# Paph. vejvarutianum



## eggshells (Nov 10, 2016)

This is interesting plant. Its mislabeled as herrmanii. Obviously its not, more like coccineum or vejvarutianum. I think its more like vejvarutianum because of the plant size. 

What do you guys think? 




Paph. vejvarutianum by paphioman, on Flickr




Paph. vejvarutianum by paphioman, on Flickr


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## abax (Nov 10, 2016)

I have no idea what it is except very shiny and very, very
pretty.


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## labskaus (Nov 11, 2016)

Very pretty, indeed!

I've learned that coccineum can be pretty large. I've got one that looks much like yours in size. My vejvarutianum has lighter colours. When that species was first introduced the plants were misidentified as charlesworthii cos the foliage just looks like that, with the typical purple spots and bands pattern at the base of the leaves that charlesworthii has.


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## naoki (Nov 11, 2016)

This group is confusing, but doesn't the narrow leaf look more close to P. coccineum? At least, P. coccineum I used to have had similar leaves as yours which was much narrower than my P. vejvarutianum (from Andy's). The leaf lengths were similar between the two species (both of them were mature multigrowth plants). My P. vejvarutianum does have heavy red coloration at the leaf base which Carsten is talking about. But P. coccineum has these spots, too, right?

How does the bottom of staminode look like? Does it have a notch like this illustration? http://www.orchid.or.jp/orchid/people/tanaka/orchid/org/shinshu/enshinshu21.html
I don't think my P. vejvarutianum had this notch, but I can't clearly see the bottom in my photos.


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## ORG (Nov 11, 2016)

It is very easy to identify Paph. vejvarutianum. When you look to the backside, then you can notice a bract, which Looks like the bract from charlesworthii.






Best greetings

Olaf


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## SlipperFan (Nov 11, 2016)

Interesting, Olaf. Who would think to look at the bract!


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## Bjorn (Nov 12, 2016)

Thanks Olaf, has already checked, althouh my coccineums are gone, the vejvarutianums have speckles like charlies. Looking at the remains of the coccineums, it seems as if they do not have those. Then, how to remember?
Thanks again
B


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## Rick (Nov 12, 2016)

http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=42377

It's hard to see the bracts in these pics, but they are finely dusted with purple specks and are not glossy like the purple spotted bracts of charlesworthii or gratrixianum.

Also the longest leaves on this plant are 5" (13 cm).

In comparison to Olaf's picture I see another difference in that the flower stems are solid purple in my plant versus spotted green/purple in the vejvarutianum.


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## naoki (Nov 12, 2016)

Thank you, Olaf!

Rick, is the staminode shape of yours similar to the illustration in Dr. Tanaka's site? It looks a bit different. But the leaves are the narrow type (same as what I used to have). Eggshell's and yours also have the green margin around the petals as mentioned in Dr. Tanaka's.

Here is mine from Andy's.



Paphiopedilum vejvarutianum on Flickr
Color balance is quite off, but it has the bract similar to Olaf's, and the width:length ratio of leaves are much bigger (wider). The inflorescence stem is as dark as Rick's.


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## Rick (Nov 12, 2016)

naoki said:


> Thank you, Olaf!
> 
> Rick, is the staminode shape of yours similar to the illustration in Dr. Tanaka's site? It looks a bit different. But the leaves are the narrow type (same as what I used to have). Eggshell's and yours also have the green margin around the petals as mentioned in Dr. Tanaka's.
> 
> Color balance is quite off, but it has the bract similar to Olaf's, and the width:length ratio of leaves are much bigger (wider). The inflorescence stem is as dark as Rick's.



Mine is a dead ringer for what Averyanov has named as P. barbigerum var. lockianum (2002) in his 2003 edition of Slipper Orchids of Vietnam. This appears to be the same as what Perner and Herrmann named as P. cocineum in 2000.


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## naoki (Nov 15, 2016)

Eggshells, I'm curious, how does the bract (and staminode) look like?


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## eggshells (Nov 16, 2016)

Thanks for the information. Here are the staminode and bract photos.


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## Rick (Nov 16, 2016)

That's more coccineum like to me Eggshells.

What's the leaf span?


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## naoki (Nov 17, 2016)

Thank you eggshells.

Here, we can see the bracts of Olaf's P. b. coccineum:
http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=13430&page=2
Similar to eggshell's. Xavier posted that there are big P. coccineum and small ones (depending on the locality), so it is probably the big one?

But comparing the photo of Olaf's P. vejvarutianum (in the 1st page of this thread) with the 3rd photo of Olaf's P. b. coccineum, the difference isn't too clear for my untrained eyes. I can see that mine has the bigger dots similar to what Rick mentioned. But Olaf's P. vejvarutianum seems to have smaller dots.

With regard to the staminode, I haven't checked the original description by Perner and Herman (2000), but it looks like most P. b. coccineum doesn't have the notch at the bottom of the staminode (which you can see in the illustration of Dr. Tanaka's). Averyanov’s book doesn't show the notch (he described a synonym P. b. lockianum in 2002). I wonder what is going on.


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## eggshells (Nov 21, 2016)

Alright. Thanks all for the input. Paph. coccineum it is.


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