New Mount- Spagnum/Epiweb Substitute???

[Cosmic Orchid]

I have either lost it or struck gold. :crazy: I was having a heck of a time locating a source of "Epiweb" in the US. Spent several days looking on web for "industrial abrasives/brown scotch brite/PET scour pads/Stainless steel polishes/ etc etc.

I understand the epiweb is a tough but dependable substrate. I have also read issues with Epiweb and difficulties in dividing plants once grown inside it (roots being cut through by the "webbing" while trying to cut or divide a piece), roots growing "through" to the layer beneath, causing damage, and also just the availability of it. I was dead-set on not buying the "black" because I just have a thing about aesthetics.

I spent days looking for something I could use to line the orchidarium cabinet I am building, and found a supplier in Spain willing to sell actual Epiweb. But it just rang up over the $200. mark and I just kept looking.

After I "terrariumed to death" my boyfriend:snore:, he sarcastically suggested using a brillo pad to mount the orchids. Immediately a lightbulb went off in my head-- I have a hand-crocheted synthetic sponge that has been through many cycles in the dishwasher that is open and airy, and would dry out in about an hour(?), and ... was bright red and purple.

So a quick ebay search had me picking my jaw up off the floor when I discovered this, made of synthetic scrubby yarn- not hemp, not cotton, not organic at all!!:
I contacted the artist and commissioned a set of rectangles, with little pockets I might be able to set the orchids inside. They could be folded/reshaped as needed. It's all just an experiment but I died because they look so organic and spagnum-mossy!!
Keeping my fingers crossed about this adventure. I just paid for them so I do not even have them yet...
Closeup of the slightly-softer-than-a-metal-polishing-pad-:

 

[Lanmark]

Most likely made from 100% polyester...could be a great discovery on your part. A bit of research reveals the possibility of degradation over time by Cyanobacteria and Archaea though I don't know much about this nor how long it would take. It will be interesting to hear of your experiences with using this product. I wonder how stiff/sturdy these plaques will end up being.

Red Heart makes a product called Scrubby Yarn which is probably what your artist is using. There are also some Korean scrubber yarn/susemi yarn products available on Etsy. One is made by Samsung Textiles and is beige in color and another brand I've seen is Pearl. I'm tempted to buy some of this stuff to see how it works in place of or in conjunction with long fiber NZ sphagnum moss for mounding Neos.

 

[Ray]

I wouldn't worry about micro-degradation, as that would take a very long time. The one question that comes to mind is absorption. The polyester itself absorbs very little, but depending upon the density of the strands, the fiber structure might be great.

Time for an experiment!

 

[Linus_Cello]

What are you planning to grow? Masdevallias/pleurathallids? Slippers?

 

[NYEric]

Interesting. I have a plant I was supposed to mount on epiweb and have just been too lazy. Keep us posted.

 

[Ray]

Redheart Scrubby Yarn (almond) on order. Will be used in a pot for a phalaenopsis. - assuming it has the texture I am anticipating.

 

[Cosmic Orchid]

I just bought out my local Joann's crafts on a president's day sale for the almond scrubby yarn at 3.36 a pop (they are small...). The fuzzy yarn in tree-colors is also suspiciously similar to the looks of SYNTHIC. Time to break out the old crochet hooks. I have a terrarium to fill! Never thought I would be "knitting a terrarium"

I have a couple of candidates: Masdevallia nidifica and Deimos, and Promenaea stapeloides. Also have a small angraegum and bulbos with potential.

 

[Lanmark]

I think I need to visit JoAnn Fabrics today. I'd like to try this on my Neos.

 

[MattWoelfsen]

I think I need to visit JoAnn Fabrics today. I'd like to try this on my Neos.

Glenn Lehr used to finish his Sphagnum moss mounded Furan with a cotton yarn that looked like the moss. It kept the moss very tidy and in the dome shape. This looks like that yarn. I'm going to Joann's Fabrics and get that stuff too. I'm getting ready to re-pot some of my Furan.

 

[myxodex]

Good find and thanks for sharing.

Like Lanmark and MattWoelfsen, I'm very curious about this for neo mounting. Long strand sphag is not always available, when it is, it's expensive and mounting neos without it is frustrating.

The Red Heart scrubby yarn on this side of the pond is several times the price you pay in the US and I cannot get the almond, only the bright colours. There is a local scrubby yarn that is cheaper, but not available in natural colours and the best I can get is white which I might soak in humic acid and hopefully it stains a bit ?

@ Lanmark and Matt, I'd be grateful if you report back on your experiences if you try this for neo mounting. I'm really hoping this is a practical substitute for long fiber sphag.

 

[Ray]

I got in the scrubby yearn yesterday. Looks like I'll really have to loosen it up a bit, and possibly add a second material to keep it open and not pack down too tightly.

The stuff is actually manufactured in Turkey, by the way.

 

[Lanmark]

I bought some Red Heart Scrubby yarn in almond color a couple of days ago. I haven't tried it yet, but my first impression just looking at it and feeling it is that it appears very similar to long fiber NZ sphagnum moss. I happen to think it will hold water for a shorter period of time than the moss, but I must also qualify this statement with the fact that I don't use a lot of moss when I mound my Neos. I like to use the black plastic basket-weave domes which are made specifically to fit the Japanese black plastic Neo pots. I generally wrap a thin layer of moss over/around the dome, place the roots over that and then secure the plant in place with another thin layer of moss. The dome provides an ample hollow center and the Neo pots themselves have large slots and a big hole in the bottom. I am able to give my plants frequent wet/dry cycles in this manner. I will be trying the yarn soon and will report back on my experiences.

 

[myxodex]

I bought some Red Heart Scrubby yarn in almond color a couple of days ago. I haven't tried it yet, but my first impression just looking at it and feeling it is that it appears very similar to long fiber NZ sphagnum moss. I happen to think it will hold water for a shorter period of time than the moss, but I must also qualify this statement with the fact that I don't use a lot of moss when I mound my Neos. I like to use the black plastic basket-weave domes which are made specifically to fit the Japanese black plastic Neo pots. I generally wrap a thin layer of moss over/around the dome, place the roots over that and then secure the plant in place with another thin layer of moss. The dome provides an ample hollow center and the Neo pots themselves have large slots and a big hole in the bottom. I am able to give my plants frequent wet/dry cycles in this manner. I will be trying the yarn soon and will report back on my experiences.

I buy gutter mesh for making the hole in the centre, it's cheap. This stuff can be cut to size with a pair of scissors. I simply roll it into a tube it so that it just overlaps by a couple of cm (approx 1 inch), hold it in the pot to get the height I need and cut to length. Holding the tube, so that it doesn't unroll, I then wrap the sphag around that, add a pad of sphag over the hole at the top and then wrap the plant roots over that. A small downside to this is I get the odd root growing through the mesh and getting entangled with it, which means a bit of fiddling when repotting, but the mesh is easily cut free if necessary, and only about 1 in 10 of my plants get entangled roots.

I only intend to try scrubby yarn for finishing off, so for replacing the long strand sphag for the final wrapping step that holds the shape of the mound.

I've just checked the price of New Zealand sphagnum moss from the UK distributor - 1kg premium grade AAG costs £60 (approx $74) . This isn't actually long strand grade, it just contains a fraction of longer strands that I sort out and put aside for the final wrapping of the mound. For a consumable thats expensive (for me anyway) and 1 Kg is the smallest amount that they sell of this grade. I'm thinking of trying out the Peruvian moss as it's much cheaper.

 

[Lanmark]

I've thought of using gutter mesh, too, but I never have. I like the Japanese domes because the holes are large, and I never have problems disentangling my plants from them.

I think this scrubby yarn would make a fine finishing wrap. I have used the finishing string Matt was referring to in a previous post, and I do like that product as well.

Also available in Japan, but I have yet to find a supplier in USA, are thick-walled, pre-formed NZ sphagnum cones for potting Neos. I've used these in the past in conjunction with the previously mentioned finishing string, and due to the way the moss is so tightly compressed in these pre-formed cones, they don't hold nearly as much water as the loose strands do. There's much less chance of rotting the roots with these pre-made moss cones. I really like this product and would purchase it regularly if made available in USA. It's fast, easy, long-lasting and very plant-friendly.

 

[bigleaf]

This is an exciting project. Can't wait to read more or see the results.

 

[gonewild]

I'm thinking of trying out the Peruvian moss as it's much cheaper.

The Peruvian is excellent quality moss. Orchids love it. Be aware that it is a different species than the NZ. It actually is collected by hand off of rocks and trees in the mountains. It's the moss that orchids actually grow in.
The export grade is very clean and long but there are also lower grades used domestically so make sure you get the high quality.

 

[Ray]

I potted up a Phalaenopsis venustum today, and watered the hell out of it under the spray from the kitchen sink.

I did invert a small mesh pot in the bottom of the pot first, and while the yarn did seem to compress a bit under the water, it drained readily, leaving the strands moist without holding much water in-between.

"Promising" is how I'll characterize it right now.

 

[Lanmark]

So I've tried the Red Heart Scrubby Yarn for wrapping/mounding the roots of a Neo. So far so good. It looks really nice too. It wets easily but doesn't hold a lot of moisture. The moisture remains for a day or so and then I wet it again. This first plant I tried it on is very tiny -- Aoshinju -- and I used a tiny net pot with large openings (I modified it) in the center to keep it hollow. The plant is growing in a well-ventilated, plastic Neo-type pot. I think next I will try using this yarn on a larger plant.

 

[MattWoelfsen]

Is it possible to have a picture of your Aoshinju, dry and wet? Thank you.

 

[Lanmark]

Sure...there's really not a noticeable difference. The fibers themselves don't hold any moisture. Only the texture holds the moisture. It dries very quickly, but I find it does hold a nice, very light level of dampness for most of the day.

Dry:

Wet: