Ecuagenera is puzzling us again.

[FrankRC]

I have to disagree with you Frank regarding Orchids Ltd. Yes they do a fair amount of reselling from contract growers, but what vendor doesn't? They do, however, grow a great amount of what they sell themselves. They have a complete laboratory where they propagate many of the plants they sell. In fact I crossed a coupIe of roths I purchased from the Orchid Zone a few years ago before it went out of business and gave them the seed pods. They took them to their lab to grow them out. The seedlings were just recently transferred to community pots and look fantastic. I live less then 10 minutes from where their nursery is located and have visited it more times then I can count over the last 25 years and have seen their facilities. I have known Jerry and Jason for that long as well and they are honest hard working people. Are they expensive yes they are, but in my opinion you get what you pay for. I have never purchased a diseased or bug infested plant from them ever. Have I lost plants purchased from them? Yes I have, but in every case it was due to growing mistakes on my part.

Everyone has an opinion and that's great. This is what this forum is for. My perspective is not based solely on being a retail customer of theirs. Their lab, and my thoughts come from several sources who have been there and who have labs themselves, in addition to my own, is a fraction of what it once was. One of the owners wife comes in a few days a week and the production out of that lab is way off in recent years and this is supported by the paltry offering of plants they themselves breed available on their website. The majority of what I see in these Instagram sales and e-mail promotions coming from Orchids Limited are plants being resold they bought from wholesalers at an exorbitant mark up. I don't begrudge any businessperson the right to run their business as they see fit. However, seeing as the majority of plants they are offering recently I know are from wholesalers, culls from Taiwan, plants from the going out of business sale at Orchid Inn, etc., and their prices are significantly higher than others selling the exact same plants, It is difficult as an orchid consumer to justify paying a 400% mark up because, well, they are Orchids Limited. Do your homework and you will find a lot of what Orchids Limited offers a lot cheaper elsewhere and for the same plants.

Jerry Fischer is a good orchid man, he always has been. I have known Jerry for over thirty (30) years and while expensive, he never steered me wrong and was always available, when Orchids Limited had a phone, to talk to me about anything I called about. Not many orchid dealers were, or are, willing to do that. Those days are in the rear view mirror I am afraid.

The other, rather problematic issues with Orchids Limited, are for another day.

Kind regards,

 

[Ray]

There are folks who buy and resell, and others that have someone else (with room) grow out their plants for them. The odds of getting a good plants are likely to be the same, in my estimation.

 

[NYEric]

Unfortunately, my recommendation would be to go to the nurseries in person. Thankfully, I am able to do this with Ecuagenera and Woodstream. I would like to visit Orchids Limited. The next best option is to get the plants at shows, that way you can check out the media and compare the plants for accuracy in labeling.

 

[FrankRC]

Unfortunately, my recommendation would be to go to the nurseries in person. Thankfully, I am able to do this with Ecuagenera and Woodstream. I would like to visit Orchids Limited. The next best option is to get the plants at shows, that way you can check out the media and compare the plants for accuracy in labeling.

Exactly.

 

[dodidoki]

I gave up wuth them...

 

[rauhaariger]

I can go to Ecuagenera-Europe myself. However, the plants there are significantly worse and more expensive than those that come from Ecuador. What comes from Ecuador cannot be compared to the plants in the plastic bags at the exhibitions. I would say that about 80% of the plants that come from Ecuador are of good quality. About 10% die in the first two years. So far I have had two incorrect labels on 60 plants. Ok, not all of them have bloomed yet.

Given the prices, this is still economically acceptable, although occasionally disappointing.

 

[FlaskandFlora]

As a shameless plug on this thread for those of you looking for a younger nursery to replace your current vendors retiring in the next few years - I keep a decent stock of healthy and reasonably priced Phrags available. A few species, but mostly lots of interesting hybrids (some from larger nurseries, and some in-house stuff too). Just search up Flask & Flora on FB/IG and you’ll find them

 

[Morja]

As a shameless plug on this thread for those of you looking for a younger nursery to replace your current vendors retiring in the next few years - I keep a decent stock of healthy and reasonably priced Phrags available. A few species, but mostly lots of interesting hybrids (some from larger nurseries, and some in-house stuff too). Just search up Flask & Flora on FB/IG and you’ll find them

Of course I just deleted my social media accounts last week I see you're having a purge though, I am very tempted! Nice looking plants!

 

[Ray]

As a shameless plug on this thread for those of you looking for a younger nursery to replace your current vendors retiring in the next few years - I keep a decent stock of healthy and reasonably priced Phrags available. A few species, but mostly lots of interesting hybrids (some from larger nurseries, and some in-house stuff too). Just search up Flask & Flora on FB/IG and you’ll find them

<moderator>
If you’re going to plug a business, please post in the “For Sale/Trade/Wanted” section of the forum, or better yet, become a sponsor.
</moderator>

<grower>
FB is a miserable place to buy and sell, in my opinion. Do you have a list of available plants?
</grower>

 

[Heather]

As for where to buy Phrags, Woodstream is good, I occasionally sell Phrags (yes I am confident my plants are worth it), and Dave Sorokowski at Paph Paradise sells very good quality and correctly labeled Phrags. The market is shrinking, but you can still find what you are looking for.!

I’m hesitant to buy any more from Woodstream; everything I’ve gotten over the last two years has been tiny and thrip infested. As with Ecua, I’m not interested in purchasing plants that I need to rehab for a year before they start thriving…It is unfortunate because they were a great option for me as they have a lot of what I’m interested in.

I do check out Paph Paradise frequently as they are local for me but I rarely find Phrags I’m interested in available there.

Will check out Flask and Flora….

 

[MorandiWine]

There has been two mentions of “steroids” being used by Ecuagenera. Are we talking about Performance Enhancement, HGH or something else? Didnt realize that plants can “juice up.” Please explain, because I seriously am in the weeds here.

 

[rauhaariger]

There has been two mentions of “steroids” being used by Ecuagenera. Are we talking about Performance Enhancement, HGH or something else? Didnt realize that plants can “juice up.” Please explain, because I seriously am in the weeds here.

That would interest me too. You hear something like that all the time, but no one reports anything further. Is it just one copying from the other?

 

[Heather]

There has been two mentions of “steroids” being used by Ecuagenera. Are we talking about Performance Enhancement, HGH or something else? Didnt realize that plants can “juice up.” Please explain, because I seriously am in the weeds here.

I’d like to know more about this also. I try to explain it to customers at work (it often comes up when I get questions about the mini phals we sell) but would love more details…

 

[gonewild]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3336137/

 

[gonewild]

Plenty of data about plant steroids online.

 

[gonewild]

Overdosing any bio stimulant is likely or guaranteed to negatively affect plant health. Years ago we experimented with Chemicals to cause Phals to produce up to 8 spikes at one time. Easy to do and the show of flowers was fantastic. But we learned that it took years for the plants to recover and grow properly after the heavy dose of Auxins. I've noticed similar growth effects of overuse of some seaweed products. No problem for disposable plant sales but not good when the plants are sold to collectors for long term quality growth.

 

[Tony]

Everyone has an opinion and that's great. This is what this forum is for. My perspective is not based solely on being a retail customer of theirs. Their lab, and my thoughts come from several sources who have been there and who have labs themselves, in addition to my own, is a fraction of what it once was. One of the owners wife comes in a few days a week and the production out of that lab is way off in recent years and this is supported by the paltry offering of plants they themselves breed available on their website. The majority of what I see in these Instagram sales and e-mail promotions coming from Orchids Limited are plants being resold they bought from wholesalers at an exorbitant mark up. I don't begrudge any businessperson the right to run their business as they see fit. However, seeing as the majority of plants they are offering recently I know are from wholesalers, culls from Taiwan, plants from the going out of business sale at Orchid Inn, etc., and their prices are significantly higher than others selling the exact same plants, It is difficult as an orchid consumer to justify paying a 400% mark up because, well, they are Orchids Limited. Do your homework and you will find a lot of what Orchids Limited offers a lot cheaper elsewhere and for the same plants.

Jerry Fischer is a good orchid man, he always has been. I have known Jerry for over thirty (30) years and while expensive, he never steered me wrong and was always available, when Orchids Limited had a phone, to talk to me about anything I called about. Not many orchid dealers were, or are, willing to do that. Those days are in the rear view mirror I am afraid.

The other, rather problematic issues with Orchids Limited, are for another day.

Kind regards,

I've always questioned the wisdom of trying to operate an orchid nursery in Minnesota, I'm amazed they've kept the lights on this long selling mass market stuff at the absurd prices they list.

 

[Heather]

Overdosing any bio stimulant is likely or guaranteed to negatively affect plant health. Years ago we experimented with Chemicals to cause Phals to produce up to 8 spikes at one time. Easy to do and the show of flowers was fantastic. But we learned that it took years for the plants to recover and grow properly after the heavy dose of Auxins. I've noticed similar growth effects of overuse of some seaweed products. No problem for disposable plant sales but not good when the plants are sold to collectors for long term quality growth.

Thanks. This helps. That last sentence is the one I struggle with…people think because they have a disposable phal that they are a collector and can’t figure it why it isn’t the healthiest plant….

 

[Ray]

This is really nothing new, nor earth-shattering. Among a myriad of other phytochemicals, Kelpak contains brassinosteroids and it has been used on foods, fruits, nuts, and grains for over 40 years to boost production.

I have not heard of a single plant harmed using it at doses as high as 2%. The most I recommend is 1:125 (0.86%) as I’m not certain there’s a significant cost/benefit to using more. My normal dosage is half that.

One large, well known orchid nursery to whom I had given a bottle at a show ended up buying a bunch when the place was being sold, “so all the plants be their best with active growth and good roots”.

I have first-hand experience with the negative effects of overdosing synthetic auxins. I am not aware of any such effects of natural ones.

 

[NYEric]

I’m hesitant to buy any more from Woodstream; everything I’ve gotten over the last two years has been tiny and thrip infested. As with Ecua, I’m not interested in purchasing plants that I need to rehab for a year before they start thriving…It is unfortunate because they were a great option for me as they have a lot of what I’m interested in.

I do check out Paph Paradise frequently as they are local for me but I rarely find Phrags I’m interested in available there.

Will check out Flask and Flora….

As I mentioned, you should go to shows or to vendor in person. The plants Bill brings to shows are mature and will bloom.