# Problem with dollgoldii



## troy (Aug 19, 2016)

This is treated the same as all my others, yet it is very different, is this genetic?


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## phraggy (Aug 20, 2016)

This looks too big to be a Dollgoldii ---- unless the one I have is too small!!!
Will try and find a pic of mine.

Ed


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## phraggy (Aug 20, 2016)

phraggy said:


> This looks too big to be a Dollgoldii ---- unless the one I have is too small!!!
> Will try and find a pic of mine.
> 
> Ed







Had this some 5yrs it now has 5 growths and the leafspan is 34cms. Is this dollgoldii or a straight armeniacum??

Ed


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

Ed, you have a dollgoldii, no way thats an armeniacum


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## gonewild (Aug 20, 2016)

phraggy said:


> Had this some 5yrs it now has 5 growths and the leafspan is 34cms. Is this dollgoldii or a straight armeniacum??
> 
> Ed



Looks like typical Dolgoldi


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## gonewild (Aug 20, 2016)

troy said:


> This is treated the same as all my others, yet it is very different, is this genetic?



Sometimes Dolgoldi plant genetics favor Roth and have bigger growth.


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

The growth is growing stolonous out of itself


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## Justin (Aug 20, 2016)

Not a problem...looks like a happy plant


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## gonewild (Aug 20, 2016)

troy said:


> The growth is growing stolonous out of itself



It is not growing "stolonous" out of itself. The stem it stretching by growing extra length between each leaf node.
The cause may be too little light.
Or it may be because you are applying some form of "stimulant" that causes cells to stretch lengthwise.


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## Happypaphy7 (Aug 20, 2016)

What Lance says. 
Just stretching a bit.

It would be logical to think this is caused by low light, but...
I have had a couple of plants ( one Maudiae hybrid, one parvi hybrid) and they were both among many others in very bright light. 
So the cause might just be plant being crazy. lol


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## JAB (Aug 20, 2016)

Just visited Theresa Hill and her Dollgoldii were HUGE!!!!!!! The flowers were easily 6+inches and the leaf span was probably pushing two feet.


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

I got it from her, the looonnngggg crown of this one is stiff like it's an inflourescence but it just keeps elongating


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## Happypaphy7 (Aug 20, 2016)

JAB said:


> Just visited Theresa Hill and her Dollgoldii were HUGE!!!!!!! The flowers were easily 6+inches and the leaf span was probably pushing two feet.



Yikes! Roth genes kicking in, I guess. 

I got one from her a couple of years ago. One growth mature plant, now 7 growths plant with about one foot wide. And I thought it was too big for me. 
Hasn't flowered yet, although it made this fake sheath last year. I think I see one or two more sheaths now.


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

I got the piece of crap plant, free plus shipping


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## Happypaphy7 (Aug 20, 2016)

Just an odd stretching. You don't know if it's a crap yet.


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

I've had it 2 years all it did is stretch, everything else I've had for 2 years has grown tremendously, want it? I paid 45.00. I'll give it to you free + shipping, I'm not to happy at beiing sold a piece of **** plant


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## Wendy (Aug 20, 2016)

How much light do you give it? In my experience these need quite a bit of light. Other than that it looks perfectly healthy. Try a brighter spot and I bet it starts growing normally.....and blooms.


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

It's with all my other plants 10 inches under a dual t8 full spectrum light fixture


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## MorandiWine (Aug 20, 2016)

$45 for a DG that size seems reasonable, especially knowing that Theresa sold it. She generally has fantastic plants. 

I agree that more light is needed as most DG's tend to lean more to the roth side of things light-wise. Two T-8's aint gonna cut it for roths and many roth hybrids. Sorry for the bluntness, but.......


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

Moreandiwine, I'm gonna take a picture of all my plants and post them here for you, including roth hybrids I use epsom salts in low doses every weekend with my fertilizer


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## Wendy (Aug 20, 2016)

Troy, I'd still try that one plant with more light. Do you perhaps have a nice sunny window that you could put it in?


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## MorandiWine (Aug 20, 2016)

Do epsom salt emit photons??


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## troy (Aug 20, 2016)

The explantion to the question you asked is too long to explain, besides I'm not a scientist, epsom salts mgso4 aids in absorption of other key elements


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## MorandiWine (Aug 20, 2016)

I understand that Troy. The point was that you can have perfect nutrition coverage but if the light is not adequate for that particular plant than you are missing a major component to properly growing a plant. 

Your other plants may seem fine with your light but not all plants are the same. They may be surviving but are they thriving? Are the conditions maximized to help them perform at their best? Again, I think not. "In general" roth and roth hybrids need more light than what you are providing. Many very well established growers have suggested that it is a light issue. I dont think that throwing a very well respected grower under the bus is totally fair when you are not doing what is best for the plant.


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## troy (Aug 21, 2016)

The only other thing I can do is set the light directly on the plant, also whether a grower is respected or not, every plant that comes out of a flask is not identical to it's sibling they are not electronics they are living things, do you not beleive that out of some flasks there is no possible way theresa would have a shitty plant? Face it I just got a bad one, if you don't beleive me I will post every plant I have how they are set growing in my grow area


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## MorandiWine (Aug 21, 2016)

Good luck Troy. 


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## gonewild (Aug 21, 2016)

The stretching of the stem is caused by a "hormone" imbalance. Low light levels result in a low production of certain hormones which cause an imbalance with other hormones and growth is altered from normal ideal form.

If your light intensity is on the low side of ideal for the individual plant it will/can cause the auxin level to be to high. A high auxin level will lead to cell elongation which results in a taller stem.

This could be aggravated by applications of products that contain high levels of auxins... like Kelp extracts. That's why the application of seaweeds often results in bigger growth.

Troy I'm guessing you are applying regular applications of Kelp or some bio stimulant.

(I'm using the word "hormone" as a generic term that refers to any of the natural PGRs.)

Even considering that your plant is growing a longer taller stem that does not mean that the condition is all that bad. The flowers may also be bigger as a result.


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## troy (Aug 21, 2016)




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## troy (Aug 21, 2016)

I havn't given this dollgoldii plant anything different than my other plants for the past 2 years, it's not getting enough light, I will set a light directly on it, right now my 2 full spectrum 6500 kelvin 32 watt bulbs are 12 inches above the plant


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## troy (Aug 21, 2016)




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## Justin (Aug 21, 2016)

It looks fine.


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## JAB (Aug 21, 2016)

You'd think being from Nor Cal he would be more chill


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## troy (Aug 21, 2016)

I just had high hopes for this one, maybe it will grow better for somebody else $5.00 + shipping it is roth 'early bird' x armeniacum 'golden globe'


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## John M (Aug 22, 2016)

It looks FINE! Paphs do that sometimes. It usually doesn't happen with the next growth, too. It's caused by something cultural.....basically, it's YOUR fault. That does not mean you're a bad grower, you're just not meeting the needs of that particular plant in order for it to grow a nice, compact leaf fan like you prefer. Stuff like this comes with the teritory. It's an uproven seedling. That's why you only paid $45. If it was a division of a plant that had already grown up and bloomed and was seen to be top notch, you'd have to pay hundreds for it. When you buy a seedling, you are "buying on spec". That is: (based on what you know of the parantage), you are speculating about what they will produce and since you like what you speculate you will get, you decided to buy the plant. It's NOT a matter of getting a shitty plant or not. What you got is a genetically unique individual plant that is unproven. That's what you paid for and that's what you got. Why all the bad temper? If you don't like speculating, never buy seedlings again. Only buy divisions of proven plants; but, be prepared to pay, big time for those!

So, YOU had high hopes. Is Theresa in control of what you think? NO! Plus, there's nothing wrong with the plant. It could very well grow a nice spike of fantastic flowers for you. It could very well produce a much more compact leaf fan the next time it grows one. It's a fact that certain wavelengths of light encourage "stretching" and others encourage much more compact growth. You need to do some research on your kind of lights and find out if there is an excess or deficiency in the light colour quality. Bad-mouthing Theresa is unjust and downright stupid. If you were my customer, I'd refuse to sell you anything else, ever again.


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

When I bought it 2 years ago the crown was stiff like it was going to flower then it did this ever since, so I guess I messed it up from day 1? And if my culture is so bad why are all my other plants fine, why doesn't anybody admit there are good and bad seedlings in a flask, I only started using kelp max the only hormone infused fertilizer I use this year, this stretching started 2 years ago


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## Happypaphy7 (Aug 22, 2016)

Calm down. You know the answer. It's no one's fault. It's the plant! lol

The only part I would consider unjust or rude was when you said "being sold a piece of ****" that to me sounded too harsh as if the nursery intentionally gave you some rootless plant covered with mealy bugs, and still won't admit or apologize. 

I hope Theresa doesn't read this comment. She is a nice pleasant person and donates to our forum, too. 

We all know that there is always uncertainty with living things.

While I would also prefer plants that grow "flat" for aesthetic reason, and better grower, your plant other wise looks fine. 
I have plants of the same batch ( Parvi x multi) that exhibit differences. It is only expected. 
Some are growing multiple growths, and one is still a single growth after three years. 
I have a paph that are getting strong light right by the window and stretch like your plant. 
Coincidence or not, but it also happens to be an armeniacum hybrid (x hang). I have two others of the same cross, and one is in sheath. Yay!!! And has wide leaves. The others all have narrow leaves like armeniacum.
I also have had ( currently one) a couple of Maudiae hybrids that did the same thing in the high light. The ones in quite a bit of shade grew fine except the leaf size of certain plants got huge. Could have been the age too. Not sure. 


I've seen your other plants. They are being grown well. 

The only time I blame the nursery is when the plant comes with lots of bugs or lots of disease marks. 

If I'm not happy with plants two years after the purchase, or even two months, you can't blame anyone. Especially when the plant is fine, other than being very slow and not looking completely normal.


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

Well dick buchter and I both bought one, we thought mine was going to bloom because of the crown swelling so instead of blooming it just expanded aarrgghhh, I admit it could partially be my fault, the last year I started using kelp max every other month and inocucor once a month


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## Lance Birk (Aug 22, 2016)

Give the -plant to someone else, Troy, today.

Everyone here seems to be forgetting one of the most important rules for orchid culture:

"The main reason plants (orchids) fail to flower is the absence of differentials between daytime and nighttime temperatures, summer to winter, of about 10° for a period of several weeks."

Light is critical, but so is air movement and proper watering technique.


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## gonewild (Aug 22, 2016)

troy said:


> Well dick buchter and I both bought one, we thought mine was going to bloom because of the crown swelling so instead of blooming it just expanded aarrgghhh, I admit it could partially be my fault, the last year I started using kelp max every other month and inocucor once a month



Muchas hormonas.

A. If you apply the wrong hormone at the wrong time you can cause a developing bud to become a leaf instead of a flower. (bad)

Same hormone

B. If you apply the right hormone at the right time you can cause a flower bud to grow a leaf. (good)

Kelp contains hormones and don't assume that growth results will always be what you desire.


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

my day temps from 12:00 p.m. are 88 - 90 my temps and humidity are very regulated, my lights are on for 13 hours off for 11 hours the temps start dropping at about 8:30 p.m. the lights go off at 7:30. by 2:00 a.m. the temp is 75 at time off lights on at 5:30 a.m.it is 72


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## Cheyenne (Aug 22, 2016)

I will give this a try. 
Troy,
I had many plants in a setup like yours on shelves. With the same T-8 lights and same color temperature. I then put some under a 400watt HPS light. Some grew better under the new higher intensity light, some did not, out of the same cross. I put them back under the T-8 lights. It may not matter for that plant if the T8's are 12 inch away or 1" away, they just may not be providing enough light. You may not know or be able to definitely say until you increase the direct intensity. Then you can say it's not the light but it's a bad plant.


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## gego (Aug 22, 2016)

troy said:


> I just had high hopes for this one, maybe it will grow better for somebody else $5.00 + shipping it is roth 'early bird' x armeniacum 'golden globe'



Troy, I can give it a new home for a while. $5 and no shipping. I will pick it up sometime this month when I go to Sac.

You can always take it back when you miss it. LOL.

How's that? It will give you some time to change your mind and cool off.

I have her plant too and it's growing really well but the sheath has been there since I got it (May) and now I can see it slowwwwwly opening. I really hope this will be a bud.


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## Happypaphy7 (Aug 22, 2016)

It's sold already.


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

Suzy said first but I'm gonna hand it to gego because shipping sucks and I'm terrible with electronic transfers


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## gego (Aug 22, 2016)

troy said:


> Suzy said first but I'm gonna hand it to gego because shipping sucks and I'm terrible with electronic transfers



Hahaha. And you can take it back. I will check my schedule to go up your way.


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

Ok, I'm not to interested in getting it back, more interested to see if it improves under your care, I don't care for dollgoldi much, for that kind of flower I have 2 harold koopowitzs growing very well


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## gego (Aug 22, 2016)

Happypaphy7 said:


> It's sold already.



Hahahaha, didn't know there was a bidding.:rollhappy:


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## John M (Aug 22, 2016)

troy said:


> Suzy said first but I'm gonna hand it to gego because shipping sucks and I'm terrible with electronic transfers



Are you serious, Troy? Way to make friends, bud.


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

Well john, if I was susan I guess I'd be mad, so it should go to susan, I'll have to have my girlfriend do all the electronic crap, I screw up electronics, dammit, sorry gego suzy had it first aaarrgghh please don't hate me


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## JAB (Aug 22, 2016)

Troy, out of curiosity are you 12 years old?


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## troy (Aug 22, 2016)

Hahaha well I hate doing electronic crap, I have no patience for it


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## gego (Aug 23, 2016)

No problem Troy, please send it to Suzy. If I saw her offer before I posted I would have not done it. 

Next time you have a plant that grows like that, I will be interested to do the experiment. Just kidding, you have really healthy beautiful plants. Thanks for sharing that picture to us.


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## John M (Aug 23, 2016)

Yes, gego is right. You do have a fine collection of nice, healthy looking plants. I should've said something before now because I did admire your photos of the whole group. Also, maybe Suzy would mail you a cheque?


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## gego (Aug 23, 2016)

BTW, I love your vandas John. They are very well grown. Is it possible to ship to Ca?


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## JAB (Aug 23, 2016)

"Patience" was not where I was going


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## John M (Aug 24, 2016)

Thanks gego. I'm almost out of Vandas at the moment; but, I intend to get more soon. However, the last I heard was that exporting to the USA is a huge problem. I may look into this again in the near future though. I'd like to ship to customers in the US. I get a lot of inquiries. Thanks for your interest.


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