# Cyp. japonicum



## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 26, 2010)

The _C. japonicum_ are finally coming into flower. These are being grown in a semi-natural area on the border of a woodland in a neighbor's backyard. Yes, I am a lucky fool - the chance for a foreigner to use someone's backyard for their personal gardening on the eve's a large urban center is very unusual indeed. The plants are growing in an elevated bed since the surrounding soil is a sticky, mucky, clay-based volcanic loam - absolutely not good growing for a Cyp!

Here's the nicest flower of the lot.







These plants were all put here last year. Four were taken from my house garden and the rest (13 growths in all, yes, lucky 13!) were installed last year. They had a serious issue with rot last summer, but rebounded nicely considering. That's pretty typical for these after transplanting, a few years of adjustment and then they take off, that is, if you can keep them alive. Hopefully next year they'll beef up a bit more. The plant with all the flowers in the middle is _C. formosanum_. I've grown that clump for 4 years now and it started with one growth.






And here is a jewel, but unfortunately not my plant, the rare alba form of the species. This is growing at a local orchid grower's yard. These plants are very rare within Japan, offered only once in a while and at startling prices - between $600 - $1000 per growth. This is the second plant I've seen and photographed. Maybe one day if I hit the lotto jackpot I'll try one, but at those prices....

I call her, The Queen!


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## Dido (Apr 26, 2010)

Beautifull plant photos, 
I like them all especiall the alba form. 

Is it possibel to get seeds from such plants??


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## parvi_17 (Apr 26, 2010)

Very nice photos!

The album form is definitely something special. It would be nice if it became more available!


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## biothanasis (Apr 26, 2010)

Great photos of impressive plants/blooms!


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## SlipperFan (Apr 26, 2010)

Wonderful flowers, but I really love the foliage!


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## Yoyo_Jo (Apr 26, 2010)

SlipperFan said:


> Wonderful flowers, but I really love the foliage!



Me too - they look like little opposing fans. Very cool! :clap:


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## smartie2000 (Apr 26, 2010)

nicely established plants! This species is gorgeous


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## NYEric (Apr 26, 2010)

Excellent!


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## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 26, 2010)

Dido said:


> I like them all especiall the alba form.
> 
> Is it possibel to get seeds from such plants??



Well, I suppose, but I'd imagine that if you could pry a few seeds out of a grower they would sell at the price of flakes of gold. Japanese growers tend to hold onto precious things, not distribute them for all. If you want one you have to spend the money on a division when they come available. At present all _C. japonicum_ are divisions of larger plants or are wild collected plants. A division of a normal form sells for $15-$20 here. They are notoriously difficult from seed and must be green poded for any hope of germination.



parvi_17 said:


> The album form is definitely something special. It would be nice if it became more available!



I agree, and if I had a plant, I would attempt to flask them.



SlipperFan said:


> Wonderful flowers, but I really love the foliage!



Dot, in that case I highly recommend trying _C. formosanum_ since it is far easier to grow and the leaves are identical in form, just a bit smaller. In your harsh climate you'd have to pot grow them and store them overwinter in a frost free garage or cold room with temps between 40-50 F. Under optimal conditions _C. formosanum_ will start growth in late March and go dormant in early December.


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## smartie2000 (Apr 26, 2010)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> Dot, in that case I highly recommend trying C. formosanum since it is far easier to grow and the leaves are identical in form, just a bit smaller. In your harsh climate you'd have to pot grow them and store them overwinter in a frost free garage or cold room with temps between 40-50 F. Under optimal conditions C. formosanum will start growth in late March and go dormant in early December.



That is perfect, one of the reasons why I bought formosanum this year. And between Dec-March my semi-heated garage is guaranteed to hold a steady cool temperature no need for using my refridgerator space


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## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 26, 2010)

smartie2000 said:


> That is perfect, one of the reasons why I bought formosanum this year. And between Dec-March my garage is guaranteed to hold a steady cool temperature no need for using my refridgerator space



But don't forget to keep them moist! That is a killer for these. Both _C. formosanum_ and _C. japonicum_ are intolerant of even moderately dry soils - unlike many of their Chinese brethren. Even moisture when dormant is best, but in summer water the heck out of them.


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## SlipperFan (Apr 26, 2010)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> Dot, in that case I highly recommend trying _C. formosanum_ since it is far easier to grow and the leaves are identical in form, just a bit smaller. In your harsh climate you'd have to pot grow them and store them overwinter in a frost free garage or cold room with temps between 40-50 F. Under optimal conditions _C. formosanum_ will start growth in late March and go dormant in early December.


I'll have to think long and hard about that one. My garage freezes in the winter, and I have no room that gets that cold. And no room in my refrig. I just may have to enjoy your photos!


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## smartie2000 (Apr 26, 2010)

thanks Tom for the advice. The last thing I'd want is to mess this plant up! Right now it looks like it is growing in a mix dominated by sand.


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## parvi_17 (Apr 26, 2010)

I bought a japonicum recently for the first time, and I will have a formosanum coming in the fall. Your comments are helpful to me Tom, as I've only been able to gather a little information on japonicum from Cribb's book and a couple tidbits on the web. 

My japonicum arrived bareroot and already growing. I potted it in an 80% inorganic mix that consists of mostly sand, perlite and silica grit. The organic component is peat. Unfortunately, the leaves started turning brown at the edges right away and within 2 weeks the single growth had completely died off. I unpotted it and some of the roots had died, but the long rhizome was still intact and I had a few roots left, so I repotted it and it is now sitting in my coldframe.

I'm unsure if it will survive or not (I'm not very optimistic). Do you have any ideas Tom as to what may have caused this? I'm thinking it may have just been stress from transport. It was pretty cold out when the plant arrived and it sat at the post office for 2 days before I picked it up because our postal system is so great  (they were supposed to deliver it to my door, and someone was home all day but it never came, and I never heard anything). I was hoping they would ship me a dormant plant to reduce stress but alas, it didn't work that way. I'm pretty sure that's $75 down the drain!


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## KyushuCalanthe (Apr 26, 2010)

parvi_17 said:


> I bought a japonicum recently for the first time, and I will have a formosanum coming in the fall. Your comments are helpful to me Tom, as I've only been able to gather a little information on japonicum from Cribb's book and a couple tidbits on the web.
> 
> My japonicum arrived bareroot and already growing. I potted it in an 80% inorganic mix that consists of mostly sand, perlite and silica grit. The organic component is peat. Unfortunately, the leaves started turning brown at the edges right away and within 2 weeks the single growth had completely died off. I unpotted it and some of the roots had died, but the long rhizome was still intact and I had a few roots left, so I repotted it and it is now sitting in my coldframe.
> 
> I'm unsure if it will survive or not (I'm not very optimistic). Do you have any ideas Tom as to what may have caused this? I'm thinking it may have just been stress from transport. It was pretty cold out when the plant arrived and it sat at the post office for 2 days before I picked it up because our postal system is so great  (they were supposed to deliver it to my door, and someone was home all day but it never came, and I never heard anything). I was hoping they would ship me a dormant plant to reduce stress but alas, it didn't work that way. I'm pretty sure that's $75 down the drain!



Wow Joe, sorry to hear about your experience. I think the problem with your plant was mishandling over a long period - it was probably out of the ground for a LONG time, I'd guess over a month and that is what ultimately did it in. Were the roots and rhizome dark brown when you got them more light brown to cream colored? Healthy rhizome and roots should be at most light brown, but the whiter, the better. Also, were the roots shorted by cutting? This species has pretty short roots, far shorter than the average Cyp. I find that soaking the whole plant in fungicide for 10 minutes or so before planting helps in the case of iffy looking stock.

$75?! Ouch! The good news is that _C. formosanum_ is very tolerant, even if mishandled a bit. I don't know why there is such a gap between these two species in terms of ease of culture, but that is the way it is. If that weren't enough, _C. japonicum_ seems to be a hard one to bloom outside its native range even when well established. I know folks in Europe and North America who have large established plants (even colonies) and they rarely, if ever, flower. Why? Not sure! Then again, there are success stories as well. 

Do you mind if I ask where you bought yours - PM me if you prefer not to say publically.


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## parvi_17 (Apr 26, 2010)

KyushuCalanthe said:


> Wow Joe, sorry to hear about your experience. I think the problem with your plant was mishandling over a long period - it was probably out of the ground for a LONG time, I'd guess over a month and that is what ultimately did it in. Were the roots and rhizome dark brown when you got them more light brown to cream colored? Healthy rhizome and roots should be at most light brown, but the whiter, the better. Also, were the roots shorted by cutting? This species has pretty short roots, far shorter than the average Cyp. I find that soaking the whole plant in fungicide for 10 minutes or so before planting helps in the case of iffy looking stock.
> 
> $75?! Ouch! The good news is that _C. formosanum_ is very tolerant, even if mishandled a bit. I don't know why there is such a gap between these two species in terms of ease of culture, but that is the way it is. If that weren't enough, _C. japonicum_ seems to be a hard one to bloom outside its native range even when well established. I know folks in Europe and North America who have large established plants (even colonies) and they rarely, if ever, flower. Why? Not sure! Then again, there are success stories as well.
> 
> Do you mind if I ask where you bought yours - PM me if you prefer not to say publically.



Thanks so much for your reply Tom.

The rhizome was in pretty good shape when I first got it - good coloration, no cut roots, etc. The only thing I noticed on the plant was that one of the leaves had a brown spot on the edge. It was from that spot that the brown spread. I don't know if it was a fungal infection or what. It deteriorated very quickly after I potted it up though!

I have no problem whatsoever with publicly announcing where I got it from. It was Fraser's Thimble Farms, a nursery on Saltspring Island here in Canada that probably has the biggest selection of Cyps in North America. This is the first time I ordered from them, though my Cyp. debile also originated from there (a friend brought it back for me when he drove out there). In addition to the japonicum I also ordered a calceolus, which also cost me $75 for a "blooming sized division", but I will be lucky if it blooms next year. Places like this (at least in Canada) always make little tiny single-growth divisions with only a few roots, so they may be healthy, but they take forever to establish. They also like to ship the smallest plants they have so they can display the nicest ones for walk-in customers; hence my feeling of having been ripped off.

It is worth noting that my friend who brought back the debile also brought back a ton of other blooming plants from his trip, and they were magnificent. Among them was a HUGE japonicum with a gorgeous flower. So, Thimble Farms does have nice plants, they just don't like shipping them . I'll have to make a trip out there myself one of these days (it's a 14 hour drive).


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## parvi_17 (Apr 26, 2010)

Oh, I should add one more thing regarding the plant's source: I'm pretty sure it is originally from Shikoku Gardens. Fraser's imported a ton of plants from Japan this year and as they are all on the Shikoku Gardens catalog I'm quite sure that's where they ordered them from. So, it's a good quality plant, just, as you say, mishandled.


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## McKatelyn (Apr 27, 2010)

I has the same experience. I ordered three from plant delights(payed a little less then you). I planted them a month ago. To my pleasant surprise one is actually flowering right now in the ground. The looked to be very healthy. I thought I was doing everything wright. They are planted in a soiless mix of gravel, soilmaster, and soil perfecter in equal parts with a top layer of orchid wood chips and planted on a small hill. The problem is one rotted and the top came right off. The one that is flowering doesn't look to healthy either. It has blacked edges on the tips of its leaves a little. The other one looks ok.


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## parvi_17 (Apr 27, 2010)

McKatelyn said:


> I has the same experience. I ordered three from plant delights(payed a little less then you). I planted them a month ago. To my pleasant surprise one is actually flowering right now in the ground. The looked to be very healthy. I thought I was doing everything wright. They are planted in a soiless mix of gravel, soilmaster, and soil perfecter in equal parts with a top layer of orchid wood chips and planted on a small hill. The problem is one rotted and the top came right off. The one that is flowering doesn't look to healthy either. It has blacked edges on the tips of its leaves a little. The other one looks ok.



They really are touchy aren't they? But I won't give up, because I love this species! Obviously it's not impossible to grow outside of its range because there are people in North America who have beautiful plants. It would be easier if I could plant it outside, though.


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## Dido (Apr 27, 2010)

Everyone has the same experience with japonicum. 
I losede one too. I baught it from a fresh import form shikogu garden. 

But in formosanum i am a differnt meaning of hardiness. 

I have my plant outside they are now 3 years old, and just kooking nice out of the ground. 
They survived -20C without any cover, near my debile. But only on this place where it stays cold for a long time in spring. 
Have one in pots too ouside, and still waiting what is coming out. 
Because just put the covering away and nothing of this pot is looking at me.


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