# Roots Completely Underwater?



## Chris (Oct 6, 2008)

I thought the paph root system liked moisture with pockets of air, but I recently saw very robust paphs growing in a bowls of water where the entire root system was always completely underwater. I guess they don't rot because water excludes the air. 

Why not just grow hydroponically? Does air circulation benefit the roots in traditional potting mixtures beyond preventing rot? Help me understand what's going on. 


Thanks!
Chris


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## paphioboy (Oct 6, 2008)

Chris, are you positively sure its paphs and not phrags..? As far as I know, phrags can be grown with their pots partially standing in water and the roots submerged. And they LIKE it! But paphs, I don't think so.. A grower I know who grows paphs in SH told me that paphs can have their roots partially submerged in RUNNING water (to provide continuous flow of oxygen) but NEVER in stagnant water...


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## Candace (Oct 6, 2008)

> A grower I know who grows paphs in SH told me that paphs can have their roots partially submerged in RUNNING water (to provide continuous flow of oxygen) but NEVER in stagnant water...



Beg to differ. Of course I didn't do it on purpose.
http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=8643&highlight=paph+francisco+fierre



> Why not just grow hydroponically?


 Some people do grow this way. But, stagnant water can get gross. There are some folks that only have one or two plants and grow them in glass jars and vases. It takes some maintenance. And probably more space than a 4 inch. pot. And the water can't get too cold or the plant will rot. So there are some drawbacks.


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## Hera (Oct 6, 2008)

Its true, they can be grown completely submerged. I don't know the exact nutrient balance used, but as long as there is no air, there is no rot. They seem to do well. I will try to find you a website to get more info.


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## gonewild (Oct 6, 2008)

Paph roots grow fine in standing water as long as they "grow" into the water.
But you can't just put soil grown roots into water and expect them not to rot. If you have the bottoms of your pots standing in water the roots will grow down into the water and be very happy. However if you move the pot away from the water, the water grown roots quickly die in the air.

Growing hydroponically (only in water) is not an easy culture to manage.


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## Ron-NY (Oct 6, 2008)

gonewild said:


> Paph roots grow fine in standing water as long as they "grow" into the water.
> But you can't just put soil grown roots into water and expect them not to rot. If you have the bottoms of your pots standing in water the roots will grow down into the water and be very happy. However if you move the pot away from the water, the water grown roots quickly die in the air.
> 
> Growing hydroponically (only in water) is not an easy culture to manage.



I concur with Lance...Orchid roots are adaptable but there adaption technique appears to develop during their growth. Aerial roots can't adapt to being placed into a medium. Roots developed in a medium can't adapt to water and vice versa. But from semi hydroponic culture, as I am sure Candace can attest more so than I, orchids are paced in this culture at the time of new root growth so the new roots can adapt to the new medium. Most of the old root system with die. I would assume the same would be true with a true hydroponic culture.


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## paphioboy (Oct 7, 2008)

Oopsss.... Sorry. I have to take back what I said...  Candace, I'm sorry I forgot about your (angthong x suk) hybrid... BTW, how's it doing after you punched holes in the plastic cup its in..? Did the roots that were submerged in water ended up growing nicely..? 



> I concur with Lance...Orchid roots are adaptable but there adaption technique appears to develop during their growth. Aerial roots can't adapt to being placed into a medium. Roots developed in a medium can't adapt to water and vice versa



So that explains why some of my paphs always lose a few good roots when repotted into a more moist/dry medium (as I don't use a standard potting mix, just whatever is available at the time..)..  AArrgghhh!!! Paphs are such crazy plants..!!!! :crazy: But I guess that's why we love them so much...


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## Candace (Oct 7, 2008)

My plant bloomed out fine and its roots look good from what I can see going down into the media. Of course, had I done this on purpose the plant would have been dead in a week!


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## biothanasis (Oct 7, 2008)

Thank you all for the info on this matter!!!!


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## gonewild (Oct 7, 2008)

paphioboy said:


> So that explains why some of my paphs always lose a few good roots when repotted into a more moist/dry medium (as I don't use a standard potting mix, just whatever is available at the time..)..  AArrgghhh!!! Paphs are such crazy plants..!!!! :crazy: But I guess that's why we love them so much...



If you are only changing media moisture content that is not likely the reason the roots die. A drastic change yes but a slight change no.
More likely the reason the roots die is because they get damaged when you repot them. Small cracks in the brittle roots can cause death of the root. Also damage to the root hairs can cause a plant to abort the now useless root.


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## cassie (Oct 7, 2008)

Hi Chris,
I have a Paph. delenatii growing with the roots completely submerged in worm tea at the moment. It has been submerged for quite a while now. Right after putting in it grew 3 new roots and a new leaf. I've been checking it frequently as to keep the water level up and I noticed that I have a new root emerging. I have not noticed any damage to the old roots that were in media. Some members of my los where so impressed with what I showed them that they did the same and they are having good responses.
Here's a picture:


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## Chris (Oct 7, 2008)

That's really remarkable growth. I suspect it would take a LOT longer to achieve those results using a traditional potting mixture. It would be great if you could follow up on a few more things: 

1) Worm tea? 

2) Keeping the water clean


-Chris


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## cassie (Oct 7, 2008)

Chris,
Worm tea is made from dissolving worm castings in water. It is a organic fetilizer. I don't know the numbers on it though.
I change the water (worm tea) once a week. I have had no troubles so far.


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## NYEric (Oct 8, 2008)

Worm poop tea! :rollhappy:


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## cassie (Oct 8, 2008)

Yep and it works


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## paphioboy (Oct 8, 2008)

Whoa..!!! That is super interesting... I can see how fat the root at the bottom of the pic is... BTW, how do you suspend the plant so that its stable, cassie..? thx..


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## Yoyo_Jo (Oct 8, 2008)

Very interesting...

Cassie, how much of the worm castings do you use for how much water? Seems to me I have a bag of it kicking around somewhere...


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## NYEric (Oct 9, 2008)

EEwwwww! No tea at Joanne's thank you! oke:


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## cassie (Oct 9, 2008)

Paphioboy,
The top of the vase is on the small side so it kinda just sits there. There is no need for it to be stationary in water.

Joanne,
For 30 gallons or so of water I use 6 cups of castings. Everyone dilutes them differently. There should be instructions on the packaging about recommended dilution.


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