# Pollinating Phrags?



## Dane (Oct 21, 2013)

How do you successfully pollinate phrags, they don't seem to take when I pollinate them so I don't know what im doing wrong. Is it possible to self x a phrag? All my paphs take and I guess pollination is the same way?


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## NYEric (Oct 21, 2013)

Yes it is. Use the pollen from blooms as soon as they open.


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## Dane (Oct 21, 2013)

NYEric said:


> Yes it is. Use the pollen from blooms as soon as they open.



Thanks


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## Rick (Oct 21, 2013)

Yes timing is touchier on Phrags since they are shorter lived flowers.

I also think humidity has something to do with it too.

I selfed my pearcei for about 6 attempts with no success when my GH ran under 50% humidity. Then since boosting humidity to 60-70% I get pretty routine success on phrag pollinations (including that same pearcei).

Different species and hybrids may also have their own "special problems".


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## Missgreen (Nov 26, 2013)

How exactly do one pollinate a Phrag? Anyone got pictures of the process?


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## eteson (Nov 26, 2013)

It is not as easy as pollinating Papiopedilum but the process is basically the same.
Here you can find some tips:
https://lab.troymeyers.com/flasking/article.php?number=33

Ive found that in some species you must act fast... the pollen "dries" quite fast and it is best to transfer the pollen the same day that the flower opens.

Some people use a little bit of honey to attach it to the stigma.


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## AdamD (Nov 26, 2013)

From my limited understanding, some phrags are genetic mules incapable of producing offspring. This is especially prevalent in triploid (3n) plants, where the plant has been bred from a diploid (2n) parent and a tetraploid (4n) parent. What are you attempting to cross?


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## Dane (Nov 27, 2013)

I've been trying phrag. Sedenii without success...


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## eteson (Nov 27, 2013)

Dane said:


> I've been trying phrag. Sedenii without success...



I had no problem with Sedenii... but can be difficult to get offspring even from some no tetraploid or triploid crosses... Phrag. Schroederae (Sedeni x caudatum) for example.


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## Missgreen (Nov 28, 2013)

Where can you see if a hybrid or species is diploid, triploid or tetraploid?


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## eteson (Nov 28, 2013)

Missgreen said:


> Where can you see if a hybrid or species is diploid, triploid or tetraploid?




In the label....:rollhappy:
Just kidding!

It requires a cromosome count test to be sure. 
Other approach is to measure the guard cell size in leaf imprints.

http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29695


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## Missgreen (Nov 28, 2013)

Hmm  my besseae's label doesn't say anything about ploidy, can I assume it's just "normal" whatever that is?


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## NYEric (Nov 28, 2013)

Yes, unless its marked usually just 2N. It cost money to get higher ploidy, either thru chemical treatment or breeding.


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## Rick (Nov 28, 2013)

eteson said:


> Some people use a little bit of honey to attach it to the stigma.



This could be a slick trick that I haven't needed to try myself yet (but was prepared to do if it "fell off one more time).

Have you tried this one successfully eteson?


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## NYEric (Nov 29, 2013)

Honey to help pollination!?! Sounds like plant porn! :evil:


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## Rick (Nov 29, 2013)

NYEric said:


> Honey to help pollination!?! Sounds like plant porn! :evil:



Only if you do it on the kitchen table.:wink:


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## NYEric (Nov 29, 2013)

Hey, none of that, we have to eat there!!!


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## Rick (Nov 29, 2013)

NYEric said:


> Hey, none of that, we have to eat there!!!


What's on the menu?:evil:


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## eteson (Dec 2, 2013)

Rick said:


> This could be a slick trick that I haven't needed to try myself yet (but was prepared to do if it "fell off one more time).
> Have you tried this one successfully eteson?



Hi Rick, I´ve tried it but with partial success only. I think that too much honey does not work. The best could be to use only a little bit in the 1/2 of the pollinarium (not covering it totally).


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## Trithor (Dec 2, 2013)

I have found medicinal glycerine to work well. (I am studiously refraining from being drawn into the honey/kitchen table slant, .... honey and vanilla ice-cream!)


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## NYEric (Dec 2, 2013)

whipped cream!


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## Trithor (Dec 2, 2013)

NYEric said:


> whipped cream!



.... with nutella!


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## NYEric (Dec 2, 2013)




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## SlipperFan (Dec 2, 2013)

OK, now you guys are making me hungry.


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## Rick (Dec 2, 2013)

Trithor said:


> I am studiously refraining from being drawn into the honey/kitchen table slant, .... honey and vanilla ice-cream!



Need to resist better than that Gary:evil:


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## Trithor (Dec 3, 2013)

I have always had impulse resistance issues :rollhappy:


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## limuhead (Dec 3, 2013)

I have found that if you dim the lights, a glass of wine and some soft music, maybe some Marvin Gaye or Nat King Cole pollination attempts are far more successful...


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## NYEric (Dec 3, 2013)

Definitely, but lets get back to orchids!


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