Overpotting culture

[Stone]

Wider is better than taller. But you must adapt the watering procedure to account for the media depth.
In a deep pot there will be a horizontal zone or layer that is the best root area depending on how and when water is applied.
Also with deep pots there is an effect of gravity where the plant must lift the water higher to reach the leaf tips. It takes energy to raise water upward.

Gary...Excellent orchid growing observations and culture. Hats off!

Lance...Plants do not ''lift'' water. The water is taken up via capillery action. As water is transpired from the leaf, so more is drawn up to replace it. That's how a redwood can get water 300 feet high. The plants do none of the work and use zero energy for water uptake. They use a little energy to hold the 5% they use and the rest goes right through.

As for deep vs wide, I know a nurseryman who swares he gets much better growth in Paphs with deep pots. Yet I have seen fantastic growth with a very shallow ''container''...namely the floor of my g/house. 1 brick deep and 1 metre wide. I think what's important is the root can freely travel in a straight line-as you mentioned- and this somehow boosts the plant response

 

[Ozpaph]

Great growth - keep doing what you're doing.

Most paph growers, here, use tall pots with success - might be a climate thing.

 

[gonewild]

Lance...Plants do not ''lift'' water. The water is taken up via capillery action. As water is transpired from the leaf, so more is drawn up to replace it. That's how a redwood can get water 300 feet high. The plants do none of the work and use zero energy for water uptake. They use a little energy to hold the 5% they use and the rest goes right through.

I used the word "lift" to try to simplify my statement. (Lift, meaning moved from soil to plant.)
Water is taken up by capillary action but the capillary action is controlled during the process of transpiration. Transpiration control uses energy from the plant.

 

[Ray]

Everytime I had plants submerged they died

Of course. You drowned them.

If, on the other hand, the roots had grown down into the water, they would have tailored themselves to that environment, and would have done fine. In fact, you'll often see that roots in the liquid are fatter than the ones above.

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There has been some good feedback on the use of large pots here. It all comes down to moisture management, as has been discussed.

Evaporation occurs at interfaces, with the predominate being medium-to-air and medium-to-pot wall (even if it's plastic). The way most people pot up their plants and water, as the medium dries, it's the center of the medium that does so last - right in the middle of the root mass - and that "soppy center" can suffocate the roots.

That is not an issue at all with semi-hydroponics, as the LECA wicks the moisture quite uniformly, and can be avoided in traditional media that don't wick well by making it open and airy, so the water in the center can evaporate faster.

Then, the only other concern with "overpotting" is making sure the plant is very mechanically stable in the pot while its roots take over, as even the slightest wobble will cause them to stop growing.

 

[troy]

I tried that they all died semi hydro doesn't work for me

 

[Carper]

While I am on the subject of large pots I will throw another open question.

By attempting to grow a larger root system, is this taking anything away from the bloom ie, putting it's energy into growth instead. As the plant grows in size will it produce larger spikes or is that in the DNA of the plant?

Gary

 

[Berthold]

While I am on the subject of large pots I will throw another open question.

By attempting to grow a larger root system, is this taking anything away from the bloom ie, putting it's energy into growth instead.
Gary

A species like Phragmipedium kovachii needs a root system of at least 5 m long to support its very big bloom in development.
A large pot filled with roots can only be an advantage.

 

[gonewild]

While I am on the subject of large pots I will throw another open question.

By attempting to grow a larger root system, is this taking anything away from the bloom ie, putting it's energy into growth instead. As the plant grows in size will it produce larger spikes or is that in the DNA of the plant?

Gary

larger plant equals larger spikes and flowers... up to the maximum size allowed by genetics.

 

[Ray]

semi hydro doesn't work for me

That just tickles me! Not picking on you, Troy, just using this as an example.

When folks fail with sphagnum, the usual comment is "I kill everything I put in sphagnum", acknowledging that the grower just doesn't know how to use it properly. However...

When someone fails with S/H culture, the response is that "it" doesn't work, rather than "I didn't do it right".


Ray Barkalow
firstrays.com

 

[troy]

My humidity is too high to use semi hydro, I get rot problems

 

[gonewild]

My humidity is too high to use semi hydro, I get rot problems

Simi hydro should result in less rot problems than organic media.

 

[troy]

I would have to see it to beleive it, can you show me pictures? plants sitting in water in my grow area die, thats my experience, I water let dry out mostly, then water agian, it's easy for me, I'm not use to semi hydro, if you would want to explain the dynamics, I would listen very carefully and possibly try it

 

[gonewild]

Ray can explain the dynamics.

My experience growing in leca with pots standing in water is that it is impossible to over water them.

 

[troy]

My nights here 64° farenheit my days are 73° farenheit with 70 '/. Humidity night and day is that good for semi hydro?

 

[Stone]

My humidity is too high to use semi hydro, I get rot problems

Its not the humidity. During a wet monsoon (which is a massive WIND system), the plants are saturated for days on end and the humidity is upwards of 100%. Air movement (or not enough) is your problem. If you cannot see the plants leaves moving, you don't have enough air. If we could arrange a stiff breeze in our growing enclosures we would have fewer problems. Remember too that air circulation at the roots is directly related to air circulation outside the pot. If you have rot problems, always look to the issue of air first!

 

[troy]

I have 3 fans, my plants dry out 3 days after I fertilize, I have to water agian. In summer after 1 day I was rewatering

 

[Ray]

I guess the real question is "Where, in the plants' root growth, did you move them into S/H?"

We expect the existing roots to succumb after moving the plant into S/H. When they grew, they "tailored" themselves for an entirely different environment, so will be less-than-optimal for the new conditions. If we time things right and move the plants when brand new roots are emerging from the base of the plant, they will be optimized for the new conditions, and will support the plant. The greater difference between old- and new conditions, the more rapidly the old roots will die and rot.

Most of the problems folks have with a plant established in S/H culture is too low humidity, which results in excessive evaporative cooling of the root system, in the open, airy medium. That is particularly an issue with phalaenopsis grown in homes when the thermostats are pushed down at night in the dry winter - the result is roots too cold to survive. In high humidity, there is little-to-no evaporative cooling, so that's not an issue.

 

[troy]

Thats interesting to know, thank you, I found your semi hydro culture website I'll read up on that, on another note bsides copper sulfate what other copper complex will work, for orange rust fungus eradication?

 

[Carper]

Thanks everyone for the input and with nothing in the way of negative comments, but possible alternatives I'll take this forward just a bit more. As I've stated and others have about the benefits of a larger root system, how far do you go with reference to pot size. I've seen seriously rootbound plants which could then reduce the surface area for nutrient uptake, so If I can get fast growth by successfully overpotting, without dividing or the plant suffering in any way, where's the limit?

Gary

 

[gonewild]

where's the limit?

Gary

The edge of the pot is the limit.