# Basket culture



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

I thought I'd try it on armeniacum a few years ago.Not exactly thrilled at my results.The ones I planted on the top are barely alive but new growth has appeared on the side (2 ) & one that is the largest came out the bottom & is growing across the bottom as if searching for light.Strange!!


----------



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

This view is bottom of basket.


----------



## eOrchids (Jul 16, 2015)

Nice!

How many years has the armeniacum been growing in the basket?


----------



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

About 4, I think, Eric.I'm thinking of trying to remove the one growing out the bottom & putting it in a pot but not sure how it will adjust since this strange growing habit it has.


----------



## NYEric (Jul 16, 2015)

I have had mixed results with basket culture also. At least yours is putting out new growths from the bottom.


----------



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

And one side !! LOL


----------



## Bob in Albany N.Y. (Jul 16, 2015)

I put a multigrowth armeniacum in a basket two years ago and it has done nothing but gotten smaller. No new growths, just dying old ones. I'm never sure if it needs more or less water.


----------



## khrisna.9 (Jul 16, 2015)

It is good to grow like that ?


----------



## Happypaphy7 (Jul 16, 2015)

I don't think basket culture will be any more successful than any other setting. 
Good potting mix, excellent drainage, adequate light and water plus proper winter should do.

I know there was a thread showing an indoor grown specimen plant in a basket with multiple flowers, and this might have inspired many people to try basket culture. 

I would think the main issue with basket culture might be that it needs frequent watering, otherwise the plant might go too dey.

The plants growing at the bottom grows that way because plants tend to grow against the direction gravity and towards the light.


----------



## Rick (Jul 16, 2015)

We've seen some awesome grown armenicum in basket, but I would agree its not the basket (by itself) that makes the difference.

Baskets allow for much higher watering rates with lower retention of fertilizer and otherwise rotten mix conditions at the roots.

The preferred growth at the bottom may certainly indicate were the most moisture accumulates.

I use baskets for lots of paph species but I do water every day (just as for my other mounted orchids). Lots of my early basket cases (first half of 2011) stalled out, and required moss replacement and increase of the inert components of the mix in the basket. But at that time I was also still feeding N weekly at 30-50ppm, and getting pretty bad smelling/breaking down moss. 

Cutting N down to <5 ppm the organic materials hardly break down no matter how much water it gets (and usually it gets taken over by live moss).

With your coir liner looking so clean / pristine after this amount of time Jane, it looks like you have a water limiting situation.


----------



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

I'll increase the water in the greenhouse but it gets watered every time I water all my mounted things.(2-3 x in winter & outside every day. It could be my mix isn't very deep so maybe should add more but I think I might just remove altogether from basket.


----------



## Rick (Jul 16, 2015)

Most of the "mix" in my baskets is large driveway gravel. So it doesn't hold much water anyway.

But I usually get a lot of moss and fern kicking in fairly short notice after setting one up. I'm also getting moss growing on mounts these days. 

So how does yours stay so clean?


----------



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

I haven't a clue Rick!! Top of the mix gets pine needles in it when outside in the summer.I just refresh the bark when I bring it in.


----------



## L I Jane (Jul 16, 2015)

I think I do have to remove the bottom growth as it wouldn't ever bloom going across the bottom like that (at least I think it wouldn't) It has quite a way to travel.The side growths would be a different story.


----------



## Rick (Jul 16, 2015)

http://hortsci.ashspublications.org/content/47/5/585.full.pdf+html

Don't know if anyone remembers this paper. Granted its short term. 10 months for the adult blooming armeniacum and 6 months for seedlings, but they did stuff that hardly anyone would think of doing with armeniacum.

Single adult plants put in basic 4" pots of straight sphagnum moss (not considered a "well draining mix").

Add lib water (basic quality not defined), watered when surface became dry.

Range of N (concentration) application from 0 to 420 mg/L N.

Now here's one of the kickers - only 50ml (3 tablespoons) of fert solution were applied to the pots ONCE a month.

So given pot volume is 785 ml, thats only a 6% saturation rate of the pot once a month.

So even under the highest concentration (420ppm) that's equivalent to giving the plant just shy of 1mg/day of N. There was no one superior application rate for all growth parameters, and even the plants getting 0 ppm N solutions all grew and bloomed.

So you may consider the total N application dose rate and not necessarily focus on the feed concentration rate.

Also in the paper introduction another study is mentioned that says the optimal application rate for Odontioda was 560 mg/pot/year. That's only 1.5mg/pot per day.

This is where the "well draining mix", basket, or mounted system comes in to the equation by reducing the exposure to chemicals (whether it be NPK Ca, Mg Fe Cu).

For comparison if you saturated that same 4 inch moss filled pot with 100 ppm N feed once a week (more typical of hobby feeding regimes) the same armeniacum would be seeing about 60 mg/pot/day. (pushing 150 X the adequate rate in Zong-min's work, and 40X the optimal rate for the Odontioda study).


----------



## abax (Jul 16, 2015)

Aside from the fertilizer/water application, I think an over-grown basket of Paphs. quite beautiful. What a specimen
plant that would make!


----------



## Rick (Jul 16, 2015)

L I Jane said:


> I think I do have to remove the bottom growth as it wouldn't ever bloom going across the bottom like that (at least I think it wouldn't) It has quite a way to travel.The side growths would be a different story.



http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17972

Remember this thread? This one is blooming from a bottom growth.

Also not J's comment about "never letting it dry out."


----------



## Happypaphy7 (Jul 17, 2015)

I too think that this basket is too dry, even if you water everyday.
It looks way too shallow and will dry out like crazy.

I find paphs like their roots moist at all times.

I would take it out of the basket and pot up "normally" like your other paphs that are very happy under your care.
I'm sure you will see big difference no too far into the future.


----------



## JPMC (Jul 17, 2015)

The basket you show looks dry to me, and the mix seems to have decomposed a bit. Mine does that too, but because I only let long-fibered sphagnum line the basket, the rotten mix can fall out. As the level of mix drops, I top dress with new mix. The plants grow right through it. I believe that this mimics the natural process of falling organic matter that starts out on the ground as loose material which eventually rots and is replaced by more falling organic material. These plants seem to have evolved in this environment and can manage the constant renewal of material quite well. Yours looks happy otherwise.


----------



## gonewild (Jul 17, 2015)

It looks like it is finally establishing itself in the basket, I would not take out.
It obviously looks like it prefers to grown vertical or hanging downward.

I would just add more and better mix to the upper part of the basket around the growths on top. Try to raise the top growths so they don't get buried, but if they don't want to lift up I'd surround them with moss or coarse mix and bury them anyway. If the plant wants to grow on the new surface it will send stolons up and form new growths.

Keep it going and let it cover the basket, If it does it will be a beauty.


----------



## SlipperFan (Jul 17, 2015)

I agree with Lance.


----------

