Sorcerer's Apprentice 92 pts

[Ernie]

Leo, AOS judges never make mistakes, just ask them.

I never make misnakes. And that looks a lot like our Les Dirouilles. Inti's Tears would be another good guess.

-Ernie, AOS Judge

 

[Hera]

No offense taken, but this has certainly been a learning experience for me.

 

[NYEric]

FCC - First Class Certificate, is like the highest award for flowers!! Look up the FCC's given and you'll see why this got such a response.

 

[Leo Schordje]

Can we un-award something that just got awarded? sorry I have a feeling that is a stupid question........

And do they change the names of the awards that are wrong inside the database which the judges use? Obviously the measurements on those mislabelled plants should not be used for comparing plants. (or maybe they should add notes under them or something)
There is schlimii 'wilcox' and a handful of hangianum hybrids that are labelled as emersonii (like Sugar Suite). I doubt all judges can tell the difference with the recent hangianum mix ups!

Your questions are perfectly reasonable, I have asked them myself.

Unfortunately Fren, to the best of my knowledge as of the last time I checked, maybe 2004, the AOS has so far refused to address these issues. Once an award is published, there is NO mechanism for going back and changing anything, at all. At least that is the way it was as of 2004 or so. It might be different now, but I would not be surprised to hear nothing has changed.

However, before an award is published, the AOS Judging Center chairman can make corrections, there is usually a couple month time period between the judging session and the publication of the award where where changes can be made. The Judging Center chairman has to sign off on it, but it is possible.

Ernie or any other judge want to weigh in? Am I right in this?

 

[aquacorps]

Leo, email Dr. Gary Kraus. He is head of judging for AOS and will know the answer. He is a decent fellow who will reply to your email. I have his address if you need it.

 

[tim]

There is a policy for challenging awards - another judge has to challenge an award in writing, and the challenge is reviewed by the Judging Committee. I have no idea if this has ever been done, but it's been on the books as a possibility for maybe 3-4 years (?).

 

[NYEric]

Someone let me know if this won an FCC and I'll draft the letter, otherwise I'm taking a lot of plants in for judging!

 

[Drorchid]

I agree with Leo and Rick, Definately NOT a Sorcerer's Apprentice, but an Inti Tears or Phrag. Les Dirouilles

Here is a picture of one of our Phrag. Les Dirouilles (4N) for comparison:



Robert

 

[Hera]

Gentlemen, before you start yanking awards away from people, don't you think you should request the official photo of the plant. All this talk is begining to snowball. Remember, I was at a crowded show, with a husband and kid, and I couldn't get close enough to the plants to photograph properly, and most importantly I'm an amature hobbyist. I think I'm more likely capable of a mistake than a judge. I got the info from others at the show and I couldn't see the paperwork first hand. Perhaps I shouldn't have threaded this, but I was excited, it was a great show with plants that I haven't seen in my area before. Please request an official photo before you assume that I'm infallible. What if I was shown the wrong thing to begin with. I know paphs better to differentiate between them than I do phrags. After seeing the pictures posted, I know that I still may not know the difference without seeing the tag. I'm seriously regreting this thread.

 

[Drorchid]

Gentlemen, before you start yanking awards away from people, don't you think you should request the official photo of the plant. All this talk is begining to snowball. Remember, I was at a crowded show, with a husband and kid, and I couldn't get close enough to the plants to photograph properly, and most importantly I'm an amature hobbyist. I think I'm more likely capable of a mistake than a judge. I got the info from others at the show and I couldn't see the paperwork first hand. Perhaps I shouldn't have threaded this, but I was excited, it was a great show with plants that I haven't seen in my area before. Please request an official photo before you assume that I'm infallible. What if I was shown the wrong thing to begin with. I know paphs better to differentiate between them than I do phrags. After seeing the pictures posted, I know that I still may not know the difference without seeing the tag. I'm seriously regreting this thread.

Don't blame yourself, you were just the messenger! It is always exciting to see an FCC plant, so we understand your excitement as well. It was just that the picture you posted put some doubt in some of our minds if that was really a Sorcerer's Apprentice. Maybe you took a picture of the wrong plant (which I doubt, but mistakes do happen), but if this was indeed the plant that got an FCC, we were just debating what the correct identity was, and what should be done if a wrong identified plant gets an AOS award, which in itself is an interesting debate.

So, THANK YOU for posting this thread!!! (and don't feel bad about it).

Robert

 

[Hera]

I have a retraction, it was an HCC not FCC. Someone else that was at the show confirmed that designation. Like I said it was crowded and there were several conversations going on about this plant.
However, the picture is the correct plant according to the one they have as well. I am working on getting a copy of their picture.

 

[Hera]

Here is the picture from somone else that went to the show. She also took a picture of the paperwork, and she is going to send me a copy. I'll post when I get it.

 

[SlipperKing]

WhooWee, you sure had us going! Thanks for the update it's appreciated.

 

[Hera]

Here's the document ( thanks to a more observant grower than I), and it is indeed Sorcerer's Apprentice. And a 92 point HCC. (MY BAD!)

You can't quite see it but the grower is Marriot Orchids.