Cypripedium subtropicum

[Hakone]

grown from seed (5 years ago ) in Dalat , photo taken from friend in Dalat ( South Viet Nam )

 

[Berthold]

grown from seed (5 years ago ) in Dalat ,...

I don't believe that, it's digged out.

 

[Hakone]

congratulations, you are a wise man . If you fly over there you can go for yourself.

 

[KyushuCalanthe]

Neat species that I think one day will be reclassified into its own genus.

As for seed growing them, they seem quite easy to germinate from even mature pods. As for growing them on to flowering size, I've heard no reports yet. So, it is possible this one is seed grown. Currently there are a number of folks with plants in flask or just out of flask. I'm sure we won't be hearing much about them for some time though regardless of their fate.

 

[Berthold]

Neat species that I think one day will be reclassified into its own genus.
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So, it is possible this one is seed grown.

it is closely related to Cypripedium wardii.

But I don't think it is possible to bring it to flower within 5 years.

 

[KyushuCalanthe]

it is closely related to Cypripedium wardii.

I know that is the current thinking, but I suspect the reality is quite different.

But I don't think it is possible to bring it to flower within 5 years.

Maybe, but not tested to my knowledge (present plant excluded). It will be interesting to see what happens with all the seedlings coming along now. I'd say there's a fair chance that most won't even survive, let alone bloom, but who knows for sure? I hope they make it!

 

[W. Beetus]

Very interesting bloom!

 

[Berthold]

I know that is the current thinking, but I suspect the reality is quite different.

But the construction of flower elements are very similar. You can confirm it when You hold both flowers in Your hand.

 

[kentuckiense]

I know that is the current thinking, but I suspect the reality is quite different.

Hey Tom. I was pretty skeptical too, but a recent phylogenetic analysis of the genus has C. wardii and C. subtropicum clading together: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1055790311002739

The usual caveats apply, of course.

 

[KyushuCalanthe]

Hey folks, didn't mean to cause trouble, it is just a matter of opinion, and you know about opinions...:rollhappy:

My judgement is not based on cladistic studies or chasing allozymes - it is more from an intuitive level and from talking about it to other folks "in the know". This plant is an odd one, at once primitive in design and yet with lots of unique features all to its own. The Mexican/Guatemalan species are like that too - off in their own little world, but among Cyps, C. subtropicum is truly odd.

I hope some can be propagated before the last is stripped out of the wild. It would be even better if a few could be left alone unharassed, but with Burma seeming to want to open up relations with China that region is going to be under the gun like never before.

 

[PaphMadMan]

Hey Tom. I was pretty skeptical too, but a recent phylogenetic analysis of the genus has C. wardii and C. subtropicum clading together: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1055790311002739

The usual caveats apply, of course.

It appears one would have to make up an 'organization' to even be allowed to register to buy the article. <sigh>

 

[SelectOrchids]

Hey folks, didn't mean to cause trouble, it is just a matter of opinion, and you know about opinions...:rollhappy:

My judgement is not based on cladistic studies or chasing allozymes - it is more from an intuitive level and from talking about it to other folks "in the know". This plant is an odd one, at once primitive in design and yet with lots of unique features all to its own. The Mexican/Guatemalan species are like that too - off in their own little world, but among Cyps, C. subtropicum is truly odd.

I hope some can be propagated before the last is stripped out of the wild. It would be even better if a few could be left alone unharassed, but with Burma seeming to want to open up relations with China that region is going to be under the gun like never before.

Dont' worry it comes only from Vietnam...

 

[quietaustralian]

Dont' worry it comes only from Vietnam...

Huh? Whats the story?

Mick

 

[SelectOrchids]

Huh? Whats the story?

Mick

There is only one nursery who can get cypripedium subtropicum from the wild, and they have the absolute monopoly. I know the owner, and he got his plants from the border of China and Vietnam, but entering Vietnam mountains, it is a hard road, and indeed we cannot access that part of the mountains from Vietnam, except by walking a couple days, it is one of the no man's land close to Laos Vietnam and China junction.

 

[quietaustralian]

A couple of days ago, I was looking for some Paph pictures on the Swiss Orchid Foundation website and came across some pics of C. subtropicum, it was claimed that these in situ pics were taken at Malipo, Yunnan. If that is true, it's reasonable to expect that they may be found in northern Hà Giang province, VN as Malipo is only 15kms directly west of the border and the terrain and climate are the same.

http://orchid.unibas.ch/phpMyHerbarium/190029/1/Cypripedium/subtropicum//specimen.php

http://orchid.unibas.ch/phpMyHerbarium/118590/1/Cypripedium/subtropicum//specimen.php

Mick

 

[SelectOrchids]

A couple of days ago, I was looking for some Paph pictures on the Swiss Orchid Foundation website and came across some pics of C. subtropicum, it was claimed that these in situ pics were taken at Malipo, Yunnan. If that is true, it's reasonable to expect that they may be found in northern Hà Giang province, VN as Malipo is only 15kms directly west of the border and the terrain and climate are the same.

http://orchid.unibas.ch/phpMyHerbarium/190029/1/Cypripedium/subtropicum//specimen.php

http://orchid.unibas.ch/phpMyHerbarium/118590/1/Cypripedium/subtropicum//specimen.php

Mick

That nursery in Kunming has those photos, and many more, including collectors taking up plants... and they definitely do not come from the Malipo area... another case of 'kindly borrowed photos'. As an aside, that nursery there claims the plants to come from Malipo, to avoid any question, or collectors to locate more plants and compete. A mature plants sells now for a couple hundreds USD in China.

 

[quietaustralian]

That nursery in Kunming has those photos, and many more, including collectors taking up plants... and they definitely do not come from the Malipo area... another case of 'kindly borrowed photos'. As an aside, that nursery there claims the plants to come from Malipo, to avoid any question, or collectors to locate more plants and compete. A mature plants sells now for a couple hundreds USD in China.

So, the photo credited to Holger is a fraud?

Mick

 

[SelectOrchids]

So, the photo credited to Holger is a fraud?

Mick

Let's say to make the things peaceful, that if Holger saw it in the wild, he has been incredibly lucky to see them about 300 km east from their real location, and second if a westerner had seen them, it would be weird that only a Chinese has the monopoly ( that very same Chinese who sold some worldwide famous pictures of Paphiopedilum tigrinum in the wild 'from China', where in fact those photos were taken in Burma... and he is indeed the largest orchid trader in the area.)... and that Holger had to buy from him his plants of subtropicum at premium price. :evil: but of course nothing is impossible to men of good will, like finding hangianum in China... or gigantifolium maybe one day...

 

[kentuckiense]

What about the plants described as singchii and appendiculatum? Same population or different?

 

[SelectOrchids]

To reply, yes Holger did not take that photo, but the collector, see here :

http://www.cypripedium.de/forum/messages/2838.html

That's the commercial offer from the Kunming man I told you... with the photo credited supposedly to Holger on another website... Holger therefore did not take that photo.