# Inocucor Garden Solution



## Carper (Jan 6, 2019)

Hi All,

After reading very positive feedback on the above, does anyone know when or if this product is available in the UK or Europe.

Thanks
Gary
UK


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## NYEric (Jan 7, 2019)

Ray Barkalou [sic] here is a distributor and may know.


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## Ray (Jan 8, 2019)

The company has grown significantly and renamed itself Concentric Ag.

The last time I spoke to them about it, I was told the British authorities appeared to be near-to-impossible to reason with concerning the importation of "live biologicals", and I am not aware of any activity in EU, either.


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## NYEric (Jan 8, 2019)

Psst, psst, I got the stuff you need man! :evil:


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## Ozpaph (Jan 8, 2019)

Do you have more shampoo, Eric?


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## cnycharles (Jan 8, 2019)

Ozpaph said:


> Do you have more shampoo, Eric?





 when I open Tapatalk and see this line in the header thread, I just have to look and see whats going on ...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Ray (Jan 8, 2019)

Not quite as complete, in terms of number of species, but consider EM-1, available from amazon.uk.


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## myxodex (Jan 8, 2019)

Thanks Ray, I'll have a look at that. I'm another one who would like to get Inocucor in the UK.

I suspect the issue may be with the EU trading regulations. There are also a bunch of fungicides and insecticides we cannot get here either, although some with good reason, still it's a bit of a nuisance. I tried a Trichoderma preparation (fungus) which was promoted as a beneficial microbe and sold by hydroponics vendors, but it was actually harmful to the Paphs I used it on. I seem to remember Roth (Xavier) reporting similar problems with a Trichoderma prep. As a result I don't trust any of the numerous preparations that are available from the hydroponics outlets over here, especially as many contain Trichoderma and others don't give details. 

The hydroponics market is mildly amusing, worth a wee browse of some vendor sites. If Inocucor producers could show good results with Cannabis then maybe the Hydroponics vendors might put in the effort to get around the import issues. Also maybe a wacky name would help, after all it would need to resonate with the likes of Big Bud, Bud Candy, Canna Boost, Voodoo Juice, Green Haze, Tarantula Liquid, Diamond Nectar, Funky Fungi, Nirvana, Buddhas Tree Advanced Meta-Boost, Xtreme Mykos, Supa Stiky, Swell, Sensi ... and so on. There are also many products claiming to supply beneficial microbes. It's a big market and judging by the prices of some of these products (eg. Dutch pro "Explode" @ £299 for 5 ltr), these are growers with deep pockets. During the post 2008 recession, sadly many orchid vendors here in the EU went bust, the hydroponics market in contrast seems to have bucked the trend. Where grass grows the cash flows.

On a more serious note I do know that many research labs here routinely import specific bacterial strains from the ATCC in the US. Also plant beneficial microbial preparations are sold here for horticultural purposes, the question is are all of them produced within the EU. I will have to check it out, but I think one of them may be from Australia, and if so, there will be a way to do it.


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## Ray (Jan 9, 2019)

Garden Solution (I'll be SO happy when the "Synergro" name is fully adopted) has been shown to produce stockier, bushier cannabis plants. I guess that's why the guy was able to get his exorbitant price for the stuff.

I think that the decision for Concentric Ag to not pursue the U.K. market was simply related to "bang for the buck": difficult legislative hurdles coupled with a relatively small market push it down the priority list.


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## Carper (Jan 9, 2019)

You say "not to pursue the UK market" Ray, but does that include Europe?

Has anyone within the EU have any recommendations on any similar products and their successes?

Gary
UK


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## myxodex (Jan 11, 2019)

Carper said:


> You say "not to pursue the UK market" Ray, but does that include Europe?
> 
> Has anyone within the EU have any recommendations on any similar products and their successes?
> 
> ...



As to the first point, I agree, maybe Holland would a be better option given brexit uncertainty. Holland has a strong horticultural sector and if the language barrier is an issue, the Dutch tend to speak English pretty well.

As to second point, I couldn't recommend any product available in the EU as I haven't tested any with orchids. All I can do is share my own prejudice as to the type of product I would look for.

I have some reservations about the whole effective microbes or EM approach as based on the work of Higa. The results even by his own admission are not reproducible. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effective_microorganism
So when you see Lactobacillus, Rhodopseudomonas, and Saccharomyces cerevisiae (aka baker's yeast) listed as the main species included, then you're looking at one of the EM formulations. It's not inconceivable that this stuff might have utility but I wouldn't spend any money on it. I'm more likely to experiment with vermicompost tea instead.

I've become very interested in the work on PGPB's or plant growth promoting bacteria. There is some very good research in this field. It turns out that most of the PGPB's share a number of activities. Approx 70% of them produce auxin (IAA), many release bound or insoluble phosphates, they produce siderophores which promote micronutrient uptake by roots and also suppress opportunitistic bacteria, they inhibit pathogenic fungi by excreting chitinases and glucanases, they relieve stress by modulating feedback in the ethylene pathway and they are able to induce systemic resistance to pathogens in plants. Here is an older review with a list of commercialised PGPB species in section 2.1: https://www.hindawi.com/journals/scientifica/2012/963401/ 
You will note that bunch of these are from the Bacillus and Pseudomonas genera.

Ray posted a link to a list of bacteria typically included in Garden Solution and as far as I remember there was a good overlap with known PGPB species. This suggested to me that the guy's who developed Garden Solution had done their homework. The only product that I've found here that demonstrates some knowledge of PGPB research is this one:

https://thenutrientcompany.com/products/tnc-bactorr-s13

The bacteria are all from the genus Bacillus and are species which appear repeatedly in various PGPB lists. The selection is a bit limited, but there is an obvious reason for this. Bacillus species are spore formers, and so they can produce it as a stable powder as the spores will last for years in a viable condition. I might experiment a bit with this product this summer, as some strains of B. licheniformis produce chitinase which should inhibit fungal pathogens, it would be nice to know whether the strain they used has this activity, and I can test for this. Also Bacillus species are quite tough and adaptable and would be more likely than non-spore formers to survive in orchid potting media if they dry out occasionally. 

This product is supplemented with humic acid and kelp extract. Both of these have been reported to help with the establishment of and effectiveness of PGPB's in various applications. Garden Solution uses a similar system, but with a much more complex mixture of bacteria. Using seaweed extract and humic acid together after introduction of the PGPB's will help to maintain them in the pot medium as well, remember if you want them to survive you need to feed them as well.


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## Ray (Jan 12, 2019)

Inocucor was started by, and their products developed by women, not guys.


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## Ray (Jan 12, 2019)

Garden Solution contains several species of beneficial bacteria *and* fungi. It is the only product on the market that contains both, and that is one of its distinct advantages, as bacteria and fungi offer different mechanisms of plant support and protection.

I have recently attended a couple of seminars on the subject, and a researcher from Premier Horticulture, the "Pro-Mix" manufacturer, shared some interesting info, presented in a way even I could grasp: 

Beneficial bacteria primarily protect plants by competing with pathogenic bacteria, and exuding antibiotics into the rhizosphere that kill pathogens and prevent them from harming the plant. Beneficial fungi also compete with others and exude antibiotics, but have the additional benefit of parasitizing them, as well. They generally do that through a mechanism of cell wall degradation, which not only kills the pathogens, but converts them into nutrients that can be taken up by the plant. Besides those, the colonization of the roots by the microorganisms offers additional, significant benefits.

As the fungi grow, they extend hyphae throughout the root zone and potting medium, and mycorrhizae into the plants' root cells. The hyphae become an extensive network capable of absorbing water and nutrients throughout the rhizosphere. The mycorrhizae are the pathway that the fungi use to pump nutrients into the plant in exchange for sugars. As plants' roots can only absorb nutrients that are in close proximity to them, the hyphae network plays the significant role of "extending the reach" of the roots, enabling uptake from the entire volume of potting medium. The fungal hyphae absorb water and nutrients, transfers them to the fungi, who in turn, transfer them via their mycorrhizae directly into plants' root cells. Fungal hyphae are apparently particularly good at absorbing and transferring phosphorus, copper, manganese, and zinc. Additionally, fungal hyphae can absorb and trap excessive levels of dissolved solids, precluding them from stressing the plants.


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## Carper (Jan 13, 2019)

myxodex said:


> As to the first point, I agree, maybe Holland would a be better option given brexit uncertainty. Holland has a strong horticultural sector and if the language barrier is an issue, the Dutch tend to speak English pretty well.
> 
> As to second point, I couldn't recommend any product available in the EU as I haven't tested any with orchids. All I can do is share my own prejudice as to the type of product I would look for.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the reply. Will be something I will look into further to see if there are any similarities between both products. It would be good for the Inocucor to get it's licence but not holding out for it. 
#
Thanks

Gary
UK


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## NYEric (Jan 14, 2019)

Ozpaph said:


> Do you have more shampoo, Eric?


A little.


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## Brabantia (Jan 25, 2019)

If I remember well tea made with compost (compost tea) is also a good source of beneficial organisms for plants.


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## Ray (Jan 25, 2019)

Worm tea, as well, although such "natural" populations tend to be very limited in diversity, hence scope.


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