# Some easy some hard!



## Stone (Jul 16, 2014)

Can we start a thread on which Paphs we find easy or difficult?
And what's the best trick you've found to get the hard ones moving......

Here are some of mine:

Easy:
sukhakulii, charlesworthii, insigne, lowii, haynaldianum, rothschildianum,
wilhelminiae, leucochilum, phillipinense,

Difficult:
bellatulum, callosum, dayanum, hookeri, fairrieanum, sanderianum, barbatum, helenae, thaianum, 

Intermediate:
micranthum, armeniacum, delenatii, henryanum, appletonianum, volonteanum

There are more of course It will be interesting to see how this list changes over the next couple of years!


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## abax (Jul 16, 2014)

Easy answer for me; all Brachy easy and all the rest slooooow, but eventually rewarding. All multis undesirable and difficult.


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## naoki (Jul 17, 2014)

Some difficulty is obviously due to the mismatch with the growing condition, and for me, warmer ones don't grow quickly, and the ones which requires seasonality in temp don't flower for me since I grow them in grow tent under 100% artificial light. Also there are species which are difficult to flower, but easy to grow and vise versa. But I have a low standard of "easy"; I'm happy if they keep growing and don't die even though they don't flower frequently.

Easy:
appletonianum, bellatulum, coccineum, concolor, delenatii, druryi, emersonii (doesn't flower, though), gratrixianum, hainanensis, haynaldianum, helenae, henryanum, lawrenceanum, liemianum, moquettianum, phillipinense, purpuratum, spicerianum, tranlienianum, urbanianum, villosum, wardii

intermediate:
barbatum, ciliolare (slow, though), lowii, malipoense, rothschildianum, sanderianum, schoserii, sukhakulii, vietnamense, violascens

difficult:
barbigerum, godefroyae, hangianum, esquirollei, mastersianum, micranthum, niveum, parishii, platyphyllum, randsii, stonei, supardii, thaianum, volonteanum


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## Ozpaph (Jul 17, 2014)

the polar opposite of abax - multis grow like weeds.
Mine are all so much better with rain water and less fertilizer and good flushing.


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## NYEric (Jul 17, 2014)

I don't find most on either extreme; especially if they are larger than seedlings. I have proven that I can kill any orchid. However, regular and vini delenatii's, thaianum, canhii, and micranthum, have been my most difficult, (i.e. easiest to send to their demise). On the other hand primulinum hybrids seem to be pretty bulletproof. I think the secret for Paph success is to not overwater, do regular anti-pest maintenance, don't let the media turn to mush, and treat any rot issues immediately.


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## DarioU (Jul 17, 2014)

abax said:


> Easy answer for me; all Brachy easy and all the rest slooooow, but eventually rewarding. All multis undesirable and difficult.



I like brachy very .much but they are very difficult for me. Please, give me some advices.
Thank you


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## eggshells (Jul 17, 2014)

For me, barbata is easy except for papuanum which grows very slow so once you get a bacterial infection. It moves acts faster than the plant to grow new growths/leaves. I 

Brachies are easy for me except thaianum. The others are easy leucochilum, niveum, and concolor. Bellatulum are somewhat difficult but not as difficult as thaianum.

Paphiopedilum subgenus are easy except Paph tigrinum. Im still amazed on how some people can get this into multigrowth specimens. I guess its one of those species that you are either good at growing it or suck at it miserably. There is no middle ground.

Parvis are easy but some are difficult to flower. 

the multiflorals are easy except anitum. Adductum and others are easier. Even intaniae is easier than anitum but its extremely slow to grow. Its like sanderianum on that regard. Maybe even slower.


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## polyantha (Jul 17, 2014)

easy: praestans, wilhelminae, roth, ooii (one of the easiest for me), sanderianum and all other multis
intermediate: randsii, stonei, supardii, adductum, kolo/platy (I don't know why I have problems with them...)
hard: anitum


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## Chicago Chad (Jul 17, 2014)

easy ones:
stonei (my fastest growing paph)
all the parvis including hangianum (my easiest seedlings)
all the multis I am growing including gigantifolium
all the brachys

difficult:
sangii, sangii, sangii

I think I grow my paphs too brightly for some species, hence the trouble.


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## eggshells (Jul 17, 2014)

polyantha said:


> easy: praestans, wilhelminae, roth, ooii (one of the easiest for me), sanderianum and all other multis
> intermediate: randsii, stonei, supardii, adductum, kolo/platy (I don't know why I have problems with them...)
> hard: anitum



How big is your ooii?


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## MaryPientka (Jul 17, 2014)

Easy: delenatii-grows like a weed for me

Hard: micranthum-but I think this was due to poor timing (I bought seedlings in late Fall). All the seedlings have made it through the Winter and are showing growth.

I grow mostly parvis and they're all doing fine. 

Intermediate: The few other Paph species that I am growing-rothchildianum, fowliei, urbanianum, and helenae-are all doing well.

Phrags all seem to be thriving . . .


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## polyantha (Jul 17, 2014)

eggshells said:


> How big is your ooii?



I have four of them, the two bigger ones had 40cm leafs when I got them, 6.4cm broad.


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## Justin (Jul 17, 2014)

hard due to extremely slow growth rate: adductum
hard to keep alive after blooming: vietnamense, delenatii, bellatulum
hard to keep alive after being divided too small or after being set back: rothschildianum
easy (if you get good clones): kolopakingii, stonei, philippinense, lowii, haynaldianum
easiest: Michael Koopowitz


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## Stone (Jul 17, 2014)

Looks like almost any spp. can be easy in the right hands

@ naoki, surprizing you find bellatulum and emersonii easy yet niveum and hangianum difficult! I would have thought it was normlly the other way round.

@ eggshells. Funny, tigrinum is growing as easy as insinge for me! Maybe keep it cooler? I've just put mine outside in the shade house where it gets down to 6 or lower and only 15 during the day. But it's protected from rain and really quite dry at the roots now. I may give it a very light squirt once a week. Hoping for a flower this spring??

anitum did well just out of flask with a nice new leaf on each seedling. Now they are completely stalled and I have no idea why. Nothing has changed!! I have just started to acidify the water down to about 5.5. Maybe that might do something?


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## polyantha (Jul 18, 2014)

For anitum this stop of growth seems to be normal. One of my anitums grew pretty fast, almost like a roth, but then i kept it drier and it had a leaf starting at this time. Well, for more than 7months nothing changed at all, there was a complete growth stop. One month ago I have put it back to my oder anitums in a tray filled 1cm with water all the time and this seems to work. It starts to grow roots again and the new leaf grew to its full size as if nothing had happend. This plant has a ls of 40cm by the way, so not a small plant anymore.
I finally found a good media for anitum. The growth of my plants is pretty good at the moment. I use alot of perlite while keeping them wet all the time. Don't know the pH of the medium so far, I will measure when I see perfect root growth. There still is the problem that altough the growth seems to be good there are very few roots. No big deal for the plant to get enough water since the medium is very wet, but when I see freshly collected anitums I come to believe that they grow pretty fast in nature. Lots of roots and these upright new growths with many small leaves and strong appearence. You all know how growths look when they develop fast...


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## Justin (Jul 18, 2014)

adductum and anitum need to be kept very moist at all times and shaded.


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## Brabantia (Jul 18, 2014)

Justin said:


> adductum and anitum need to be kept very moist at all times and shaded.



And Paph kolopakingii? I ask this question because my P. kolopakingii x sukhakulii don't like high light. I observe a bleaching of the leaves. Not a fast grower also. But, maybe, 35 ppm of Nitrogen per week is to low?
About Paph culture easy or difficult or slow it seems to me that clone or the plant genealogy factor is very important.


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## wonderlen3000 (Jul 18, 2014)

Easy ones:
gratrixianum (my fastest growing and most reliable bloomer)
charlesworthii
spicerianum 
all barbata group 

Intermediate
parvi and their hybrids

Hard:
Any multi-flora (except lowii)
-they tent to die after flowering for me, no idea why. Roots are still alive, the leaf just turn yellow and brown after flowering... =((( 
maybe not enough heat and light???


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## Justin (Jul 18, 2014)

Brabantia said:


> And Paph kolopakingii? I ask this question because my P. kolopakingii x sukhakulii don't like high light. I observe a bleaching of the leaves. Not a fast grower also. But, maybe, 35 ppm of Nitrogen per week is to low?
> About Paph culture easy or difficult or slow it seems to me that clone or the plant genealogy factor is very important.



i grow my kolo seedlings about 12" under (4) 4' T-12 fluorescent lights so that the leaves are light green.


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## Eric Muehlbauer (Jul 18, 2014)

Even the easiest of paphs seem to crash after a certain number of years. I have had a haynaldianum for about 30 years. The first 20 it grew like a weed, making multiple growths, tons of roots, and blooming more than once a year. Then it stopped and went into a decline. I still have it, but its a small growth, a few (but healthy) roots, and that's how it remains. Same with delanatii....(regular form)..grows like a weed, blooms regularly, then declines after some years. I don't have as much luck with alba and vini delanatii....they don't grow as vigorously as the regular type, especially the vini. Some "difficult" plants are slow and hard to grow, but bloom easily, like emersonii- then die. The brachy's are mostly easy. Leucochilum and bellatulum are difficult. Niveum and thaianum are easy, but it takes years for thaianum to spike, and the buds blast just before opening. Concolor is in between the easy's and the toughies. I find philipinense easy to grow, impossible to bloom. Lowii grows fast and blooms easily, but has always been very shortlived for me. Roths sit and go nowhere, sanderianum grows slowly but steadily. Barbata used to be among the easiest for me, now I find them less hardy...except for the old hybrids like Clair de Lune and Maudiae "The Queen". The one time I had tigrinum, it grew and multiplied like a weed, blooming every year. Which is what killed it...I kept dividing it for trade, not leaving enough for myself. It died in the awful "summer of Rexius bark". Most parvi's are rough, but last for years without blooming. Too soon to tell with vietnamense...haven't had adult plants long enough. Basically, much of it is based on the individual plant.


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## Stone (Jul 19, 2014)

I would definitely include vietnamense in the hard group for me. Some find it easy but not me. Maybe we each have a different ''feel'' when it comes to growing and some species fit better into that than others?
The fact that some people find a particular species difficult while someone else finds it very easy points more to an individual's technique? Or perhaps it's just asking too much to have all the species perform well in the same conditions.
Could another reason be that when we buy a plant, we are just taking a chance as to whether its a strong clone or a weak one and this may lead us to thinking its a difficult species when in fact it's just a crappy plant?
With a lot of the seedlings I buy I do not have any choice between plants.


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## Brabantia (Jul 19, 2014)

Stone said:


> Could another reason be that when we buy a plant, we are just taking a chance as to whether its a strong clone or a weak one and this may lead us to thinking its a difficult species when in fact it's just a crappy plant?


YES, the trick is to be able to buy clones selected for their vigour. Some plants obtained in In-Vitro culture (all in fact) have a bad memory of their youth ... too much hormones, not enough vitamin, too much K....


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## paphioboy (Jul 19, 2014)

> Could another reason be that when we buy a plant, we are just taking a chance as to whether its a strong clone or a weak one and this may lead us to thinking its a difficult species when in fact it's just a crappy plant?



This, I agree... Different sources carry plants that are X generations removed from the wild. Inbreeding of species (over many generations) could also lead to loss of vigour but sometimes improves it. E.g. the seed-grown mastersianums we have seen on this forum. If you grow plants from wild sources or 1 generation from the wild versus those that have been selected over 4, 5 generations, I think the difference becomes much more obvious. So to generalize how difficult a species behaves in cultivation is just way too broad to make any sense..


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## emydura (Jul 20, 2014)

Anyone who has grown up a flask knows how much variation you will get in vigour across all the seedlings. Some will not grow at all. People often keep the best seedlings and sell the slower growing ones. So the struggling weaker plants are the ones you are often buying.


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## Brabantia (Jul 21, 2014)

emydura said:


> Anyone who has grown up a flask knows how much variation you will get in vigour across all the seedlings. Some will not grow at all. People often keep the best seedlings and sell the slower growing ones. So the struggling weaker plants are the ones you are often buying.


I agree, and my experience in I-V culture have confirmed what you say.
The Paphiopedilums multiplication In-Vitro from meristems has been described in the scientific literature. I am curious to know if plants obtained by this method are already on the market.


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## Camellkc (Jul 22, 2014)

For me,
Easy: Most of the muties (except philippinese, stonei, gardeneri and giga)
Hard: stonei, gardeneri


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## Bjorn (Aug 8, 2014)

Think I ought to give my contribution as well
Easy: wardii, insigne, venustum, vietnamense(?)
hard: jackii, tigrinum, anitum, adductum, sanderianum, hangianum, emersonii.

hard means that I struggle with them, but not necessarily do not grow them.


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## Rick (Aug 9, 2014)

I'm really not finding any species as stereotypically "hard to grow" anymore.

Some of my old individual abused plants are not coming around, but just about anything picked up in the last couple of years has been doing pretty good.

I recently picked up some roths and new sanderianum seedling back in December, and they've grown more in the last 7 months than some of my old plants grew in the first 5 years coming out of flasks.

A new hookerae and vietnamense picked up a couple months ago are getting new leaves and roots with no problems at all. While these did poorly for me a few years ago.

Henryanum out of flask were hard, and blooming size would grow like crazy to burn out with erwinia after a few years. Now they are total weeds.

I guess need to refine what the definition of "hard" is.


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## Trithor (Aug 11, 2014)

I think it is to be expected that most of us will find some species easy, while others are hard. Paphs come from a vast geographical area, not only that, but there are massive differences in proximity to the sea as well as altitude. This would logically require them to be kept under different climatic/greenhouse conditions. Not many of us have the luxury of a range of growing areas, but try and make do by moving our plants around our greenhouses to capitalise on micro-climates which may exist.
Species which have a very localised distribution in nature are likely to be more specific in their requirements and so either 'easy' or 'hard', depending on our growing environment and quirks in our cultural practice. In contrast, species which occur over a large geographical are more likely to be forgiving in their requirements and easier to keep as part of a mixed collection, and so perceived by most growers to be an easy species.
Then to confuse issues further, there are obviously easy and hard clones of each species (again, this may be due to slight differences in their genetic coding for optimum growing conditions, so where one grower may find a particular clone to be difficult, another grower with slightly different conditions may find that clone to be easy)
I have found over the years that I need to reassess which I find hard/easy. At my previous house, I found brachys and parvis reasonably easy, but since moving to the new house, I find them to be near impossible, even concolor fails to thrive, while most barbata and multis seem to be quite happy.


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