# Advice needed on antivirus protection



## Hera (Dec 9, 2011)

This is the third time I've had to reformat my computer because of f****** Trojans. Please chime in on suggestions for really good protection for Internet surfing. These crazy bugs come in through the most innocuous looking sites. I've had it!!!!


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## cnycharles (Dec 9, 2011)

firewall?


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## Hera (Dec 9, 2011)

Had one.


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## keithrs (Dec 9, 2011)

Stop looking at that dame porn..... :drool:


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## Hera (Dec 9, 2011)

Only orchid porn!


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## keithrs (Dec 9, 2011)

Seriously.... I have had luck with AVG free and Panda. Keep up to date on all your updates for windows.


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## Hera (Dec 9, 2011)

Auto updates. The thing comes in as XP Antivirus 2012 and immediately scans the computer for supposed viruses then asks you to purchase the product to remove them. It has already infected by the time you see the first screen. It totally blocks mcafee from running and malware bytes as well. Got past spysweeper too. Then it changes and calls itself windows security center and shows up on the bottom tool bar. Can't get on the Internet can't run ,scans can't remove it. The only thing that has worked was reformatting and of course I lost a ton of saved stuff. Nothing that didn't have backups but what a pain!


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## Lanmark (Dec 10, 2011)

Hera said:


> Auto updates. The thing comes in as XP Antivirus 2012 and immediately scans the computer for supposed viruses then asks you to purchase the product to remove them. It has already infected by the time you see the first screen. It totally blocks mcafee from running and malware bytes as well. Got past spysweeper too. Then it changes and calls itself windows security center and shows up on the bottom tool bar. Can't get on the Internet can't run ,scans can't remove it. The only thing that has worked was reformatting and of course I lost a ton of saved stuff. Nothing that didn't have backups but what a pain!



Yeah, my friend has had fun with this identical problem in recent days. He consulted me for help. First I had to close all the open error windows on his Dell laptop, then reboot into recovery options mode (F8 on startup), then choose an earlier restore point -- all this just to get control and stop the process in its tracks. Then I ran Microsoft's Malicious Software Removal Tool to stop the attack from happening again, but it left behind all sorts of bits and pieces which then began pinging the router with DOS spoof and smurf attacks around the clock. There were also significant fundamental changes to the computer throughout (changes to file permissions, registry modifications etc) and missing files galore no matter what earlier auto restore point was chosen and used. The only recourse in the end was to reformat, wipe everything clean and revert to the factory-fresh programming the laptop came with out of the box. 

Windows Security Essentials failed to protect the Dell laptop from infection, but Norton Internet Security managed to protect his Acer laptop from the same trojan on the same day. For that reason I would suggest that perhaps Norton will work better to defend against this monstrosity than does McAfee. As an aside, I've used Symantec Antivirus Corporate Edition for nearly five years now and haven't had any problems with this bug to date.

Good luck with it and sorry to hear you've had such horrible problems with this particular malware. I understand your pain as does my friend.


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## keithrs (Dec 10, 2011)

You can try Safe Mode and try to restore(if you have a restore point). 

If it where me I would clean the hard drive twice then install your OS again. I have mine on auto update but I always check several times a week for updates. Do you shut down or restart your computer after installs? 

I don't like Macfee or spy sweeper myself. Norton 360 is pretty good they are faster to release updates than most, but if you run spy sweeper or other protection software, they may conflict with each other. At work we use Panda to protect 200+ machines and servers. No program will completely protect you.


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## paphioboy (Dec 10, 2011)

Avast? Its free and I use it..


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## ehanes7612 (Dec 10, 2011)

buy a Mac


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## biothanasis (Dec 10, 2011)

I suggest Avast too!!! I use it along time now and I have no problems. Also I have windows updates disabled (I think they cause "frustration" to the pc...) and also enable deletion of cookies etc each time your internet browser closes. 

Additionally, get a good defragmentation program and registry cleaner. Make some disk checks periodically. And there shouldn't be any problem for some years....  

I hope it helps.


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## Shiva (Dec 10, 2011)

I've been using Norton 360 for years and it has worked well for me.


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## likespaphs (Dec 10, 2011)

any thoughts on avg or malwarebytes?
(i don't think the free version of malwarebytes provides real-time protection though)


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## Lanmark (Dec 10, 2011)

likespaphs said:


> any thoughts on avg or malwarebytes?
> (i don't think the free version of malwarebytes provides real-time protection though)



According to an earlier post here from Hera, this particular trojan prevented malwarebytes from working, and AVG failed to protect Uncle Mel's pc from this very same trojan only a day or two ago. I just heard about it a few minutes ago.


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## eggshells (Dec 10, 2011)

To remove the spyware. You need to change the file name of the malwarebytes executable. Say from mbyte to "fjhvhjguvjh" some viruses blocks certain spyware removal program using their default file name from running. Some viruses or malware blocks the site where you download real antivirus or anti spyware too. So you may need to download it on another computer and transfer it to the infected machine. 

Once installed, you may need to rename the executable again under program files. Once you have run it and cleaned it. Install avast. I know lots of work that's why I create image every now and then to avoid this. What a pain.


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## Hera (Dec 10, 2011)

Malwarebyte's site recommended creating a new user name and running the malwarebyte scan under the new user name. That worked, but it didn't totally clean out the virus. I ran under the new name and again under my original sign in and it still didn't get all of it. That's how I got to the point of reformatting.


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## Hera (Dec 10, 2011)

ehanes7612 said:


> buy a Mac



My next one will be, but I wasn't prepared to have to buy a new system during Christmas. My neighbor works in Internet security and he loves apple products for Internet use. He had suggested the malwarebytes to back up my mcafee about a year ago and it was working until now.


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## Ray (Dec 10, 2011)

I used to use Avast, but switched to Vipre a few years ago, as it had less of a performance impact. I have had NO issues whatsoever.


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## Marc (Dec 10, 2011)

I'm using NOD32 for quite some years and since I started using it I have not been affected by virus'es or other nasty internetcritters.

I'm not a big fan of the big names like Norton or McAfee. Their software is too big and bulky and has a negative impact on your pc's performance.


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## SlipperFan (Dec 10, 2011)

ehanes7612 said:


> buy a Mac



Beat me to it, Ed!


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## mormodes (Dec 10, 2011)

SlipperFan said:


> Beat me to it, Ed!



Funny. My macbook has a trojan that it refuses to either quarantine or otherwise isolate. So much for the infallability of macs!


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## eggshells (Dec 10, 2011)

mormodes said:


> Funny. My macbook has a trojan that it refuses to either quarantine or otherwise isolate. So much for the infallability of macs!



I think the common conception about macs doesn't get viruses came from long ago when windows is dominating the market. Now that they are getting more main stream. For sure they will attract those people who are always looking for vulnerabilities. Same with viruses once more and more people uses the Mac OS. They will become a bigger target.


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## gnathaniel (Dec 11, 2011)

This is a PITA type of malware, I think known as 'scareware' because it masquerades as antivirus software while disabling numerous functions of your computer, including real anti-malware software and web browsers. It tries to get you to pay to unlock the software which will then 'cure' your computer, sort of a high-tech protection scam.

Here's a link to some general directions for getting rid of malware:
http://forums.majorgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=35407

When I got an infection like this, I rebooted in safe mode, found and deleted the malware executable (by following back to the target of a shortcut it installed on my desktop), then ran malwarebytes anti-malware and the kaspersky rootkit remover for trojan horse-type stuff. I loaded the software on my computer by downloading it elsewhere and transferring over on a flash drive, though you could probably download it directly if you reboot in safe mode with networking. So far so good, though I'm not entirely confident it won't come back...

And Macs definitely aren't immune to malware, there's just less of it out there so far. Neither are cellphones, networked TVs, really any device that has software/firmware and is on a network. I'd wager someone somewhere has figured out how to put trojans on wireless routers so they infect anything connected to them.

--Nat


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## Hera (Dec 11, 2011)

Does anyone have any thoughts on Bitdefender?


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## mormodes (Dec 11, 2011)

gnathaniel said:


> And Macs definitely aren't immune to malware, there's just less of it out there so far. Neither are cellphones, networked TVs, really any device that has software/firmware and is on a network. I'd wager someone somewhere has figured out how to put trojans on wireless routers so they infect anything connected to them.
> 
> --Nat



Thank You!! I get so sick of Mac users smugly saying they are impervious when they aren't.


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## likespaphs (Dec 11, 2011)

my boss actually got the mac virus that was going around last year
d'oh!


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## cnycharles (Dec 11, 2011)

if you have a mac, get macscan. also, a free product called clamXav has a 'sentry' that checks everything that comes onto your computer through email or targets whatever folder you put downloads into. it's often finding pc viruses coming through email, though often the emails are pretty easily spotted as junk. so far with macscan i've only had slightly annoying cookies that have come from viewing websites that have ads on them, though once it was bound and determined that one of my raw image files from my camera was a 'snooper'


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## Hera (Dec 11, 2011)

Bump, Bitdefender anyone?


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## koshki (Dec 11, 2011)

Do you mind telling us how you got this nasty little bug?


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## SlipperFan (Dec 11, 2011)

mormodes said:


> Thank You!! I get so sick of Mac users smugly saying they are impervious when they aren't.


True. We need virus protection, also. It's just that it's much less of a worry for us.



cnycharles said:


> if you have a mac, get macscan. also, a free product called clamXav has a 'sentry' that checks everything that comes onto your computer through email or targets whatever folder you put downloads into. it's often finding pc viruses coming through email, though often the emails are pretty easily spotted as junk. so far with macscan i've only had slightly annoying cookies that have come from viewing websites that have ads on them, though once it was bound and determined that one of my raw image files from my camera was a 'snooper'


Also, Norton has a good anti-virus program, but it's not free.


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## Hera (Dec 11, 2011)

I'm willing to pay for good protection, but here's what frosts me. Mcafee was about $60 and I pay for yearly updates. For all that there is no guarantee that it will work and on their website they offer virus removal support for a mere $129. What exactly did I pay for?


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## eggshells (Dec 11, 2011)

I am not a fan of Norton and McAfee. I actually consider them as bloatware as they often comes pre-package with new machines. And in my opinion doesnt do any more than the free antivirus others have stated. Often they are annoying too as there is consistent pop-up when your product is about to expire. They also use huge system resources.

I suggest that you go with Avast as others have stated. It doesnt mean if its free. Its no good. You can always get the paid version if you are happy with their product. That's why I like their free product. Its not crippled. You just get extra features when you get the paid version but the free version gives you the basic. It uses less system resource too.


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## Kevin (Dec 11, 2011)

eggshells said:


> I think the common conception about macs doesn't get viruses came from long ago when windows is dominating the market. Now that they are getting more main stream. For sure they will attract those people who are always looking for vulnerabilities. Same with viruses once more and more people uses the Mac OS. They will become a bigger target.





cnycharles said:


> if you have a mac, get macscan. also, a free product called clamXav has a 'sentry' that checks everything that comes onto your computer through email or targets whatever folder you put downloads into. it's often finding pc viruses coming through email, though often the emails are pretty easily spotted as junk. so far with macscan i've only had slightly annoying cookies that have come from viewing websites that have ads on them, though once it was bound and determined that one of my raw image files from my camera was a 'snooper'



This is discouraging, as I am in the market for a Mac. You'd think, though, that Apple would come up with it's own virus program, since it builds everything itself anyway - they would be the best ones to fight it. Maybe they don't want to admit that Macs are vulnerable?


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## Kevin (Dec 11, 2011)

Hera said:


> Does anyone have any thoughts on Bitdefender?



No clue - never heard of it.


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## eggshells (Dec 11, 2011)

Kevin said:


> This is discouraging, as I am in the market for a Mac. You'd think, though, that Apple would come up with it's own virus program, since it builds everything itself anyway - they would be the best ones to fight it. Maybe they don't want to admit that Macs are vulnerable?



Don't be discourage. If you like the interface and if your programs will work for it. Then go ahead. If you are not in websites that you aren't supposed to be I in the first place and being vigilant about suspicious emails and links. You should be fine. Keep in mind though that some developers of certain programs doesn't develop for macs and vice versa. Like orchidwiz I don't think it has a Mac version not sure though.


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## Kevin (Dec 11, 2011)

eggshells said:


> Don't be discourage. If you like the interface and if your programs will work for it. Then go ahead. If you are not in websites that you aren't supposed to be I in the first place and being vigilant about suspicious emails and links. You should be fine. Keep in mind though that some developers of certain programs doesn't develop for macs and vice versa. Like orchidwiz I don't think it has a Mac version not sure though.



Which are sites 'you aren't supposed to be in the first place'? These things hide everywhere, and the virus programs are supposed to warn you if a site is safe anyway, right? 

Yes, there is still the problem that Macs don't have a large enough share of the market yet for all programs to be built for them as well as PCs, but that might change soon, hopefully. I might not have to worry about that for a while, though, since Macs are still super expensive!!


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## Hera (Dec 12, 2011)

The first time I encountered it, it was on a phal species site attached to a picture that I clicked on. This time my son picked it up on YouTube. He follows certain people that review video games. Honestly I don't thick you can predict where it would be hidden.


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## kentuckiense (Dec 12, 2011)

Others have posted good info on programs/protection against viruses. However, you also need to have a first line of defense: run Firefox with the "NoScript" add-on installed. Once installed, only allow trusted sites to run content in your browser.


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## likespaphs (Dec 12, 2011)

Hera said:


> The first time I encountered it, it was on a phal species site attached to a picture that I clicked on. This time my son picked it up on YouTube. He follows certain people that review video games. Honestly I don't thick you can predict where it would be hidden.



this is one reason to try to always keep your operating system up to date. they find and fix various vulnerabilities. one that was found a year or so ago, i think, allowed people to install malicious software on site running on a computer that didn't have the fixes installed
(but i may have muddled how i described it)


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## cnycharles (Dec 12, 2011)

I think you're saying that a computer with old system (or old forum/picture site software) can get hacked more easily and junk snuck in... 
our orchid club website had occasionally gotten odd code installed to cause problems, when the old software wasn't updated with new that had more loopholes plugged. A good site can get hacked, so sometimes it is random where a bug can come from


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## Shiva (Dec 12, 2011)

Hera said:


> I'm willing to pay for good protection, but here's what frosts me. Mcafee was about $60 and I pay for yearly updates. For all that there is no guarantee that it will work and on their website they offer virus removal support for a mere $129. What exactly did I pay for?



I've never heard anything good about McAfee. That's why I went for Norton years ago and never had any problem. It may be bloatware, as many programs going with Windows are but it works very well if you have a computer with enough memory. There's more bloatware out there like Microsoft Word. It used to be simple and agile program years ago but every new version becomes more of a hassle to figure out.


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## likespaphs (Dec 13, 2011)

cnycharles said:


> ... A good site can get hacked...




almost any site can get hacked
oke:


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## Eric Muehlbauer (Dec 13, 2011)

I use both Mcafee and Norton on my different computers, and I've been equally happy with both.


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## Lanmark (Dec 15, 2011)

kentuckiense said:


> Others have posted good info on programs/protection against viruses. However, you also need to have a first line of defense: run Firefox with the "NoScript" add-on installed. Once installed, only allow trusted sites to run content in your browser.



Thanks for this! I hadn't heard of "NoScript" prior to now. I installed it today. Awesome! :clap:


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## Hera (Dec 18, 2011)

I decided to try Avast on my laptop. We'll see how that goes for awhile before I install on the desktop. Thanks for all the responses.


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