# nutritional or too much light?



## Mocchaccino (Feb 18, 2015)

Hi Folks,

I am currently reviewing my paphs. I found that quite a number of them appear to be slightly more yellowish than expected. I have replaced my fluorescent lights six months ago. I am thinking of too much light causing that.

But I also think of nutrition. Because I seldom feed. The tap water in my region is also soft. This means they might probably getting numerous elemental deficiencies. I am going to mix diluted fertilizers anyway.

One good thing in observation: The majority of them get pretty good roots than expected upon repotting.

I posted a few photos in query. 

niveum




ang-thong alba




lecucohilum




godefroyae alba. Apology on the shake




vietnamense. Yellower than the photo. And loss of mottling was noted.




philippinense alba




charlesworthii alba




delenatii alba. Obviously the new growth gets a bit yellowish new leaves




druryi. Is that fungal infection or caused by too much light?



same druryi. sorry for the shake


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## gonewild (Feb 18, 2015)

They are hungry.


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## Brabantia (Feb 18, 2015)

Which fertilyser you use and at which concentration and frequency?


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## NYEric (Feb 18, 2015)

Except for the vietnamense, they all seem within expected color, maybe a little too much light. The niveum looks like it went thru a culture shock, not under-fed. IMO


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## SlipperFan (Feb 18, 2015)

The only problems I see are the Paph with the yellowing leaves and druryi with the spots. I'd cut those leaves off and treat the cuts with cinnamon. I don't know about the yellowing leaves.


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## Stone (Feb 18, 2015)

They are all pretty good and if you are getting good roots you are half way there. I would just feed a little more. I think the lighting is good.


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## Ozpaph (Feb 19, 2015)

I vote for a bit more 'complete' fertiliser needed.


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## Mocchaccino (Feb 19, 2015)

gonewild said:


> They are hungry.





NYEric said:


> Except for the vietnamense, they all seem within expected color, maybe a little too much light. The niveum looks like it went thru a culture shock, not under-fed. IMO





SlipperFan said:


> The only problems I see are the Paph with the yellowing leaves and druryi with the spots. I'd cut those leaves off and treat the cuts with cinnamon. I don't know about the yellowing leaves.





Stone said:


> They are all pretty good and if you are getting good roots you are half way there. I would just feed a little more. I think the lighting is good.





Ozpaph said:


> I vote for a bit more 'complete' fertiliser needed.



Thanks for all recommendations. I guess the probable conclusion is a little too much light plus a minor nutrient deficiency. I would probably follow a K-lite principle and try to make my own one.



Brabantia said:


> Which fertilyser you use and at which concentration and frequency?



I am a lazy person. What I used so far was a solid fertilizer originated from Taiwan. I believe it's a slow release fertilizer (10-10-4) functioning for 1 month or so. I don't have a routine schedule for fertilizing. I basically add a certain new "sticks" onto the media whenever I feel it's necessary. :rollhappy:


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## Happypaphy7 (Feb 19, 2015)

I agree that the last one has disease going on.
I would totally remove the affected parts.

The rest, some look fine and some look like they are suffering from deficiency. The early termination of the lower leaves and overall yellowing indicate it.

If they are all grown under the same light condition, and the phillppinense looks like that, then I doubt it's too much light, although it is a possibility still.

One thing you can do is move that severely yellowing one, vietnamense and charlesworthii to lower light for a couple of weeks and see if any darkening of the leaf color happens. Then you know it's the light.

Phillippinense and druyi can take a lot of light and they actually would do better that way. 
Charlesworthii also takes quite a bit of light.

It's rather puzzling because of highly variable degree of all these plants, but individual plants can exhibit different reaction to the same amount of light.

I grow pretty much all my paphs (maudiae species, hybrids, parvi species and hybrids, brachy, multi...) under the same light condition, very strong natural light most of the day, and I do not see any of mine getting lighter in color with the exception of just very few.
One of my parvi hybrids and another hybrid (delenatii and some brachy) would turn gradually yellowish and I moved them to more shade and they greened up in a matter of just two weeks.
I have exact same hybrids that are not turning yellowish at all under strong light. so plants can differ even if they are of the same cross or species I think.

My leucochilum actually has very dark green under very strong light, which is sun light through window glass in the winter and through very think sheer curtain the rest of the year. This is the same light that I grow cattleyas and certain dendrobiums, and they all do well, growing and flowering wise.


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## dodidoki (Feb 19, 2015)

I don't belive in "too much light" theory, looking many in situ pics. Only exeption are anitum and solomons barbatas. I saw pics about charles habitat, they grew in open place almost in full sunlight, only few-if any-grass gave a little shadow for orchids. Similar to helenae, bellatulums ( on bald rock), insigne, canhii, thaianum, rungsuriyanum.Furthermore even grass was burned out beside druryii....


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## Happypaphy7 (Feb 19, 2015)

I partially agree with you on that, but remember pictures capture a moment of the day rather than showing how much light plants receive through the day. So a picture of say paph. insigne sitting in full sun in the midst of thin grassy slope does not necessarily mean it is getting that much light all day.

In general, I really hate to see this highly misleading terms like "shade" or "low light" used to describe the light level for paphs. 
At least to my mind and many that I have talked to, these terms bring to mind that dark corner of a living room where no light reaches. 
No paphs will stay alive too long under such conditions or if they do stay alive, they won't stay healthy.

Field notes do say specimens of the same species found in the brightest possible locations are always the most vigorous one with many flowers (if in season). 

Charlesworthii, druyi, and many other truly grow under quite a bit of light.

I grow my mixed paph collection right by large bay window facing south with no blockage, just dappled by very thin sheer curtain.
I grow my cattleyas, dendrobiums and vandas in this same light.
Bascially all my orchids. They do very well for me. I do have some orchids a couple feet away from the windows. They still enjoy bright light although not in the same intensity I guess.

Then I grow some cattleyas and dendrobiums under direct sun without any curtain.


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## papheteer (Feb 19, 2015)

The parvis and the brachys look pale in my opinion. I'd say nutritional. Underwatering too maybe? Check the roots. My plants used to look like that.


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## Stone (Feb 19, 2015)

dodidoki said:


> I don't belive in "too much light" theory, looking many in situ pics. Only exeption are anitum and solomons barbatas. I saw pics about charles habitat, they grew in open place almost in full sunlight, only few-if any-grass gave a little shadow for orchids. Similar to helenae, bellatulums ( on bald rock), insigne, canhii, thaianum, rungsuriyanum.Furthermore even grass was burned out beside druryii....



Yes! But....you must also add that plants in the habitat 1. always have good roots from the start (so they can take up water easily), 2. the humidity is almost always very high and 3. the air movement is 100 times better than in a greenhouse or room. The more light the more humidity and air (humid air) you need and the plant must be well established. So I think we should generally keep plants a bit more shaded than habitat.


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## Mocchaccino (Feb 20, 2015)

Happypaphy7 said:


> I agree that the last one has disease going on.
> I would totally remove the affected parts.
> 
> The rest, some look fine and some look like they are suffering from deficiency. The early termination of the lower leaves and overall yellowing indicate it.
> ...



"too much light" sounds a bit negative but I am generally quite happy about this. What I am truly worried about is too little light. With "too much light" there's at least a guarantee the baseline for light intensity was met. The only thing now I have to deal and also the only thing I would do is to supply more nutrients. :rollhappy:


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## polka (Feb 20, 2015)

Howdy
If I may add, when you choose to fertilize, read the label looking for magnesium in some form. 

If there is none, add Epsom salt to your mix. If you are going lite, try maybe a 1/4 teaspoon per gallon water. 

Take care
may all your orchids bloom like crazy!

Rex


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## gonewild (Feb 20, 2015)

You mentioned that you fertilizer with slow release fertilizer and in the form of a "stick".
When you use a slow release stick or pellet fertilizer in a media as coarse as yours very little nutrients will come into contact with the roots. The nutrients from the solid will dissolve and flow straight down and out of the pot. So in reality most of the fertilizer that you have applied has not gone to the plant. So use liquid fertilizer as opposed to slow release.


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