Opinions on Nutricote?

[Stone]

I use nutricote 15.8 - 3.9 - 7.8 on everything. (yes everything) It's probably all that is required but I do give the occasional liquid feed with either organic or hydroponic to some plants. Both liquids high K. I prefer the K to be around the same as the N. For a medium sized plant in a medium sized pot (say 4-5 inch), top dress at about 10-15 pills/pot and you're done. I have brought paphs (like bellatulum) ex flask to flowering size in 2-3 years in 20 -30C with this practice. I find using a fine bark to top up the potting helps with keeping the nutricote on top of the the mix rather than falling down through it were it will be less efficient.
''Pros: high N low K like K-Lite'' ..... Low K is not a ''pro''. I would have though this silly notion would have died by now. It's utter nonsense and the sooner you get it out of your mind the happier you will be!

 

[Ray]

@Stone, my plants have been getting K-Lite for over a decade now, and they haven’t figured out how silly that notion is and keep merrily growing and blooming, so I’m not telling them any different.

I see no need to relitigate this case, but there is a lot of scientific info available that shows that plants really don’t need a lot of potassium, recycle it well, with orchids being particularly undemanding of it. Whether that is a physiological difference or just because they’re slow growers, I have no idea.

Potassium is not a chemical component of the structure of a plants, apparently acting as a role in catalysts and transfer phases, so it makes sense that it would be highly relocatable and recycled, keeping the demand low.

 

[Russ1992]

Thanks for the input all! Either low K or high K. Liquid feed or just Nutricote. I will experiment with all variables eventually and report back my findings.

Finding out how to grow better orchids is just as interesting as the plants themselves. Even with seemingly similar conditions people will use, and swear by, wildly different techniques in culture, and the plants look incredible regardless. It's all a mystery.

 

[Russ1992]

Wouldn't snails be a possible cause for alarm? I have never had a planted aquarium that didn't have a few hitchhikers in it.

That's a great point! I haven't done this myself but have just heard of it's benefits.

 

[Russ1992]

One important correction here: zero-tol, when applied, has a MUCH LOWER concentration of hydrogen peroxide than does the drugstore stuff; if I remember correctly, it’s on the order of 0.3%, rather than 3%.

Ray I'm seeing it at 5% man.

 

[eds]

Aquatic snails (of the types that are inadvertently introduced to aquarium) are aquatic and will not survive long term unless you have permanent pools of water in your growing space. The most common two are small Ramshorn snails or Malaysian trumpet snails. Neither will cause an issue for your orchid.

I wouldn't be dumping lots of them or silt and debris from the tank onto your orchids though as all that fine organic matter could clog up your media and decay.

 

[Ray]

Ray I'm seeing it at 5% man.

Russ, what product is that? That company has put out many products with the same general name, and identical products with different names, intended for different market segments, some to be used straight, others to be diluted before application.

The Zero-tol material I have, for example, is 25% peroxide and intended to be diluted 1:85, making the applied solution 0.3%.

 

[Russ1992]

Oh jeez you're totally right Ray! It's called Zerotol HC. Undiluted it's 5.34% Hydrogen Peroxide and 1.36% Peroxyacetic acid. It asks to be diluted to 1:150.

Oh dear that seems so weak. How can this possibly be better than over the counter 3% Hydrogen peroxide?

 

[Ray]

Oh jeez you're totally right Ray! It's called Zerotol HC. Undiluted it's 5.34% Hydrogen Peroxide and 1.36% Peroxyacetic acid. It asks to be diluted to 1:150.

Oh dear that seems so weak. How can this possibly be better than over the counter 3% Hydrogen peroxide?

It works because the peroxide decomposition happens (almost) molecule by molecule, continuing until it is dry. The energy released is sufficient to break down the cell walls of pathogens.

In drugstore peroxide, once a single molecule starts to decompose, it triggers a cascading reaction, releasing many magnitudes more energy almost instantly, even among molecules that are not in contact with the pathogens, so it an miss some, and worse, it is damaging to the sub-microscopic root hairs that are responsible for water and nutrient uptake.

 

[Russ1992]

It works because the peroxide decomposition happens (almost) molecule by molecule, continuing until it is dry. The energy released is sufficient to break down the cell walls of pathogens.

In drugstore peroxide, once a single molecule starts to decompose, it triggers a cascading reaction, releasing many magnitudes more energy almost instantly, even among molecules that are not in contact with the pathogens, so it an miss some, and worse, it is damaging to the sub-microscopic root hairs that are responsible for water and nutrient uptake.

Honestly Ray where would we all be without you? Thank you for your insights. Will be testing it out against Physan.

 

[Ray]

I switched from Physan to Zero-Tol because - despite advertising saying otherwise - some plants are negatively affected by Physan, which is my opinion is best used as a disinfectant for the greenhouse structure and benches than for treating plants.

 

[Russ1992]

I switched from Physan to Zero-Tol because - despite advertising saying otherwise - some plants are negatively affected by Physan, which is my opinion is best used as a disinfectant for the greenhouse structure and benches than for treating plants.

Yes from my experience this is true. I have burned plants in the past using Physan. The EFG nursery owner told me the same thing which is why he prefers Zerotol.

Plus Physan states it will cause blindness if it gets in the eyes. I told this to Norman Fang at orchids.com his response was, "Oh they all say that! Peroxide is worse."

Once again 30,000+ orchid species and 300,000,000 opinions on how to grow them.

Will stick with Zerotol HC 5% peroxide undiluted. I have noticed others here on ST using Zerotol 2.0 which is 27% peroxide undiluted. If you go to the company's website they explicitly state that HC was made for hobbyists. Some of these diseases may be too strong for that product at the recommended dilution. Will report back findings using it less diluted on some problem plants.

 

[Ray]

As a general comment, I no longer use such products at all after coming to a stark reality about my culture - that I was “pushing” it too much by growing too many plants requiring different conditions, in close proximity with each other, so wasn’t really doing a good-enough job at it. That conclusion forced better discipline.

By “thinning the herd” to plants more closely aligned culturally and providing more space, which allowed my to do a better job of meeting the needs of the plants and keep up better with the housekeeping, the need for disinfecting has shrunk. I’m sure my regular use of probiotics has also helped, but I saw improvement prior to that.

 

[Russ1992]

As a general comment, I no longer use such products at all after coming to a stark reality about my culture - that I was “pushing” it too much by growing too many plants requiring different conditions, in close proximity with each other, so wasn’t really doing a good-enough job at it. That conclusion forced better discipline.

By “thinning the herd” to plants more closely aligned culturally and providing more space, which allowed my to do a better job of meeting the needs of the plants and keep up better with the housekeeping, the need for disinfecting has shrunk. I’m sure my regular use of probiotics has also helped, but I saw improvement prior to that.

Yes thinning the herd makes all the sense in the world. Quality over quantity.

 

[Just1more]

I’ve done. Quick search for zero tolerance and only finding it for sale in 1 gal. containers. Is anyone buying it in a smaller size, if so where have you found it?

 

[Russ1992]

I’ve done. Quick search for zero tolerance and only finding it for sale in 1 gal. containers. Is anyone buying it in a smaller size, if so where have you found it?

Unfortunately I have never found it any smaller myself.

 

[NYEric]

Now, I find this thread! LOL!