Is dolomite soluble

[keithrs]

I was wondering how to make a liquid Ca/Mg additive that can be used on mounts and plants with no media to retain pellet form and was wondering if dolomite lime would work?

 

[Rick]

If you are refering to peletized agricultural dolomite the answer is yes.

It's pulverized dolomitic limestone held together in little pellets with a polymer binder. As soon as it gets wet if comes apart. pH is around 12 when it does this.

Otherwise, dolomitic limestone is just slightly more soluble than low magnesium limestone (dolomite is just high magnesium, up to 50% Mg carbonate content) limestone.

I would like to access some dolomitic limestone because of the higher Mg content, but for some reason it is hard to get the raw stuff even in TN (the land of limestone).

However every coop, home depot and lowes garden center carries the peletized stuff.

Because of the high pH release of this material I opted for playing mostly with gypsum/epsom salt options that don't change pH.

 

[gonewild]

If you are refering to peletized agricultural dolomite the answer is yes.

It's pulverized dolomitic limestone held together in little pellets with a polymer binder. As soon as it gets wet if comes apart. pH is around 12 when it does this.

Is it actually soluable or does it just come apart into fine particles?

 

[Rick]

Is it actually soluable or does it just come apart into fine particles?

Not instantly 100% but the powder is very fine, and provides almost an instant pH/soluble hardness boost. (I actually took it into the lab and measured the soluble hardness).

Both myself and Eric M have used the Epsoma product and noted the pH jump.

Actually there is a lot of soluble Ca and Mg in most regular surface/tap/well waters, so I don't know what the advantage of boosting with dolomite would be relative to just adjusting a tap water with RO or rain water to the desired hardness. Add a dash of epsom salt to the mix to change the Ca/Mg ratio.

 

[Stone]

I have a table of solubility here. Make of it what you will!

Solubility in cold water (about 15C)(g/Litre)

Dolomite: 0.01
Calcium carbonate: (Limestone, calcite) 0.015
Calcium nitrate: 2660
Calcium Chloride: 350
Calcium hydroxide: 1.85
Calcium sulphate: (gypsum) 2.41
Magnesium carbonate: (magnasite) 0.11
Magnesium sulphate: 710

Thats MAXIMUM solubility so the finer the particles the quicker you'll reach these figures

 

[Stone]

I was wondering how to make a liquid Ca/Mg additive that can be used on mounts and plants with no media to retain pellet form and was wondering if dolomite lime would work?

You might be better off using very dilute ''Cal-Mag'' (Calcium chloride-Mag sulphate)
I was hesitant at first (because of the chloride) but I add it to the water from time to time at about 1/2 of a cap to 30lt of water and at that rate it seems ok. Probably brings your pure (rain, RO) water close to most city waters.

 

[keithrs]

If you are refering to peletized agricultural dolomite the answer is yes.

It's pulverized dolomitic limestone held together in little pellets with a polymer binder. As soon as it gets wet if comes apart. pH is around 12 when it does this.

Otherwise, dolomitic limestone is just slightly more soluble than low magnesium limestone (dolomite is just high magnesium, up to 50% Mg carbonate content) limestone.

I would like to access some dolomitic limestone because of the higher Mg content, but for some reason it is hard to get the raw stuff even in TN (the land of limestone).

However every coop, home depot and lowes garden center carries the peletized stuff.

Because of the high pH release of this material I opted for playing mostly with gypsum/epsom salt options that don't change pH.

I have dolomite 65 powder... My garden center carries it ... $8 50lbs bag

 

[keithrs]

Not instantly 100% but the powder is very fine, and provides almost an instant pH/soluble hardness boost. (I actually took it into the lab and measured the soluble hardness).

Both myself and Eric M have used the Epsoma product and noted the pH jump.

Actually there is a lot of soluble Ca and Mg in most regular surface/tap/well waters, so I don't know what the advantage of boosting with dolomite would be relative to just adjusting a tap water with RO or rain water to the desired hardness. Add a dash of epsom salt to the mix to change the Ca/Mg ratio.

I was told and have read that Ca in my tap can not be taken up by plants... Needs to be broken down into usable form for plants to absorb it. Is this true? And would dolomite in a solution be up taken by a plant via leaves or root system?

 

[Rick]

What is the hardness of your tap water, and what is the target Ca/Mg concentration you want to reach?

 

[Stone]

I was told and have read that Ca in my tap can not be taken up by plants... Needs to be broken down into usable form for plants to absorb it. Is this true? And would dolomite in a solution be up taken by a plant via leaves or root system?

No and Yes

 

[Rick]

I have a table of solubility here. Make of it what you will!

Solubility in cold water (about 15C)(g/Litre)

Dolomite: 0.01
Calcium carbonate: (Limestone, calcite) 0.015
Calcium nitrate: 2660
Calcium Chloride: 350
Calcium hydroxide: 1.85
Calcium sulphate: (gypsum) 2.41
Magnesium carbonate: (magnasite) 0.11
Magnesium sulphate: 710

Thats MAXIMUM solubility so the finer the particles the quicker you'll reach these figures

Multiply by 1000 to get ppm for a start, and increase temp a bit. It doesn't take much in pH reduction to increase solubilty either. Next week I'll see how much a gram of EPSOMA will "disolve" into RO water.

Just using this a gram per liter of raw dolomite (doesn't specify %Mg), will give you a solution of 10mg/L. Not much but how much do you need?

Also given the pH boost from the pelletized product I bet it also contains a significant percentage of calcium hydroxide and magnesium hydroxide.

 

[Rick]

I was told and have read that Ca in my tap can not be taken up by plants... Needs to be broken down into usable form for plants to absorb it.

Soluble Ca and Mg in tap water is just as ionic as soluble Ca/Mg from purifed compounds placed in RO water like CaSO4 and CaCl2..... Ca and Mg are elements and can't be "broken down" any further (except maybe in a nuclear reactor).

A true hardness test only tests soluble Ca/Mg if its measured its soluble and not complexed or solid.


Soluble is soluble.

 

[keithrs]

What is the hardness of your tap water, and what is the target Ca/Mg concentration you want to reach?

My water district is listing it @ 263 ppm or 19gr.

I want to try an organic k-lite program in the spring... So what ever will work for that.

I went on GH website and looked at there organic CaMg.... Its catalyzed seashell(flour I'm sure), dolomite lime, and some plant extract(kelp I'm thinking)

 

[keithrs]

Soluble Ca and Mg in tap water is just as ionic as soluble Ca/Mg from purifed compounds placed in RO water like CaSO4 and CaCl2..... Ca and Mg are elements and can't be "broken down" any further (except maybe in a nuclear reactor).

A true hardness test only tests soluble Ca/Mg if its measured its soluble and not complexed or solid.


Soluble is soluble.

The explanation I got was that the compound chain was too long for the plant to uptake and needed to be broken down.

 

[Rick]

The explanation I got was that the compound chain was too long for the plant to uptake and needed to be broken down.

There is no compound chain of soluble Ca. It is an ion not a complex.

 

[Eric Muehlbauer]

For liquefied calcium, there are some products sold for reefkeepers that are essentially liquefied aragonite, I think brand names include Aragamilk and Araga-might. However, since these are intended for reefs, I have no idea of what their sodium content may be, or even if there is any sodium.

 

[Rick]

For liquefied calcium, there are some products sold for reefkeepers that are essentially liquefied aragonite, I think brand names include Aragamilk and Araga-might. However, since these are intended for reefs, I have no idea of what their sodium content may be, or even if there is any sodium.

Aragonite is pure calcium carbonate. In this case derived from ancient biological process rather than purely mineral calcite. There shouldn't be any sodium unless the water content is derived from sea water.

The Caribsea "cichlid sand" I got from Petsmart also is primarily aragonite. After soaking it in fresh water it does produce calcium but also raises the alkalinity considerably.

Not sure why Keithers is getting on calcium kick. Also if you bury the plant in calcium you'll end up with magnesium deficiency. At least dolomite has a good balance of Ca and Mg to start with, but most tap waters across the nation have enough Ca to do the job just fine, and a dab of epsom salts will provide a good balance for Mg.

 

[abax]

Might using K-Lite and Orchiata produce sufficient Ca/Mg for almost any
Paph.?

 

[keithrs]

Not sure why Keithers is getting on calcium kick. Also if you bury the plant in calcium you'll end up with magnesium deficiency. At least dolomite has a good balance of Ca and Mg to start with, but most tap waters across the nation have enough Ca to do the job just fine, and a dab of epsom salts will provide a good balance for Mg.

I'm going to try a organic k-lite program. So straight dechorinated tap + N + micros will do the job?

 

[keithrs]

Might using K-Lite and Orchiata produce sufficient Ca/Mg for almost any
Paph.?

Most of my plants are mounted... I want to try something other then k lite... It does a fine job but I find organics to be more the way I want to go if I can.