# A problematic cattleya lueddemanniana



## monocotman (Aug 12, 2020)

This arrived and was described as a pale lueddemanniana but the growth cycle is all wrong. Instead of growing and flowering in the spring like the rest of this species it grows over spring and summer and flowers in August. It’s in flower with lueddemanniana ‘cerro verde’ which makes me wonder whether it’s the same cross with warscewiczii as this clone is supposed to be.
it would account for the growth cycle, larger plant and flowering period.
whatever it is, it’s a nice thing with pale lilac flowers and a vigorous grower,




David


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## dodidoki (Aug 12, 2020)

I think it is an outstanding excellent clone of this species.


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## abax (Aug 12, 2020)

Absolutely gorgeous David. Is it fragrant?


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## DrLeslieEe (Aug 13, 2020)

It has the shape of a lueddemaniana and could very well be the concolor form.

Besides the reason you give of the different flowering season (which my lueddemanianas have done before even after settling and blooming consistently in the right spring/summer seasons), there may be other reasons:

1. concolors flower later than the type
2. recent imports bloom off season up to 2 years while adjusting (esp if from Southern Hemisphere)
3. second growth of year gets strong enough to bloom a second time.
4. it would be almost impossible to have warscewiczii as the second ‘hybrid’ parent as concolor warscewicziis are very rare, and almost never use to create concolor hybrids. 
5. The possibility of warneri albescent is more likely as this plant or as other parent (bred with concolor lueddemaniana).

Just some ideas to consider.


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## monocotman (Aug 13, 2020)

Dr Leslie, I was hoping that we could tap into your knowledge on cattleyas.
I’ve had a very similar response to yours when I posted this on the facebook forum for ’cattleya lovers’ from a guy who sounds like he knows what he’s talking about.
This plant has flowered like this for six years now, since I received it.
This makes me think that the later growth and flowering is genetic in origin and that this clone is probably a pure lueddemanniana.
It also has a couple of well developed horns on the column, typical of lueddemanniana.


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## monocotman (Aug 13, 2020)

Photos of the ‘horns’ at either side of the tip of the column. Diagnostic for lueddemanniana.




David


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## Pinebark (Aug 13, 2020)

It's gorgeous whatever it is.


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## southernbelle (Aug 13, 2020)

monocotman said:


> This arrived and was described as a pale lueddemanniana but the growth cycle is all wrong. Instead of growing and flowering in the spring like the rest of this species it grows over spring and summer and flowers in August. It’s in flower with lueddemanniana ‘cerro verde’ which makes me wonder whether it’s the same cross with warscewiczii as this clone is supposed to be.
> it would account for the growth cycle, larger plant and flowering period.
> whatever it is, it’s a nice thing with pale lilac flowers and a vigorous grower,
> View attachment 21709
> ...


Love this, what’s its name?


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## Guldal (Aug 13, 2020)

I can only join the chorus: it's gorgeous...especially that lip! *pant, pant*


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## BrucherT (Aug 14, 2020)

I’ll be hoping for this one. Someday.


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## monocotman (Aug 14, 2020)

This is the clone’s best flowering from two years ago. Four big flowers close to 17cm across. The front lead then split and produced two smaller bulbs and since it also needed repotting, we are not quite back to the size of this growth. The first photo is the more accurate one for colour.




David


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## PeteM (Aug 14, 2020)

monocotman said:


> Photos of the ‘horns’ at either side of the tip of the column. Diagnostic for lueddemanniana.
> View attachment 21721
> 
> View attachment 21722
> ...


I really like these horn pics


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## Ozpaph (Aug 15, 2020)

that is just gorgeous!
Dr Leslie is the fountain of knowledge!


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## DrLeslieEe (Aug 15, 2020)

Ozpaph said:


> that is just gorgeous!
> Dr Leslie is the fountain of knowledge!


Hehe you are too kind... my specialties are only paphs and cattleya species


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## DrLeslieEe (Aug 15, 2020)

PeteM said:


> I really like these horn pics


 Horny flowers? They are after all the reproductive ‘genitalia’ parts of the plants.


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## monocotman (Sep 2, 2020)

Here is the second lead flowering at a cooler time of year. The concolor colour is much clearer. Oddly, both leads aborted two of the three flower buds for the first time, leaving just a single bloom to open.


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## SouthPark (Sep 2, 2020)

monocotman said:


> This arrived and was described as a pale lueddemanniana but the growth cycle is all wrong. Instead of growing and flowering in the spring like the rest of this species it grows over spring and summer and flowers in August.



Maybe the rest of the species have the cycle wrong hahaha! 

If I were an orchid, I'd probably choose to grow in spring and summer etc too hehehe

On the other hand, you mentioned growing and flowering in the spring (in general for the rest of the species). So does that just mean this particular plant does pretty much the same as the rest of the species, but just takes a bit longer to grow ...... as in it grows into the summer time? I would think that taking a bit longer to grow ----- into the summer time, doesn't sound unusual.

If you had said that the rest of the species grows in winter and flowers in the spring (or something), then that would be different.


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## monocotman (Sep 2, 2020)

South Park - it's quite different in its growth pattern. it has barely started to grow when the others have grown and are flowering.


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## terryros (Sep 2, 2020)

Does it consistently flower earlier than your labiata plants?


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## h_mossy (Sep 3, 2020)

Very nice C. lueddemanniana semi-concolor!


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## monocotman (Sep 3, 2020)

Terry, it flowers well before the labiatas, late August is normal. None of my labiatas are shaping any buds yet.
David


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## SouthPark (Sep 3, 2020)

monocotman said:


> South Park - it's quite different in its growth pattern. it has barely started to grow when the others have grown and are flowering.



If that is consistently the same, then that will be awesome, as then you can have other lueddemanniana ones flower at those different times, and then you'll have the best of all worlds haha. I definitely like that.


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## monocotman (Sep 3, 2020)

I agree! It’s probably my favourite catt species. This clone has an amazing scent, especially in the morning if the sun is out.
The ’normal’ lueddemannianas can also flower later in the year on a second growth, after a short rest in June. I have several that are now producing a second growth, also with sheaths but so far no second flowers.


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