I have around 300 phrags I need to repot, where is everyone buying their bulk medium fir bark from? My usual place is sold out and I hate the idea of buying so many 8 quart bags.
Bulk potting media
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Tom-DE
Well-Known Member
Try Green Barn Orchid Supplies(FL, USA), They have 35 litre bags of bark(about two cubic foot?) and I am sure they can sell your bigger size...they do sell 50 pound bag of charcoals. Email them or call (561)499-2810
I buy Kiwi Bark from Fred at SVO. Shipping is expensive.
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Green Barn is in Delray Beach Florida to be more specific.
Shipping has been expensive for quite some time. I prefer Orchiata myself compared to fir bark but it comes down to preference.
Shipping has been expensive for quite some time. I prefer Orchiata myself compared to fir bark but it comes down to preference.
Tom-DE
Well-Known Member
Green Barn was Bill's suggestion when I asked for good orchid supply sources last year, so thanks again.....and, I am going to run out of fir barks soon too, so I will get some from GB. I ordered some pots, charcoal, and sponge rocks from Green Barn about three or four months ago, shipping wasn't too bad. They claim they charge shipping at cost, or close to it.
I used to place a large order from suppliers if they offered free pickup at shows...and that was in the good old days. I am not sure if they still give customers that option now.
I used to place a large order from suppliers if they offered free pickup at shows...and that was in the good old days. I am not sure if they still give customers that option now.
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littlefrog
Hop-meister
Everything is cheaper by the pallet. See if you can get a group order together with your local society.
Personally, I hate orchiata... I killed an entire generation of phrag seedlings with it. Granted, this was maybe 15 years ago, it is may be better now. I like just regular fir bark.
I'm trying to get away from bark in general. I got through it at a pretty robust pace, but every time I get close to running out some nursery retires and I 'inherit' their bark supply. Running out of nurseries... But I'm planning on switching to coconut husk when I need to buy new. Easier to get.
Green Barn is fantastic, I miss being close enough to drop in for supplies. I stocked up on baskets a few years ago and their shipping was reasonable, definitely at or close to actual cost.
Tom-DE
Well-Known Member
I use CHC too and I still have quite a bit of it left...Personally, I am not too crazy about CHC. The fir bark mix is still my choice.
Stone
Well-Known Member
You need to be careful with CHC. Some samples have a high chloride content and many other problems. I think I have come up with a good way of treating CHC but time will tell....
Hadley recommended Orchiata mix. (So does Bill Goldner for Phrags). He said it gave him longer time between repotting as Paphs should be repotted frequently, so instead of every year repot, he could go 2. Bill said it extended his repot from yearly to 18 months for phrags.
Here was Hadley’s mix:
Seedlings - Classic ⅛-¼”
3.5 “ - ¼-⅜” Power
4.5 - or larger ½-¾” Power Plus (larger, 4 parts to 2 parts)
75 bark/15 perlite/10 Canadian peat.
Parvi and brachy love oyster shell or chic grit
I’ve used their recommended mixes since I heard them say this in 2021, except I add charcoal.
After 2 years UNC studies show Orchiata pH drops rapidly if 100% Orchiata, a little slower with perlite/charcoal.
Bill uses Power Orchiata in a 6” pot with perlite. He stopped using charcoal because of inconvenience if getting it. I’ll see him this weekend and verify this is still what he’s doing.
Anyone know where to get Canadian Peat?
Do you think Promix be a good substitute for the peat? Easier to obtain, at least for me.
I've used Promix HP for phrags with good results, most of the time. I just can't seem to predict which ones will strongly object. I started an experiment last year with three crosses of 10 plants each, with 5 in Promix HP and 5 in Orchiata Classic. When I repot in about 3 months, I will closely compare the roots and leaves. At this point they are all OK and I don't see any obvious trends. The reason I did this experiment is, as you mentioned, Promix is easy to find. It is also cheap and easy to work with. Mike
Tom-DE
Well-Known Member
Please tell us your way, Mike...I only soak mine in plain water for a day or two and change the water a couple of times in between.
I don't think CHC will last longer than the fir barks...what do you think?
I've used CHC for a long while for Cymbidiums. Straight - no additions. Super root growth as it holds moisture well when compacted. Sometimes I can move a plant up in pot size three times while retaining the old media. Makes it easy. There are brands now that are very well washed.
But to me it doesn't have the right characteristics for Phrags, which need super root aeration while retaining moisture.
But to me it doesn't have the right characteristics for Phrags, which need super root aeration while retaining moisture.
clearsky57
Well-Known Member
you can get canadian peat from most full service nursery centers... comes in 4-6 cu ft bales...
Tom-DE
Well-Known Member
Keeping the old medium might work for Cyms since a lot of them are terrestrial basically....
I've never tried CHC straight, no other additives but I have used CHC + barks combo(half and half), plus charcoal and sponge rock...the CHC + medium size fir barks combo works quite well for me and I only use that mix for my mature Paphs...
Stone
Well-Known Member
You have to let them sink to the bottom of the water or the centre of the chip will not get leached.
I have read the coconut husk often have a high chloride content, and very high in K and low in S and Ca. (Always assume the high chloride even though it is apparently possible to produce a product with a low salt content)
The actual leaching of chloride (and sodium) from the centre occurs as the chip dries out (as the water evaporates it bring up the salts with it) so you need to let it dry completely and repeat as often as you think might be necessary. Without an analysis it's a guess but I would say 4 cycles is not too much and 6 would be better. I have heard many horror stories about CHC!
To overcome the low Ca and S I add as much gypsum as will dissolve in the water and on third soaking time I add iron sulphate and copper sulphate (about one handful and 5 grams respectively)
The forth time I will add magnesium sulphate to overcome the possible imbalance with K.
The Fe So4 is added to supply Fe and help with detoxifying any phenolic compounds and the CuSo4 is to supply Copper as it tends to bind tightly with the organic material. (They may not be entirely necessary)
The important thing is to let them sink to the bottom and to dry them completely each time. Each procedure may take more than a week in summer and a month in winter!
This is the product I have (I got 6 bales for free so I need to find a way to use them)
Even though they claim an EC of 0.5 I think it's crap.
Here below you can see how much the Fe has penetrated. It and Cu binds tightly to organic material and cannot be leached away. They are only slowly available to the plant. But this also give you a idea how difficult it is to leach the entire chip.
This is what you end up with. I still have not added the Magnesium yet.... I will trial it next spring on some Paph insignes and Cymbidiums. I think porous terra cotta would be best with this stuff (or very careful watering)
One final thought... If you can still smell them, soak them and dry them again.
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Tom-DE
Well-Known Member
Thank you, Mike. That is a lot of work. Hope it is worth the effort.
Stone
Well-Known Member
Not that much work just alot of time - which I have
