K-Lite-EA

[Ray]

All of the discussions about fertilizer recently, especially Xavier's comments about growqers supplementing the MSURO with MSUWW periodically, has gotten me curious about paphs and nitrogen source.

Comparing nitrogen in MSUWW with about 30% of the nitrogen being ammoniacal to MSURO and K-LIte at about 5%, I have had a batch of "Enhanced Ammonium" K-Lite made that is at 15%, and it should arrive tomorrow.

I would really like to see a side-by-side comparison, but I certainly don't have a big enough collection to do that any longer. Anyone interested?

 

[gonewild]

Is the enhanced ammonia from urea?

 

[Ray]

Ammonium nitrate.

The rhizosphere pH efffect is the same, though.

 

[kman]

The UREA monster stalks . . .

 

[Ozpaph]

let us know, if/when, its commercially available, please

 

[SelectOrchids]

That promises to be interesting, the plants will perform way better with the extra ammonium. It could go higher even.

Some of the fertilizers used in the 90s and 2000s were even half ammonium half nitrate ( the Jerry's Wundergrow was a good example).

 

[Djthomp28]

This sounds like a really interesting experiment. I am looking forward to learning what differences you and others see in the side by side. If I were more consistent these days, I would throw my name in the ring for the trial.

 

[Ray]

I am not going to be able to do a side-by-side experiment, having duplicates of only two plants. After 50+ years of growing, I am pretty observant of changes, but considering I’m about a month from moving plants indoors for the winter, that possibility is out the window.

 

[Ray]

 

[CharlesD]

Dyna-gro 7-9-5 seems like a similar concept with lower cal-mag. But for tds it adds to the fertilizer solution it doesn’t have that much nitrogen. I think your formula would be better in that respect.

It would be great if there was also a commercially available orchid fertilizer with an adjusted iron, manganese, zinc ratio per Xavier’s formulas

 

[Ray]

But for tds it adds to the fertilizer solution it doesn’t have that much nitrogen. I think your formula would be better in that respect.

I think folks get unnecessarily hung up on "TDS". Plus, most so-called "TDS meters" give crap results anyway.

I don't know what a 100 ppm N solution of this "EA" formula or the Dyna-Gro may be, but if you compare the MSU formulas with K-Lite, you get:

MSUWW 19-4-23-2Ca 530 ppm
MSURO 13-3-15-8Ca-2Mg 740 ppm
K-LIte 12-1-1-10Ca-3Mg 770 ppm

If I forget to feed my plant one week, I'll double the rate, meaning that, including the water, I'm pouring a 1650 ppm solution on them - and there has never been an issue.

 

[CharlesD]

I think folks get unnecessarily hung up on "TDS". Plus, most so-called "TDS meters" give crap results anyway.

I don't know what a 100 ppm N solution of this "EA" formula or the Dyna-Gro may be, but if you compare the MSU formulas with K-Lite, you get:

MSUWW 19-4-23-2Ca 530 ppm
MSURO 13-3-15-8Ca-2Mg 740 ppm
K-LIte 12-1-1-10Ca-3Mg 770 ppm

If I forget to feed my plant one week, I'll double the rate, meaning that, including the water, I'm pouring a 1650 ppm solution on them - and there has never been an issue.

That is a good point - I guess what I meant is that with higher nitrogen ratio the total ppm of fertilizer added (ionized or not) will be lower for the amount of nitrogen provided. I don't have RO where I am but I have decent well water and I continuously feed my paphs so I try to limit using higher concentrations or else I start to get salt accumulation.

Being the devils advocate I think you should bite the bullet and have 50/50 nitrate/ammonium but that might require using ammonium nitrate.

 

[Ray]

I'm gonna give this stuff a ride and see if I can see any differences.

ANyone else out there wanting to jump in, drop me an email.

 

[Ray]

Anyone wishing to try the enhanced-ammonia version, especially if able to do a side-by side experiment, can buy it for the same price at my web store. If you just go the the online store, it's on the second page.

 

[Roots]

I've been intrigued by the urea/no urea debate and have wanted to try a side by side comparison. I just ordered a flask of delenati and, when they are ready (hopefully soon), I want to divide them into three or four smallish compots. I am with CharlesD above, if I am going to sacrifice a bunch of babies for the sake of science, I want to go full bore. So I want to do more than your enhanced K-lite, Ray. I think I have worked out 4 fertilizer mixes that will have pretty similar N-P-K ppm. One will have 5‰ ammoniacal, one 40% ammoniacal, one 100% urea (I know that this has to converted to ammonia but....full bore), and the last 9‰ ammoniacal and 13% urea. I have these worked out on paper and will make a digital version and post it.

I am having trouble with the Ca/Mg. I can't find a PPM calculator for these elements like Ray's for NPK. Ray, HUGE thanks, I can't tell you how much I have used that calculator. Here's the question. One of my mixes has K-lite with 10Ca and 3Mg. I am using it at .9g/l. My other mixes have no Ca/Mg in them. If I add 1.8 g/l of a 5Ca/2Mg supplement, will it give me 10Ca and 4Mg, approximating what is in the K-lite? It should, right?, because these are percentages and not PPM.

I apologize for the tome. I am such a neophyte in chemistry and paph. culture and there is so much experience and knowledge on this forum, I would welcome and appreciate any thoughts on this.

P. S. In creating a spread sheet of my mixes I realized that my percentage idea on Ca/Mg doesn't work. Can anyone help me with a formula for calculating ppm of these two elements - taking into account that I didn't pass my high school chemistry class but.

 

[Roots]

Here are the solutions I am thinking of using. Obviously the Ca/Mg is off.

 

[Ray]

Ca and Mg are expressed as elemental percentages, as is nitrogen. The original K-Lite has 12.9% N, 10% Ca and 3% Mg. Therefore, a 100 ppm N solution will have 100*10/12.9=78 ppm Ca and 100*3/12.9=23 ppm Mg.

A ppm is a milligram per kilogram, so if you simply estimate a liter of solution to be 1 kg (slightly off, since we're ignoring the minuscule additives), that would contain 100mg N, 78mg Ca and 23mg Mg.

 

[Roots]

Thank you, Ray. That was super helpful. I think you told me once that you are in North Carolina. Thoughts are with you and everyone else impacted by Helene. Hope you weren't too impacted.

 

[Ray]

We were not affected by Helene at all.

 

[Roots]

Good to hear.