Paph. Arthur

[Sue]

Got this in trade this summer from our own Tenman.

Paph. Arthur = venustum x philippinense. This one is labeled (roebelenii album 'Greenlace' x venustum album). I'm obviously a bit skeptical that both parents were true albinistic plants—either it got mislabeled, or one or the other only appeared albinistic, but was really a semi-alba. I don't mind—I'm just glad that it's so obviously actually an Arthur! (Tennis, if you think it might be something else, please let me know . . . )

Paph. Arthur is a cross first made in 1890, and one which I have never seen a picture or plant of. But it sure looks like what you'd expect from (venustum x philippinense), doesn't it?

I took pictures in bright shade and in direct sun. True color is somewhere in between these pics. If you'd like detail, or to see the staminodes, from the Flickr pages, click on 'All Sizes' to get nice hi-res images.

 

[smartie2000]

Stunning! this turned out very well

 

[ncart]

WOW! :drool: Very nice.

 

[KyushuCalanthe]

Not sure what part of the flower is the nicest, the petals or the lip. New one on me and I'm impressed.

 

[toddybear]

Lovely!

 

[PaphMadMan]

Paph. Arthur = venustum x philippinense. This one is labeled (roebelenii album 'Greenlace' x venustum album). I'm obviously a bit skeptical that both parents were true albinistic plants—either it got mislabeled, or one or the other only appeared albinistic, but was really a semi-alba. I don't mind—I'm just glad that it's so obviously actually an Arthur! (Tennis, if you think it might be something else, please let me know . . . )

The genetics of alba-type flowers isn't necessarily simple. There must be several ways that red/purple pigments can be lacking - different genes, different mechanisms. If both parents are homozygous recessive 'alba' but by different genes then all of the progeny would be expected to be 'normal'. Just one possibility and I don't know if that is the case here. It would be informative to know how other seedlings came out.

 

[Bolero]

Very very nice!

 

[SlipperFan]

That is really a nice one.

I have a stupid question -- is this from a new hybridizing, or is it a division from a plant made in 1890??? (It could happen!) If it's a newly made cross, who did the hybridizing?

If this is typical, it certainly is worth re-making!

 

[Hera]

That's really a nice expression of the parents.

 

[tenman]

Wow! Thanks for posting it! I've never been able to find a pic of this cross before, and of course never gotten it to bloom, 12 years or so from flask. So of course you've bloomed yours right away!!!

These flasks I got either from Wharton Sinkler or Chuck Acker, I don't remember which.

As for the albinistic parents, it is quite often the case that albums from different sections, and even sometimes different albums from the same section or even same species, do not breed albums. That is a reason that when I get an album species I prefer to get a selfing. My first two 'appletonianum album' plants, from different sibling crosses, both turned out many dollars later to be normal-colored forms. There are a number of genes or gene sites which control color expression and if recessive, as they usually are, the two parents must have the same albinistic 'defect' in order to breed true. I have a Paph.Honey from album parents which I kept over my other one because it has better color - more pink and purple, less brown.

But there are times when the album genes are not entirely or not at all recessive. An example is those barbigerums from the corss of a normal colored form and an albinistic one - or it could be hitherto unexpected albinistic genes in the colored form used.

I have heard that haynaldianum album is dominant for color.

And my very, very expensive charlesworthii album 'Pride of Tokyo' selfing seedling I have been babying for a decade or so finally died as I guess most of them have. Anyone know of a source for Charlesworthii albums? :sob:

 

[Sue]

Thanks for the info, tenman and Kirk! And, of course, it makes good sense that the albinistic genetic traits might be different in different sections. I shall doubt of the exact parentage no longer.

I love it, and I think the cross is a winner. I the siblings do something soon, and that you'll post pictures when they do!

 

[WolfDog1 (C. Williams)]

Sam Tsui for the charlesworthii. His are very large and very nice.

Craig

 

[goldenrose]

I have heard that haynaldianum album is dominant for color.

And my very, very expensive charlesworthii album 'Pride of Tokyo' selfing seedling I have been babying for a decade or so finally died as I guess most of them have. Anyone know of a source for Charlesworthii albums? :sob:

Haynaldianum album dominant for color? Here it was the pollen parent, would that make a difference? http://www.slippertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12511&highlight=Lebaudyanum+album

Bummer about the charlie! Has anyone else heard that 'Pride of Tokyo' is a bit difficult, not vigorous?

 

[tenman]

I haven't had a chance to verify what I heard about haynaldianum album being dominant for color, but it would only be with another haynaldianum. Interspecies, it would still be back to that problem of having the albums serendipitously coincide.

 

[Ernie]

And my very, very expensive charlesworthii album 'Pride of Tokyo' selfing seedling I have been babying for a decade or so finally died as I guess most of them have. Anyone know of a source for Charlesworthii albums? :sob:

Sam Tsui has chuckworth sandowiaes (albums).

-Ernie

 

[SelectOrchids]

Got wardii album x philippinense album, they bloomed out as coloratums, so it is not very surprising that those venustum album x philippinense album are coloratum. That Arthur flower however is extremely interesting, I like it...

Speaking of venustum album, there has been several jungle plants of venustum album collected. Some of them can be paired to produce albino seedlings, but some venustum album when paired give only coloratum progeny. The mutations responsible for the albinism can be filled by the other parent, so that's why the progeny is colored. Maybe another venustum album from a different breeding x philippinense album could give albino Arthur.

Wardii album x philippinense album, the ones I have are coloratum with a laevigatum type philippinense album, but some made with another different philippinense var. roebbelinii album are apparently truly albinos...

 

[tim]

I had an interesting talk wit Norito about venustum album - it turns out most venustum albums are not true album, since the little spots, warts and hairs along the upper margin of the petals are black. He has only one or two true albas, lacking these black spots and warts. I'm sure that using a true alba versus an albinistic clone would have bearing on the result of such hybrids.

To me, your Arthur looks more wardii x philippinense than a venustum cross...

I agree though a very interesting flower - very pretty!!

 

[biothanasis]

Great colours!!!

 

[e-spice]

That looks very nice!

e-spice

 

[SlipperKing]

Super cool flower. Fantastic colors