# Differnece between Paphiopedilum paestans and wilhelminae



## Happypaphy7 (Nov 12, 2016)

??


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## troy (Nov 12, 2016)

Wilhelminae grows very bright and is a little smaller flower with dark pouch and dark staminode. glanduliferum var. Praestans flower has alot of green in it


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## Rick (Nov 13, 2016)

Wilhelm (or gardeneri to some) is generally a smaller plant (although there is overlap between big wilhelmineae and small praestens.

Wilhelm usually has 2 flowers (sometimes 3 per spike) while praestens can go to 4 flowers per spike.

color difference as previously mentioned.

Differences in staminode too (wilhelm has a square staminode with little horns on the top corners, praestens has a more oval staminode no horns).

It may be debatable whether they are distinct species or varieties of a single species. There is geographically separation on PNG


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## Rick (Nov 13, 2016)

http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=36719&highlight=predator

http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31875&highlight=wilhelminae

Here's a couple of threads with the two in my collection.

Just because these are labeled wilhelminae and praestens doesn't "make it so",

but these fit the description enough to pass for each.


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## Happypaphy7 (Nov 13, 2016)

Thank you!

I have a blooming plant with a tag that says "glanduliferum, gardineri, praestans", which confuses the hell out of me, but I was thinking my plant is wilhelminae based on flowers.

The bud is white with dark strips. The flower is opening now and the petals and the staminode are rather dark. The doral is white with dark bold stripes.

The plant is very compact, which I am very happy about.

I will post pictures once both flowers open up.

I saw some in-situ pictures and it appears that this species grow in full sun on the field??


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## Rick (Nov 13, 2016)

Happypaphy7 said:


> Thank you!
> 
> I saw some in-situ pictures and it appears that this species grow in full sun on the field??



There are wilhelm pics showing the plant in open, full sun, conditions, but keep in mind the elevation should be pretty high too, so kind of in a quandary between giving bright light but relatively cool temps.

Mine are pretty tolerant of bright and shaded conditions but growth is pretty poor (or susceptible to rots) when they get too warm. 

I would say a lot of phrags are in the same boat. So I tend to keep what I think are "bright but cool" plants in a part of the GH using phrags as the "guinea pig".


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## Happypaphy7 (Nov 13, 2016)

I thought this species was a warm grower? 

or is it praestans?


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## Rick (Nov 13, 2016)

Happypaphy7 said:


> I thought this species was a warm grower?
> 
> or is it praestans?



The bigger versions (praestans / glanduliferum??) (I include as many synonyms because this group is a mess for naming history that has nothing to do with biology) is found at lower elevations and is a warmer grower.


I'm not 100% convinced that these are total isolated species, but may be more of a big smeary mess of clinal variation where you have a smear of types from lowland to highland conditions. It's not that easy to get around in a tropical rainforest so it wouldn't surprise me if folks find a bunch of intergrades the more they explore.


If I remember PNG still has a glacier on it somewhere in excess of 15000 ft??

Crocodile Hunter (Steve Erwin helicoptered up to it and put his hands on the ice!)

Also in my zoo/herp days I worked with Boelins pythons from highland PNG that required air conditioning to keep them going.

I found this blurb on these pythons that are found in the 6000 to 8000 ft elevation range.

There are two seasons in New Guinea: the rainy (November through April) and the dry (May to October). The highlands of PNG and west Papua maintain a temperate climate, though frequent thunderstorms do occur during the dry season. The average maximum temperature in the lowlands is 90 degrees Fahrenheit. Temperatures in the mountains can reach the upper 80s, with intense ultraviolet exposure that can make it feel blisteringly hot. Yet, the temperature can also fall as low as the mid 40s at night. Humidity levels can range from the mid 60s to 90 percent


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## Happypaphy7 (Nov 13, 2016)

Thank you for the information, Rick.

So the lowland is hot and the highland is very warm during the day with significant drop at night (I assume not every night?)

Now I have to think about how to grow this thing, then.


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## JAB (Nov 13, 2016)

Did you work in the herp world Rick or just a hobby? Boelens are gorgeous! Never had the $$ for any myself but did keep some of the first Savu Island Pythons that I miss to this day!


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## Rick (Nov 13, 2016)

I was a supervisor of herps and aquariums at the Oklahoma city zoo for 13 years, but I've been out of the zoo biz since 95 when I started in ecotoxicology for a waste water engineering and consulting firm. I've hardly done any exotic herp stuff since, but periodically get to work with native species. Since most of my work is in aquatic tox I get to spend some time on amphibian issues.

I still have friends in the zoo biz so check in with them now and then for my herp fix too:wink:


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## Linus_Cello (Nov 14, 2016)

Rick said:


> I was a supervisor of herps and aquariums at the Oklahoma city zoo for 13 years, but I've been out of the zoo biz since 95 when I started in ecotoxicology for a waste water engineering and consulting firm. I've hardly done any exotic herp stuff since, but periodically get to work with native species. Since most of my work is in aquatic tox I get to spend some time on amphibian issues.
> 
> I still have friends in the zoo biz so check in with them now and then for my herp fix too:wink:



Do you do PDFs (frogs) with your orchids?


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## JAB (Nov 14, 2016)

Thats awesome Rick!


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## Rick (Nov 14, 2016)

Linus_Cello said:


> Do you do PDFs (frogs) with your orchids?



No, but the PDF's were a specialty I worked on at OKC. I published a paper in one of the early editions of Vivarium magazine on a mass production method of rearing PDF's I developed.:wink:


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## PaphMadMan (Nov 16, 2016)

Based on Braem, Paphiopedilum, second edition, (paraphrasing) it comes down to this...

Sepals without stripes, staminode shield smaller than the stigma with long-pointed apex.... P. glanduliferum. P. glanduliferum may never have been seen since the original description.

Sepals striped, staminode shield larger than the stigma without long-pointed apex... P. wilhelminiae or P. praestens.

Petals not or only slightly twisted, uniform deep purple, with few or no warts on margins near the base... P. wilhelminiae.

Petals distinctly twisted, striped, with several distinct warts along margins near the base... P. praestans.

P. gardineri was never validly published in a way that separates it from the above or clearly makes it synonymous with any above.


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## Happypaphy7 (Nov 16, 2016)

Thank you, Kirk.

I'll go have a closer look today.
It should be fully open now.


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## Rick (Nov 16, 2016)

Petals not or only slightly twisted, uniform deep purple, with few or no warts on margins near the base... P. wilhelminiae.

Petals distinctly twisted, striped, with several distinct warts along margins near the base... P. praestans

At least these two characters are clear enough in the pictures of the flowers I posted (except for the petal twisting aspect which is highly variable from flower to flower, age of flower, and mode of flower preservation).

Garay and followers really pushed on the petal twisting thing, but you'll almost never see a wilhelminae without twisted petals. If petal twisting is truly a character then there is a third/un-described species or variant that is sympatric with wilhelminae that only differs from the "true" wilhelminae on the basis of having twisted petals.


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