# Paph sanderianum 'Red Baroness'



## SlipperKing (Mar 2, 2010)

I've been waiting a long time for one of these to grow up an bloom. As a fact, I didn't think for a while I would even live long enough to see one bloom in my collection! Bought this one in 05 as a 4 maybe 6 inch seedling. Then I got excited when I discovered a bud coming up on my 22 inch leaf span plant!





Then as it continued to grow, I took note of how dark the buds parts where.




It grew and it grew... so slowwwwly!








THEN FINALLY I got to get a peek of what was inside!




*And now, for the rest of the story!*
What I'm calling a vinicolored sanderianum......What do you all think??




closer










How about one with the flash?


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## John M (Mar 2, 2010)

Yeah! A vini sanderianum! WooHoo!


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## KyushuCalanthe (Mar 2, 2010)

How exciting Rick! Congrats to you! So, what are you going to cross it with?


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## CodPaph (Mar 2, 2010)

magnific, very very nice, big flowers, pretty colors


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## Wendy (Mar 2, 2010)

Man, that's gorgeous!!!! Are you taking it for judging? That colour is to die for! :drool::drool::drool::drool::drool:...................


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## T.paph (Mar 2, 2010)

Congratulation. Very lovely color.


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## musiclovertony (Mar 2, 2010)

spectacular coloration! The red is so maroon! the yellow is so canary! very worth the wait!!


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## Candace (Mar 2, 2010)

Woohoo!


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## jblanford (Mar 2, 2010)

Rick... That is just "AWESOME" congrats, well worth the wait.... Jim.


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## Ernie (Mar 2, 2010)

Rick,

It really sucks. Send it to us and we'll send you a new 4" ls seedling to try. 

Super cool actually. Even the little pimples on the pouch (typical for sandy) are dark. 

-Ernie

P.S. Are we thinking it's not a pure sandy?


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## rdlsreno (Mar 3, 2010)

Good work! Nice color!

Ramon


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## JeanLux (Mar 3, 2010)

Congratulations to the grower!!!! Great coloration!!!! Jean


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## emydura (Mar 3, 2010)

Congratulations Rick. That is fantastic. One of the best coloured ones I have seen. Pretty quick to flower as well. What is the petal length? Like to see a photo of the whole flower. I'm very jealous.

David


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## smartie2000 (Mar 3, 2010)

wow! :clap: the colour is great, and so is the overall shape


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## Leo Schordje (Mar 3, 2010)

Wow, nice red color, especially the pouch. I have seen dorsals and petals just as red as yours, but the pouch is a clearer red than I have seen on any. I'm not sure the term 'vinicolor' should be used, because vinicolor applies to a mutation where pigment is expressed everywhere, even the areas normally white or other colors. 

Regardless, this is one fine colored sanderianum.


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## Bolero (Mar 3, 2010)

Love the progress shots, I wish I could grow these.

Thanks for sharing.


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## SlipperKing (Mar 3, 2010)

Thanks everyone. I'm definitely excited about the color of this clone. I had to question whether it really was sanderianum or something else. I found two pics when googling for images that were hard to see, small and out of focus but appeared to be darker then most sandies. So I felt better. 
I could use the pollen on something.....any suggestions? As for judging, I will probably hold off on this blooming. The best I would get, if that, would be a JC and "I ain't pay'in for no darn JC" The petals are too short at this point.12 inches, to get a flower quality award. I picked up on the pimples too Ernie and I was wondering if they are source of the sugar that some have referred to on the pouch that forms later.


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## Shiva (Mar 3, 2010)

Slow Internet and too many pictures. Damn! I'll never see this one. :sob::sob::sob:


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## paphioboy (Mar 3, 2010)

Wow wow wow wow wow wow... Great job, Rick!!!  and awesome sandie you got there.. It needs to be CLONED...


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## Clark (Mar 3, 2010)

Its good to be the king!
Hats off, great show at your place.


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## John M (Mar 3, 2010)

SlipperKing said:


> I could use the pollen on something.....any suggestions?



Ain't nothin' nicer than a good, well coloured Michael Koopowitz!!! 'Got a really nice philippinense in bloom?:clap:


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## SlipperFan (Mar 3, 2010)

That is most impressive! Grow it big, then I want a piece!

As for the pollen, how about on a nice stonei (Sander's Pride)?


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## SlipperKing (Mar 3, 2010)

Both are great suggestions John and Dot. I do have a roebelenii type that should bloom this spring. The petals on it where 9 inches if I remember right. Dot I do have a stonei big enough to bloom but hasn't yet, two fans at 30+ inches with more starts on the side. Blooming size, right?
I have praestans, roth and haynaldianum coming up. Chi Hua Dancer, Kolosands, Temptation, St, Swithin, Mt Toro, Wossener's Kolorand and a Bel Royale opening or about to pop. A cross onto Gloria Naugle might be a little weird. Any of these sound exciting?


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## SlipperFan (Mar 3, 2010)

SlipperKing said:


> Both are great suggestions John and Dot. I do have a roebelenii type that should bloom this spring. The petals on it where 9 inches if I remember right. Dot I do have a stonei big enough to bloom but hasn't yet, two fans at 30+ inches with more starts on the side. Blooming size, right?


Sounds about right. Stonei is difficult to bloom (for me, anyway) so I don't really know how many growths it needs before it will bloom.



SlipperKing said:


> I have praestans, roth and haynaldianum coming up. Chi Hua Dancer, Kolosands, Temptation, St, Swithin, Mt Toro, Wossener's Kolorand and a Bel Royale opening or about to pop. A cross onto Gloria Naugle might be a little weird. Any of these sound exciting?



Chi Hua Dancer :drool:
Mt. Toro:drool:
My opinion


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## NYEric (Mar 4, 2010)

Parvis! 
Congrats!


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## emydura (Mar 4, 2010)

Crossed back to one of your MK's could be nice. Nice colour in both and it will increase the petal length. Long time to bloom though.

David


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## SlipperKing (Mar 4, 2010)

emydura said:


> Crossed back to one of your MK's could be nice. Nice colour in both and it will increase the petal length. Long time to bloom though.
> 
> David



That's good idea as well David. Especially the "redhead" clone


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## eOrchids (Mar 4, 2010)

Awesome display!


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## Drorchid (Mar 4, 2010)

One of the nicest sanderianums I have seen! Just love the color on that one. Do you know the history/origin of that one? I don't know if I am right (maybe Sanderianum can give us some more info), but I have heard there are two populations of sanderianums; one is more a "highland" type that grows at higher elevations, This type gets lighter colored flowers that have "gold" colored pouches (these are the ones we have here at our nursery). The other type grows at lower altitudes and has darker pouches. The one that you are showing would be one of those types. I wonder if the differences are large enough to call yours a true variety.

I too would vote for crossing it onto a MK, but I think any multifloral cross with this sanderianum would be good. I would not cross it onto a parvi, just because they usually turn out misshapen. The only nice one that I have seen was one of Tom Kalina's Paph. Sacagawea's Slippers (delenatii x sanderianum), so maybe if you cross delenatii vinicolor (aka dunkel) with this one, it will turn out nice.

Oh I just thought of another cross that would be awesome with this plant: Paph. anitum x Paph. sanderianum!

Robert


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## Leo Schordje (Mar 4, 2010)

SlipperKing said:


> That's good idea as well David. Especially the "redhead" clone



I would like to second David's vote for back crossing onto your MK 'Red Head'. It would stabilize the color some and recover the longer petals. 

Robert Quene's suggestions are spot on too. And as Dot suggested Mt Toro is an excellent choice. Stonei hybrids often have superior form, as stonei will straighten out those 'broken arms' slouching shoulders habit of sanderianum petals. 

Your sanderianum does have the most vivid red I have ever seen on a sanderianum. 
Leo


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## Ernie (Mar 4, 2010)

Once again, it's awesome! Make more- self it (if it's big enough to carry a pod)!!! 

-Ernie


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## Rick (Mar 4, 2010)

Totally awesome Rick.:clap::clap:

Keep us posted on the petal length


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## e-spice (Mar 5, 2010)

That is super gorgeous! Thanks for sharing.

e-spice


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## Heather (Mar 5, 2010)

Interesting thinking about the things to cross it with. It's a beaut, for sure!


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## toddybear (Mar 5, 2010)

OMG! What a bloom!


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## 2ljd (Mar 6, 2010)

Stunning! I agree with Robert, cross it with an anitum. :drool:


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## Shiva (Mar 6, 2010)

Well, I'm finally on fast Internet, but I had to buy a new computer so I could install a WiFi link. And now Rick, I can see what everybody was raving about. :rollhappy::rollhappy::rollhappy: Great plant and flowers.


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## Wendy (Mar 6, 2010)

I say self it....never enough sandies around.


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## SlipperKing (Mar 6, 2010)

Here is a updated photo showing petal length, 13+ inches. Side note: I took the plant to the orchid meeting Thur night and it was NO big deal with the general orchid population. It just goes to show, most people don't know what the heck their looking at! That's one of the reasons I love this forum!


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## Clark (Mar 6, 2010)

i'll need a beach towel to wipe the drool.


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## callosum (Mar 6, 2010)

that a beauty of paph.
better to self and get the early bloom plant that could be used as a parent in the future


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## SlipperKing (Mar 6, 2010)

*Update Source*

I have a update for all that maybe interested in buying this same cross. The parents to this plant are 'HS Select' X 'Bear Select'. Although I bought this plant from Bill Bergstom(?) in Hawaii, I found the same cross from Parkside Orchids. I just got off the phone with Evie and they have 5 plants left, there where 6:evil:


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## emydura (Mar 6, 2010)

SlipperKing said:


> Here is a updated photo showing petal length, 13+ inches. Side note: I took the plant to the orchid meeting Thur night and it was NO big deal with the general orchid population. It just goes to show, most people don't know what the heck their looking at! That's one of the reasons I love this forum!



WOW. Looking even better. The colour is amazing. "No big deal"!!! You must be kidding? Didn't they realise how blessed they were to be in the presence of such a species? I'm sure in our society that would have won all the prizes that night.

David


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## paphreek (Mar 6, 2010)

SlipperKing said:


> Here is a updated photo showing petal length, 13+ inches. Side note: I took the plant to the orchid meeting Thur night and it was NO big deal with the general orchid population. It just goes to show, most people don't know what the heck their looking at! That's one of the reasons I love this forum!



Not every orchid grower is as enamored with Paphs and Phrags as we are. I agree with you about this forum.


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## paphioboy (Mar 6, 2010)

Wow.. That updated pic is delicious...


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## emydura (Mar 6, 2010)

paphreek said:


> Not every orchid grower is as enamored with Paphs and Phrags as we are. I agree with you about this forum.



Yes, but a sanderianum transcends specialisations. We had a Phrag caudatum not long back that cleaned up at our meeting. Everyone loved it. And it only had 2 flowers. Not as well grown plant as Rick's. I find it hard to believe that anyone could walk past Ricks plant and not give it a 2nd look. You wouldn't even have to be into orchids to be not amazed by this flower.

David


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## JeanLux (Mar 7, 2010)

paphreek said:


> *Not every orchid grower is as enamored with Paphs and Phrags* as we are. I agree with you about this forum.



I agree with Ross on this when considering my personal orchid history! 10 (and more) years ago, when I walked through an orchid show, the slippers that got my eye were bella and brachies, armeniacum and co, and maybe besseaes and hybrids ! For all of the other slipper beauties, I had no idea about and was not (yet) interested! Jean

Of course from my today's point of view Rick's plant is an outstanding one!!!!


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## Mrs. Paph (Mar 8, 2010)

VERY NICE!!!  I second the votes for a cross with MK and Mt. Toro! Sand is back on my to-get list - I killed my tiny seedling in TX....grumble...


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## orchidman77 (Mar 9, 2010)

Oh my gosh that is one amazing sanderianum. I have one seedling from Orchid Inn ('Twister' x 'Henry') and I have plans to buy as many more as I can. This cross just jumped to the top of the list. 

Could you post another updated picture? As for crosses, I'd self it and cross with MK and Mt. Toro as well.

David


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## SlipperKing (Mar 9, 2010)

orchidman77 said:


> Oh my gosh that is one amazing sanderianum. I have one seedling from Orchid Inn ('Twister' x 'Henry') and I have plans to buy as many more as I can. This cross just jumped to the top of the list.
> 
> Could you post another updated picture? As for crosses, I'd self it and cross with MK and Mt. Toro as well.
> 
> David



David look at post #42 above if you're interested in this same cross.


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## orchidman77 (Mar 10, 2010)

thanks rick, I'll look into buying one if I can! :biggrin:

How long are the petals now? 

David


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## Sangii (Mar 11, 2010)

:clap: congratulations !


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## orchidman77 (Mar 18, 2010)

Hey Rick, can you post an updated picture?

David


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## SlipperKing (Mar 18, 2010)

orchidman77 said:


> Hey Rick, can you post an updated picture?
> 
> David



sure


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## GuRu (Mar 19, 2010)

Rick, your photos are agonising!! That's really gorgeous! Five drools :drool::drool::drool::drool::drool:
Best regards from germany, rudolf


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## orchidman77 (Mar 19, 2010)

WOW that's beautiful!! Have you made crosses with it, or are you planning to wait for its next bloom?

David


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## SlipperFan (Mar 19, 2010)

Just spectacular, Rick!


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## Rick (Mar 19, 2010)

These blooms are awesome Rick:drool::drool:


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## SlipperKing (Mar 19, 2010)

thanks guys. I did make two crosses so far MK 'RedHead' X sandie and the Chiu Hua Dancer X sandie. The last cross is messing with me. I made the cross on the 16th and by the 18th the CHD flower fell off! I don't think that was long enough for the pollen tubes to grow and do what they need to do. I'll have to try again on a freasher flower.

Robert, about your question with different geographical races. I emailed Xavier, Sanderianum, and he believes there are high elevations and low elevation races(colonies maybe a better term) of sanderianums BUT the color range as well as, the flower sizes vary greatly amoung the colonies. He does feel the redder forms are more common in the higher elevated colonies.


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## Rick (Mar 19, 2010)

SlipperKing said:


> I made the cross on the 16th and by the 18th the CHD flower fell off! I don't think that was long enough for the pollen tubes to grow and do what they need to do. I'll have to try again on a freasher flower.



2 days seems about right for my experiences with henryanum, but 2 days is definitely short for all the non-sanderianum multis I've pollinated. You'll just have to wait and see.


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## Leo Schordje (Mar 20, 2010)

If your orchid society meeting was in a room with artificial light, I have found sometime fluorescent light, and especially some of the new CFL lights shift the colors off, I have had several plants that just 'popped' under natural sunlight look rather drab at the meeting when I wanted to brag, your fellow society memebers may not be complete barbarians. (by the way, if John Stubbings of Clown Alley Orchids is one of your club members, tell him to join ST, he knows much more about Paphs that he admits :evil:, tell him I said hello)


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## Lars Pedersen (Mar 20, 2010)

Hi Rick

That is surely a fine sanderianum you have

Here is my specimen of "the holy gral of orchids" 







It has a leafspan at 43 centimeters.

Anyone whith a guess at how long to first flowering ?

Greetings from Denmark
Lars


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## orchidman77 (Mar 20, 2010)

Lars, you probably have about a year or two to see a bloom, under good conditions. It should speed up from there.....

Rick, your sanderianum is simply amazing. I hope you get the CHD x sand cross to work!!!

David


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## SlipperKing (Mar 20, 2010)

Oh so close Lars! David is right in that another year +/- Mine is 22 inches which is about 56cm.
Beautiful plant Lars


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## SlipperKing (Mar 20, 2010)

Leo Schordje said:


> If your orchid society meeting was in a room with artificial light, I have found sometime fluorescent light, and especially some of the new CFL lights shift the colors off, I have had several plants that just 'popped' under natural sunlight look rather drab at the meeting when I wanted to brag, your fellow society memebers may not be complete barbarians. (by the way, if John Stubbings of Clown Alley Orchids is one of your club members, tell him to join ST, he knows much more about Paphs that he admits :evil:, tell him I said hello)



John is here and he just shot down my Wossner Kolorand as having NO WOW appeal. When he and Jerry Stephens found out the cross had never been awarded, they had nothing to compare with other then parent PICs. They had no clue about the rarity of this cross due to the rarity of the randsii parent. Oh well, luck of the draw wrong judging team got it.


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## orchidman77 (Mar 20, 2010)

Lars, do you have parent names of your sanderianum or does the tag just say "x sib?"

This is my small sanderianum seedling, about 8" ls. The parents are 'Twister' x 'Henry'. I repotted it about 3 months ago into CHC and it is looking really good. Only about 3 years to go!!! :rollhappy:

David


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## Lars Pedersen (Mar 21, 2010)

Hi
Thanks 

It is my first sandrianum, so I look forward to the first blooms. 

No I dont have clone names from the parents. 

Rick do you have any close up pictures ?


Lars


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## Pete (Mar 21, 2010)

gotta get those CHD flowers when theyre fresh...


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