# Beginners Phrag



## chippybug10 (Sep 18, 2008)

Hello,
I am interested in getting some advice on what people think would be an appropriate beginners phrag, not too fussy or difficult to bloom. I had a Fritz Schomburg, but a dastardly squirrel decided the leaves were for snacking, so I'd like to acquire something new to get some more experience with phrags. I really love the colorful phrags (not a fan of the green guys), so if anyone has some recommendations, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!


----------



## NYEric (Sep 18, 2008)

Bahahahahahhah! 
My recommendation for a red phrag would be either a Mem. Dick Clements or a Jason Fischer. Generally less expen$ive than a Pk hybrid too.


----------



## TADD (Sep 18, 2008)

Hanne Popow


----------



## goldenrose (Sep 18, 2008)

I'll 2nd Mem. Dick Clements! I've had trouble with Jason Fischer's, for me it's a no.
Eric Young is very reliable & should be reasonable in price.
Longueville (Hanne Popow x longifolium) is the only phrag that survived my greenhouse freeze of 2/07, so I'm calling that pretty darn hardy!


----------



## TADD (Sep 18, 2008)

Jason Fishers seem to rot for me.


----------



## Elena (Sep 18, 2008)

I've read that the likes of Sorcerer's Apprentice make good plants for beginners. They grow large though so not ideal if space is an issue.

JF is not exactly thriving for me either, kinda glad I'm not the only one because I can blame it on the plant now rather than my growing skills


----------



## toddybear (Sep 18, 2008)

Eric Young is my ONLY reliable bloomer...the rest just grow more and more leaves!


----------



## slippertalker (Sep 18, 2008)

I agree with Sorceror's Apprentice. It combines the most vigorous species in the genus- longifolium and sargentianum into an easy to grow and bloom plant. 

Jason Fischer is easy if you understand how to grow besseae. The key is good quality water, intermediate conditions and careful fertilizing. Over several years they grow quite large and produce nice branching inflorescences over a long period of time.


----------



## goldenrose (Sep 18, 2008)

TADD said:


> Jason Fishers seem to rot for me.





Elena said:


> ...JF is not exactly thriving for me either, kinda glad I'm not the only one because I can blame it on the plant now rather than my growing skills





slippertalker said:


> I agree with Sorceror's Apprentice. It combines the most vigorous species in the genus- longifolium and sargentianum into an easy to grow and bloom plant.
> 
> Jason Fischer is easy if you understand how to grow besseae. The key is good quality water, intermediate conditions and careful fertilizing. Over several years they grow quite large and produce nice branching inflorescences over a long period of time.



Interesting responses to JF, considering that a parent is MDC! I feel like Elena & I even tried an older more mature plant from a different source & it declined, struggled & I tossed it.

Will Sorcerer's Apprentice have the color? Chippybug says not a fan of green.

I feel I have good water quality, intermediate conditions & if anything under fertilize. I have one other bess X (Mirage) that struggles & my flavum. I have plenty of bess X's that do quite well - Apple Pie, Barbara LeAnn, China Dragon, Hanne Popow, Maria Glanz, MDC, Olaf Gruss, Rosy Charm x bess. & 2 Ruby Slippers flavum. 
 I'm not convinced that's the answer.


----------



## ohio-guy (Sep 18, 2008)

I have always liked Don Wimber, and it grows well for me. Do other people have problems with it? It has been around for a while, so I was surprised to see no one else bring that up. It should be relatively inexpensive since it is an older cross.


----------



## Gilda (Sep 18, 2008)

Eric Young and Don Wimber are good choices and a nice color ! No green in them . All of the Acker X's seem to grow well ,too. I personally think phrag hybrids are the easist orchids to grow & bloom !
Look at the pictures of phrags under the bloom pics. It will be hard to choose just one !!


----------



## chippybug10 (Sep 18, 2008)

It is impossible to choose just one Gilda!!! I guess I'm gonna have to get a couple :-D


----------



## Gilda (Sep 18, 2008)

chippybug10 said:


> It is impossible to choose just one Gilda!!! I guess I'm gonna have to get a couple :-D



Oh, how I understand that ! I have "several" ! I went from being not a phrag fan(I didn't like the greeny brown ones either) to being a phrag lover !! Such pretty colors now and twisty long petals. I know you like phals( ) and some of these sequential blooming phrags last a long time , like phals !!


----------



## NYEric (Sep 18, 2008)

OK, I'll admit maybe Phrag. Eric Young and Twilight are easy to grow also. Hanne Popow is one of my favorites but they can be tricky about watering. Don't sleep on some of the green phrags too!  OK, Green Phrag Vendors Guild, where's my free Mem. Garren Weaver for that plug!?


----------



## Gilda (Sep 18, 2008)

chippybug10 you have a PM.


----------



## Elena (Sep 18, 2008)

goldenrose said:


> Interesting responses to JF, considering that a parent is MDC! I feel like Elena & I even tried an older more mature plant from a different source & it declined, struggled & I tossed it.
> 
> Will Sorcerer's Apprentice have the color? Chippybug says not a fan of green.
> 
> ...



Mine's grown intermediate (two abysmal summers in a row, it's definitely not suffering from heat ) with decent quality water. I tend to be fairly generous with the fertilizer but I'm careful with the Phrag and the leaves on it are not browning so I don't think it's getting too much. It IS growing and it started a second growth this summer which seems to grow better but it's just not really thriving or flowering 

My JF is the only Phrag I have, I bought it because I was under impression they weren't that difficult, plus my OH likes them. I was never quite sure if it was my conditions or this individual plant that was at fault. I'm not ready to give up yet but, man, it's one frustrating plant.


----------



## goldenrose (Sep 18, 2008)

Gilda said:


> Eric Young and Don Wimber are good choices and a nice color ! No green in them . All of the Acker X's seem to grow well ,too. I personally think phrag hybrids are the easist orchids to grow & bloom !
> Look at the pictures of phrags under the bloom pics. It will be hard to choose just one !!



Ain't that the truth! I got 15 different crosses from him last spring when he had his sale & they've all done well! 



chippybug10 said:


> It is impossible to choose just one Gilda!!! I guess I'm gonna have to get a couple :-D



 That's the spirit!!!


----------



## Kevin (Sep 18, 2008)

chippybug10 said:


> Hello,
> I am interested in getting some advice on what people think would be an appropriate beginners phrag, not too fussy or difficult to bloom. I had a Fritz Schomburg, but a dastardly squirrel decided the leaves were for snacking, so I'd like to acquire something new to get some more experience with phrags. I really love the colorful phrags (not a fan of the green guys), so if anyone has some recommendations, it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!



How about Sedenii or Cardinale? I really like the pastels. They've done well for me.


----------



## Eric Muehlbauer (Sep 18, 2008)

Most of the besseae hybrids will do well ...certainly Mem. Dick Clements, Eric Young, Don Wimber, Sgt. eric....and all are very similar, so for a beginner it doesn't really matter which one you get (I've reduced my collection...too repetitive..but I'm really more of a paph person...). However, you should get more than one, because, while most are easy, individual clones can be difficult...as you can see from the comments. Eric Young has been very easy for most of my clones, but I have one that will not bloom, barely even grows. I have a Rosalie Dixler (which is really the same as Mem. Dick Clements) which grows, but never, ever blooms...despite the fact that my MDC's all bloom easily. I think this one will be an experiment in Z7 winter hardiness this year...........Take care, Eric


----------



## Yoyo_Jo (Sep 18, 2008)

Eric Muehlbauer said:


> ...However, you should get more than one, because, while most are easy, individual clones can be difficult...



Excellent ammunition to use the next time "someone" asks why I have so many orchids...heh heh. :rollhappy:


Great thread by the way!!


----------



## NYEric (Sep 19, 2008)

goldenrose said:


> Ain't that the truth! I got 15 different crosses from him last spring when he had his sale & they've all done well!


I think Chuck Ackers has crossed his plants with some kind of grass becuse they do grow like weeds i.e. very hardy.
I have a few phrag besseae crosses and I think Mem. Dick Clements and Cape Sunset are the easiest to flower. 



goldenrose said:


> That's the spirit!!!


Rose is such a wonderfull person!


----------



## rdhed (Sep 19, 2008)

I have only (1) one phrag. and that is an Olaf Gruss that has done very well for me. It has not bloomed yet, but that is because it was a young seedling when purchased. Actually, you could say I have two because they were in the same pot. I've left them together and they are growing great.

--Allen--


----------



## chippybug10 (Sep 20, 2008)

Hello all,

After all the wonderful advice you've all given me, I took the plunge and picked up a couple phrags from a local nursery. Hopefully these will all be not so difficult to grow and bloom, but for the great prices I paid for them, if it doesn't turn out so I won't be too heart broken. Alright, so here's what I picked up:

Olaf Gruss
Robert Palm
pearcei x St Ouen (this has 5 growths!)
Shimmer (Twilight x schilmii)
Summer Sun (EY x Waunakee Sunset)

There were a lot of greeney crosses, so I really had to search for stuff I was interested in. I'm rather pleased with the day's results; hopefully I'll have flower pics to share soon!


----------



## Eric Muehlbauer (Sep 20, 2008)

You should have no problem with any of them...enjoy! Eric


----------



## John M (Sep 20, 2008)

chippybug10 said:


> I had a Fritz Schomburg, but a dastardly squirrel decided the leaves were for snacking, so I'd like to acquire something new...


I hope that you didn't throw out the pot with the roots. Unlike Paphs, it has been my experience on numerous occasions, that a Phrag which has lost virtually all it's leaves (and I mean ALL), due to frost or squirrels/field mice/chipmunks, will sprout dormant eyes into growth within a few months. These new growths will mature in about a year because they are being fed by a still in tact, healthy, fully developed, adult root system.


----------



## SlipperFan (Sep 20, 2008)

I agree with Eric.

Pearcei x St. Ouen is Ice Princess, by the way. I just got one from OL, and it's really sweet.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 21, 2008)

First of all, , what are you people doing exposing your phrags to squirrels/field mice/ and chipmunks!??!
Secondly chippy, the Robert Palm, and Olaf Gruss are most commonly found as flavum plants; so along w/ your Ice Princess you probably have 3 yellow-pink phrags. 
Thirdly, don't be shy; give your local nursery/vendor a plug and also your location.


----------



## Yoyo_Jo (Sep 21, 2008)

I googled Phrag. Ice Princess and on slipperorchids.info there are some lovely photos of Dot's (2006). Adding that one to my list for sure.


----------



## SlipperFan (Sep 21, 2008)

Yoyo_Jo said:


> I googled Phrag. Ice Princess and on slipperorchids.info there are some lovely photos of Dot's (2006). Adding that one to my list for sure.


...from Orchids Limited. I just purchased another one -- couldn't resist.


----------



## Kevin (Sep 22, 2008)

NYEric said:


> Secondly chippy, the Robert Palm, and Olaf Gruss are most commonly found as flavum plants;



Why is that exactly? Most other besseae crosses use as bright red or orange as you can get, so why aren't these? Just curious.


----------



## NYEric (Sep 22, 2008)

Because only a few people have made and sold the cross and a flavum besseae was commonly used.


----------



## Kevin (Sep 22, 2008)

Okay, but that doesn't really answer my question. I'm wondering why flavum was used in some crosses and not in others. Has flavum been used in Barbara LeAnn or Andean Fire? I guess the answer is that if the goal is to get a yellow flower, you use flavum with a pale species, and if you want a red flower, you use the regular besseae with a dark flower. But, Hanne Popow and Franz Glanz, among others, have used both the flavum and regular.

But anyway, as for the topic of this thread, good haul chippybug! You have a nice selection there!


----------



## goldenrose (Sep 23, 2008)

Kevin -
I would think that's the logical explanation - different colors/shades!

Good start chippy!


----------



## NYEric (Sep 23, 2008)

If you check my collection you'll pretty much find what's been made w/ flavum besseae.  As Glen Decker told me a lot of phrag hybrids would just look washed out if you use flavum besseae [plus most besseae flavum reduce size and vigor] so not a lot of hybridizers use it. Luckily, by crossing besseae type flavs w/ others, boisserianum, pearcei, etc, you get vigor and lighter color.


----------



## chippybug10 (Sep 23, 2008)

Well I certainly hope those plants were made with flavum bessae, those are much better crosses! btw, I picked all these plants up at Waldor Orchids, Linwood NJ


----------



## NYEric (Sep 24, 2008)

Good job, now we know you're a NE person too!


----------



## nikv (Oct 14, 2008)

I'm so glad that I found this thread because I was asking myself this very same question. What would be a good beginner's phrag? Now I'm gonna have to go looking around for some of these hybrids. :rollhappy:


----------

