# Cychnoches peruviana



## Greenpaph (Aug 4, 2006)

Currently in bloom.


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## Jon in SW Ohio (Aug 4, 2006)

That is awesome! Now I really hope mine blooms this year!

Thanks!

Jon
________
 HERBALAIRE VAPORIZER REVIEW


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## Mahon (Aug 4, 2006)

Nice male flowers! Have you bloomed it female yet? Looks great!

-Pat


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## bench72 (Aug 4, 2006)

Gosh, there's really a lot of stuff going on in that flower... i can't decide if it's the shape of the staminode or the frilly lip or all the spotting that's wonderful... maybe all...


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## Heather (Aug 4, 2006)

Beautiful! 
I was just talking about Cycnoches the other day, and how amusing I found the pollen. :evil: 

Seriously though, this one almost reminds me a little of a Gongora. Are they related?


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## Greenpaph (Aug 4, 2006)

Mahon said:


> Nice male flowers! Have you bloomed it female yet? Looks great!
> 
> -Pat



Not yet. It has bloomed every year for the past 3 years, but not female.

thanks


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## likespaphs (Aug 5, 2006)

Heather said:


> Seriously though, this one almost reminds me a little of a Gongora. Are they related?



well...they're both orchids.
the subfamily is the same, but the tribe and subtribe are both different


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## Rick (Aug 5, 2006)

That is a very cool flower Peter:clap: :clap: 

Does it have a fragrance?


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## Mahon (Aug 5, 2006)

_Gongora_ is located under Subfamily _Epidendroideae_, Tribe _Gongoreae_, Subtribe _Stanhopinae_... _Gongora_ is closely related to _Stanhopea_, _Acineta_, _Coryanthes_, etc...

_Cycnoches_ is located under Subfamily _Epidendroideae_, Tribe _Cymbidiae_, Subtribe _Catasetinae_... _Cycnoches_ is closely related to _Catasetum_, _Mormodes_, _Clowesia_, etc...

Though the flowers are "similar" looking, they are quite different... the two genera split apart at the Tribal level... flowers of _Gongora_ are bi-sexual, while flowers of _Cycnoches_ are uni-sexual... there are other additional differences between the genera, but I am too tired to write it all...

-PM


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## Heather (Aug 5, 2006)

Grazi!

(I was too tired (read: lazy) to look up the info myself...) :wink:


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## Marco (Aug 5, 2006)

I love the plant. Mini's are always great. Thanks Peter. =)


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## Mycorrhizae (Aug 5, 2006)

With regard to male vs. female flowers, one Florida grower I talked to recommended lowering the light level for a better chance to get female flowers. Apparently under certain conditions an inflorescence can bear both male and female flowers, but it's really unusual.



bench72 said:


> Gosh, there's really a lot of stuff going on in that ...


This sounds like what Nina Garcia would say to the next contestant about to be booted from Project Runway!


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## Heather (Aug 5, 2006)

Mycorrhizae said:


> This sounds like what Nina Garcia would say to the next contestant about to be booted from Project Runway!



Hey, I think she said exactly that about Angela's outfit a couple weeks ago. If only she'd been booted....:evil:


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## bench72 (Aug 5, 2006)

Sounds like I need to watch this show!


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## Jmoney (Aug 5, 2006)

very interesting!


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## Greenpaph (Aug 5, 2006)

Mycorrhizae said:


> With regard to male vs. female flowers, one Florida grower I talked to recommended lowering the light level for a better chance to get female flowers. Apparently under certain conditions an inflorescence can bear both male and female flowers, but it's really unusual.
> 
> Thanks Mycorrhizae,
> 
> I will have to try this next year! I do grow it up high with the Catts.


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## DavidM (Aug 6, 2006)

I love spots...and this one has plenty


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## Gideon (Aug 7, 2006)

Lovely, one of mine just started spiking...not sure which one


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## littlefrog (Aug 7, 2006)

I got a CHM on Cyc. peruviana years ago, which I named after my father. But, I'm pretty sure it is gone now. Sure is a cute species. It kind of set off my Cycnoches addiction (up to about 30 linear feet of bench space at this point...).

The female flower on this species is nothing spectacular. Rather, it is spectacular (big!) but completely indistinguishable from almost every other female cycnoches flower in this section. I much prefer the male flowers. But, of course you need both kinds if you actually want to propagate the darn thing...


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## Mycorrhizae (Aug 7, 2006)

Earlier in this thread I mentioned that there can be both male and female flowers on the same inflorescence. Well - I just happen to have an example. I know this is a thread about _Cycnoches peruviana_, but this is Cycnoches Jean E. Monnier (_barthiorum x cooperi_) with the male flowers in the upper portion of the photo and the female flowers in the lower portion. I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out this condition is more common with hybrids than with species.


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## Mahon (Aug 7, 2006)

This is very interesting... quite an odd occurance... I am now going to fool with my _Catasetinae_ and see what it takes to get both female and male flowers... =)

-PM


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## Greenpaph (Aug 7, 2006)

Mychorrhizae,

Thanks for the lesson! Great photo!


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## Rick (Aug 12, 2006)

Greenpaph said:


> Mychorrhizae,
> 
> Thanks for the lesson! Great photo!




That is cool Thanks too!

Speaking of multi form flowers, does anyone have experience with Dimorphicus lowii? Big vandaceous species with a difficult reputation.

There are two distinct flower forms on the same plant (and sometimes same spike), but I believe they are typical bisexual orchid flowers.


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## likespaphs (Aug 12, 2006)

Rick said:


> ...Speaking of multi form flowers, does anyone have experience with {Dimorphorchis lowii}?...



no, but i want to...
i didn't know it was reputedly hard to grow.
also, i thought the upper flowers were male, the lower, female or viseversa


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## Rick (Aug 13, 2006)

likespaphs said:


> no, but i want to...
> i didn't know it was reputedly hard to grow.
> also, i thought the upper flowers were male, the lower, female or viseversa




Now this is very interesting. After a google search I found 3 groups of answers.

1) There are male and female flowers. (Most of theses seem to be verbatum quotes from a single source, and most are sales adds).

2) No mention of flower sex at all. 

3) Both flowers are "fertile" or hermaphroditic.(from 2 different research articles).

The research article from Kew Gardens (which I can only access small excerpts) uses vocabulary that suggests typical orchid hermaphrodism, but never plain out says it. An excerpt from an article on D. rosii by John Wood's is explicit.

Also since this genus is in the vanda group, that would be real odd to have unisex flowers.

Sounds like a bit of a debate.

As far as culture. I've heard of high losses with imports, and slow growth of established plants, and they have to be huge to flower.

I think we need to research this one more:clap:


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## littlefrog (Aug 14, 2006)

I don't think both types of flowers are fertile. Cyc. barthiorum has been shown to have hermaphroditic flowers that are intergrade between male and female (those may be fertile, I don't know). I think that was published in 'Orchids' some years back. Perhaps others in that section (I think that is Eucycnoches) such as herrenhusanum, cooperi, etc, will also have similar intergrade flowers, although I don't know that I've ever seen one.

It can be difficult to distinguish between male and female flowers in the other section (if you haven't seen both kinds, anyway). That would be species like chlorochilon and warscewiczii (which are hopelessly confused in cultivation, by the way), and loddigessii. But they are sexually dimorphic. 

Some species do get huge. Others, like barthiorum, cooperi, and herrenhusanum, tend to stay smaller. Although they can get big. I imported some barthiorum maybe 5 years ago that were at least two feet tall pseudobulbs. I have never been able to get one even half that tall in cultivation, and they will bloom on plants with 6-8" pseudobulbs.

I was touring with a talk on Cycnoches a few years ago, so I did a lot of research. George Carr wrote a great paper (150 years of confusion, I think it was titled), but a quick google search doesn't turn it up anymore. Maybe somebody else can find it...


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## Rick (Aug 14, 2006)

Orchids Limited has selfed Dimorphorchis, but I can't find on their culture sheet any mention of the sex of the two flower types or if they selfed between or within the two flower types.

I'll email Jerry.


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## Rick (Aug 16, 2006)

Jerry responded that both flowers have pollen and stigmatic surfaces, but in a mass pollination attempt it seems that a pod was set in only one combination.

He has a friend with a plant in massive spike now (I think its the same one they pollinated last time), and they are going to try various selfing combinations again. He'll keep us posted too:wink:


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## combadao (Dec 11, 2006)

littlefrog said:


> George Carr wrote a great paper (150 years of confusion, I think it was titled), but a quick google search doesn't turn it up anymore. Maybe somebody else can find it...


Hi

Just for the records, the link for the artcile is

http://orchidjudges.org/abs/abs001.html

All the best
Jaime


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