# miticide???



## jtrmd (Jun 2, 2011)

Im just about out of Avid,and would like to know what other people are using.


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## Kavanaru (Jun 2, 2011)

jtrmd said:


> Im just about out of Avid,and would like to know what other people are using.



currently almost ready to start trying Voodoo!! 
I have gotten a miticide resistant breed in the GH!! :sob:


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## Brian Monk (Jun 2, 2011)

I started sing Floramite, bt it is expensive. It sounds from Ray like SucraShield wold be an excellent product as well. I also use paraffinic oil, bt you have to use it frequently.


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## SlipperFan (Jun 2, 2011)

Brian Monk said:


> I started sing Floramite, bt it is expensive. It sounds from Ray like SucraShield wold be an excellent product as well. I also use paraffinic oil, bt you have to use it frequently.



Ray's SucraShield is what took care of a mite infection in my Paphs and Phals last year. I'd recommend it! Ray's price is good, also.


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## jtrmd (Jun 2, 2011)

Brian Monk said:


> I started sing Floramite, bt it is expensive.



I would hate to admit what I spent on the AVID a few years ago.I havent priced anything in awhile,so Im not sure what prices are these days.


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## T. migratoris (Jun 2, 2011)

I like Avid and use it still, but principally because: a) I already own it; and b) the alternatives are way expensive. If I were out of Avid I'd switch to something else to avoid resistance.


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## biothanasis (Jun 3, 2011)

I hink that Ray suggests some homemade recipies, which are quite effective and greatly inexpensive. On the other hand, some chemicals are very efective and could lower the risk of being unsuccessful. Well then it is what suits best for each one... Good luck!


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## Ray (Jun 3, 2011)

About the only "home remedies" I'm aware of for mites is cooking oil and soap in water, to smother them, and 1) I have not found it to be exceptionally effective, and 2) I'm not all that fond of oils as suffocants.

If you can do a good job of spray application, I'd whole-heartedly recommend the SucraShield, and if it's a huge infestation in a massive collection that's hard to access, Bugitol.


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## jtrmd (Jun 3, 2011)

T. migratoris said:


> I like Avid and use it still, but principally because: a) I already own it; and b) the alternatives are way expensive. If I were out of Avid I'd switch to something else to avoid resistance.



thats what im thinking


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## biothanasis (Jun 4, 2011)

Hi, I have used dish washing soap (liquid), tabasco (liquid), baking soda (powder) (1-2 tblspoons of each and stir gently) in a litre of water, quite successfully. The only thing is that I do not repeat as often as I should to eliminate new generations soon enough (from whatever eggs have remained). This remedy was found in a forum concerning quite expensive plants.... and they say it worked.

There should be some caution when using it as the tabasco can disturb us too...  Good luck


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## Ray (Jun 4, 2011)

One of the nice things about SucraShield is that is is a "mechanical" killer rather than a chemical (toxin) one, so there is an extremely low likelihood of anything developing resistance to it.


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## SlipperFan (Jun 4, 2011)

It's the orchid growers best-kept secret, Ray.


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## W. Beetus (Jun 4, 2011)

I used Floramite, and am convinced that it works miracles. I was able to get a 1oz bottle on ebay for about $20. You don't have to use much, so an ounce can go quite a long way.


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## jtrmd (Jun 4, 2011)

I might give SucraShield a try


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## Ernie (Jun 4, 2011)

Ray said:


> About the only "home remedies" I'm aware of for mites is cooking oil and soap in water...



When I have an oily pan, I use soap to clean it. The oil washes away and you need to add more soap to the dish pan to finish the not-so-oily dishes. 

So... If one mixes the two as an insecticide, wouldn't the soap counteract the oil and the oil "spend out" the soap? Sorta like just spraying dirty dish water on bugs?


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## PaulS (Jun 6, 2011)

Ernie said:


> When I have an oily pan, I use soap to clean it. The oil washes away and you need to add more soap to the dish pan to finish the not-so-oily dishes.
> 
> So... If one mixes the two as an insecticide, wouldn't the soap counteract the oil and the oil "spend out" the soap? Sorta like just spraying dirty dish water on bugs?



Not really, the soap is an emulsifying agent that lifts the oil from your dishes, it doesn't really break it down. In this case the soap would enable the oil to penetrate nooks and crannies in the plants to get the mites hiding there.

If you use acaricides like Avid you will get resistance unless you rotate it with other things like an organo-phosphate or a synthetic pyrethroid. Personally I would use the latter, and try and get a wettable powder or suspension concentrate, not an emulsifyable concentrate. You may get away with an EC formulation if you don't overdo the quantities, but it may still mark delicate foliage. An SC or WP formulation is much softer. If in doubt try out a new chemical on one or two plants that you can afford to lose (a tough one, I know!) and wait 3-4 days to see if anything bad happens to the plant.

I have found that mites cannot tolerate being wet, so one of the most effective ways to keep them under control is overhead watering.


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## Howzat (Jun 7, 2011)

Here I use Rogor, widely available at Bunnings. It is good for mealy bugs, red mites as well as fruitflies. If you add metho into 15ml/8ltr water Rogor , it works wonder. The metho will crack on the waxy stuff of the thick wooly bugs then the Rogor will kill it off.
Rogor is much saver to use than the old metasystox (banned 10 years ago), but still gives strong smell.


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## Paphman910 (Jun 7, 2011)

Where do you get SucraShield in hobby quantity in Canada? The only stuff I got is Pentac which I dare not use as it is very toxic.

Paphman910


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## PaulS (Jun 7, 2011)

I just looked up the LD50s for those two and Rogor is only marginally lower than Metasystox. Both are pretty serious chemicals that need to be used with great care (and head to toe protection). I was surprised that it is readily available here, in NZ it is only something that commercial growers can get hold of, and then only in 5l containers. 

When I was thinking of softer chemicals I was thinking more along the lines of Coopex, a synthetic pyrethroid wettable powder. It is the sort of thing that you can spray around your home to control spiders. I haven't had the need to use it on my plants, but I can't see any reason that it should damage the foliage.

If users rotate the use of a chemical like this (Coopex/MavrikSC) with other chemicals like Avid/Mitemec, and a third means like Sucracide or overhead watering then you ought to have consistently good control of mites.


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## SlipperFan (Jun 7, 2011)

Paphman910 said:


> Where do you get SucraShield in hobby quantity in Canada? The only stuff I got is Pentac which I dare not use as it is very toxic.
> 
> Paphman910



Ray sells it -- You could ask him if he ships to Canada. No CITES for SucraShield.


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## quietaustralian (Jun 8, 2011)

PaulS said:


> I just looked up the LD50s for those two and Rogor is only marginally lower than Metasystox. Both are pretty serious chemicals that need to be used with great care (and head to toe protection). I was surprised that it is readily available here, in NZ it is only something that commercial growers can get hold of, and then only in 5l containers.
> 
> When I was thinking of softer chemicals I was thinking more along the lines of Coopex, a synthetic pyrethroid wettable powder. It is the sort of thing that you can spray around your home to control spiders. I haven't had the need to use it on my plants, but I can't see any reason that it should damage the foliage.
> 
> If users rotate the use of a chemical like this (Coopex/MavrikSC) with other chemicals like Avid/Mitemec, and a third means like Sucracide or overhead watering then you ought to have consistently good control of mites.



A couple of years ago I had a semi hardwood native shrub that was being attacked by ants, I thought I’d hit it with some Coopex due to its 3-4 months residual action and within 24 hours the foliage was completely black and the plant never recovered. This is by no means a conclusive study but I wouldn’t use it on my orchids.

Regards, Mick


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## PaulS (Jun 8, 2011)

Thanks for the warning, Mick. I'll be extra cautious with it around my plants, there may be something in it that is phytotoxic.


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## Ray (Jun 8, 2011)

Paphman910 said:


> Where do you get SucraShield in hobby quantity in Canada? The only stuff I got is Pentac which I dare not use as it is very toxic.
> 
> Paphman910


To the best of my knowledge, SucraShield is not registered for use in Canada. I can tell you, however, that several folks have ordered it and had it shipped to one of those shipping service places near the US/Canada border, and have brought it into the country themselves.


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## koshki (Jun 9, 2011)

Ray, what else does Sucrashield work on?


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## koshki (Jun 18, 2011)

Bump for Ray!


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## jtrmd (Jun 18, 2011)

Ray-
What rate per gallon are you using with the SucraShield.My better half tossed the info that came with my bottle.


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## koshki (Jun 18, 2011)

I just mixed up my first batch today...1 ounce per gallon. I hope I'm right!


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## jtrmd (Jun 18, 2011)

koshki said:


> I just mixed up my first batch today...1 ounce per gallon. I hope I'm right!






That sounds about right,but I cant confirm it.


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## Mark Sullivan (Jun 21, 2011)

I used TetraSan 5 WDG, active ingredient etoxazole, to get rid of a mite problem It is very effective at eliminating spider mites in a couple of sprayings. I have never had a recurring problem since.

As with any pesticide follow instructions for safety and effectiveness. It is on the expensive side. So are orchids but more importantly time and aggravation.


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## RHS (Aug 24, 2011)

Paphman910 said:


> The only stuff I got is Pentac which I dare not use as it is very toxic.
> 
> Paphman910




Very toxic to whom? 
Plants? 
To the mites for shure. To mammals very low.


Very effective, very long lasting, very low risk for inducing resistance.

Just one disadvantage: not systemic and relative easily washed down.



P.S.

"Noteworthy is very low phytotoxicity of formulations and lack of mite resistance to Pentac after nearly 20 years of use."


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## Paphman910 (Aug 24, 2011)

RHS said:


> Very toxic to whom?
> Plants?
> To the mites for shure. To mammals very low.
> 
> ...



I read on the internet that someone got quite sick after using pentac. I think most people will not get sick except for the rare cases.

Paphman910


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## Justin (Aug 24, 2011)

For my small indoor collection, pyrethrin sprays are very effective on mites. just have to be careful of the oils used in the store formulations on paphs. This summer i have switched to a pyrethrin/sulfur spray that has not caused plant damage.


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## SlipperFan (Aug 24, 2011)

koshki said:


> I just mixed up my first batch today...1 ounce per gallon. I hope I'm right!



I think that is right. I find Sucra-Shield very effective against mites.


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## Lanmark (Aug 24, 2011)

I've used Tetrasan with great success in the past, but in the future I would try Sucra-Shield.


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## T. migratoris (Aug 25, 2011)

Mark Sullivan said:


> I used TetraSan 5 WDG, active ingredient etoxazole, to get rid of a mite problem It is very effective at eliminating spider mites in a couple of sprayings. I have never had a recurring problem since.
> 
> As with any pesticide follow instructions for safety and effectiveness. It is on the expensive side. So are orchids but more importantly time and aggravation.



I should have mentioned that I use Avid and Tetrasan in a tank-mix formula (often with Orthene) and I have astounding results. I spray once every 7-10 days for three applications and that's it. Mites are a thing of the past. I also add 1/4 tsp per gal liquid soap for spreading.

I understand very well the desire to avoid synthetic chemicals but I've lost a lot of extremely valuable plants in the past to mites & I'm not willing to go there again. I'm willing to hand-pick slugs, but mites are another story altogether.


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