagle in low sheath with now severy burned leaf edges.....


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## gonewild (Nov 28, 2015)

troy said:


> My thought was, since it's in a balanced solution it wouldn't be caustic, but my blooming harold koopowitz now has burned out roots, may not bloom now, and 2 other paphs not about to bloom that are noticeable now, I'm kind of irritated, I have been flushing all my phrags with ro/tap since I realized calcium oxide toxicity, I also have a phrag silver eagle in low sheath with now severy burned leaf edges.....



I would suggest you stick to standard and tested fertilizers, stop try new things. rely on the old standards.....they work quite well no matter what people argue about.
Get some MSU and use it.


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## troy (Nov 28, 2015)

Thanks, I will, I have now a dollgoldii last week with a pot full of new roots actively growing getting ready to bloom with now a pot full of dead roots, dammit!!!!!


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## gonewild (Nov 28, 2015)

troy said:


> Thanks, I will, I have now a dollgoldii last week with a pot full of new roots actively growing getting ready to bloom with now a pot full of dead roots, dammit!!!!!



Seriously Troy.... MSU fertilizer is an outstanding all round formula. Use it at the standard strength. Ignore all the arguments about low potassium. Ignore all the arguments about UREA vs nitrate. The MSU should be all you need added to your California water.
Use this without trying to improve it for a period of time and you will see great growth. At some point look for ways to improve the results you are getting and make minor changes based on what other people are doing or have done. After you have become familiar and comfortable with the growth you have then experiment with K-lite or UREA percentages and Epsom salts.

Don't look for ways to use "organic" "natural" fertilizers in an attempt to help save the planet. Do your plants a favor and use fertilizers like commercial growers use and grow your plants without problems.


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## SlipperFan (Nov 28, 2015)

That's good advice, Lance.


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## Stone (Nov 29, 2015)

gonewild said:


> > Ignore all the arguments about low potassium
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## troy (Nov 29, 2015)

Stone, I'm curious about calcium oxides relation to potassium?


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## gonewild (Nov 29, 2015)

Stone said:


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## gonewild (Nov 29, 2015)

troy said:


> Stone, I'm curious about calcium oxides relation to potassium?



Me too, Stone!


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## Stone (Nov 29, 2015)

troy said:


> Stone, I'm curious about calcium oxides relation to potassium?



I have absolutely no idea. I was refering Lance advising you to ignore all his arguments pushing the advantages of very low potassium.


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## Stone (Nov 29, 2015)

gonewild said:


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## gonewild (Nov 29, 2015)

Stone said:


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## troy (Nov 29, 2015)

Soon as I can, thanks


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## Stone (Nov 29, 2015)

gonewild said:


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## gonewild (Nov 30, 2015)

Stone said:


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## Stone (Nov 30, 2015)

gonewild said:


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## gonewild (Nov 30, 2015)

Stone said:


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## troy (Nov 30, 2015)

Thanks lance, will ammonium nitrate and calcium nitrate with added calcium sulfate in low percentage precipitate?


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## gonewild (Dec 1, 2015)

troy said:


> Thanks lance, will ammonium nitrate and calcium nitrate with added calcium sulfate in low percentage precipitate?



Calcium sulfate is not soluble in water in the first place. It is not an ingredient for liquid fertilizer.

At low percentage you can mix AN and CN without significant precipitation. 
Low percentage being the strength it would be used in irrigation water.


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