Paph. gigantifolium & CITES

[Ernie]

Ramon,

Fair enough. I guess I used *...* on purpose (not "..."). That is apparently how the US interprets the Convention then.

-Ernie

 

[fcabarle]

I would expect that the American Orchid Society would take an agressive stand and pursue their stated goal "Support the preservation and perpetuation of orchid species.". They appear to be silent !! Obviously there is something wrong with CITES as currently written/enforced and the AOS has a wonderful opportunity to use their resources to correct the situation. There are many, many growers in the USA capable of producing plants from seed so why not get this seed into the USA instead of giving the advantage to Taiwan, China and Europe. They get both the plants and seed at the cost of raping the jungles when all we really need is the seed and an equitable distribution system for the flasks/seedlings. We (the AOS and the CITES) say we want to conserve but the actions result in destruction. Come on AOS, wake up and help out the orchid community; fulfill your stated purpose !!

 

[slippertalker]

Of course the AOS has been lobbying regarding this situation....Many paph and phrag growers are part of the AOS including commercial growers that have great influence. The problem is the original placement of these plants as CITES I with whales, gorillas, etc and inconsistent interpretation of the regulations by the member nations and non-members such as Taiwan simply ignoring the regulations.

American orchid growers are at the mercy of the bureaucrats that determine legality. If they are strict, they are just following the rule of law as preferred by our conservative judiciary. Don't blame the AOS.......

 

[NYEric]

I can't blame the AOS but certainly I would expect to see some kind of organized effort to revise or clarify the interpretation after all these years!

 

[Scooby5757]

OK, so in a elevator speech (45-60 seconds) to president Obama, what would be the bullet points that need to be driven home to at least peak some interest that would allow for possible further discussion?

 

[Clark]

You'll never get past Pelosi.

 

[slippertalker]

This isn't exactly a priority for politicians these days.

 

[SlipperKing]

Awh Bill, You didn't have to be so hard on the guy! LOL

 

[SlipperFan]

You'll never get past Pelosi.

As if Pelosi is the problem!

 

[slippertalker]

Awh Bill, You didn't have to be so hard on the guy! LOL

Hey I got more than that!

 

[Clark]

As if Pelosi is the problem!

If its not good for Nancy, it won't be good for Barry.
Stretch-face is running the show.
The show is called- How to Stay in Power.

No problem for orchid lovers, just not enough votes.

 

[NYEric]

My bullet points would be:
. There is some room for interpretation of the CITES
. As it is being enforced orchid growers in the USA are being denied access to conservation and financial materials that are available to other nations.
. Someone in the government should meet with orchid expert in this country to see how the situation can be improved.

 

[Rick]

I can't blame the AOS but certainly I would expect to see some kind of organized effort to revise or clarify the interpretation after all these years!

The AOS is broke and can barely keep the magazine going let alone lobby the US Government.

I used to fly high power rockets. The BATF massively increased regs on the hobby about 20 some odd years ago. Which is one of the reasons I got out. Anyway I was just dinking around on the web a couple of weeks ago and found out the hobby rocket versions of the AOS (Tripoli Rocket Association and National Association of Rocketry) had just this past few months won their case against the BATF. I can't remember how many hundreds of thousands of $ expended and a 20 year battle. During that time I also contributed to special fundraisers for the legal/lobbying battle, and a significant portion of membership dues was diverted to this issue.

So I wouldn't expect AOS to be able to put up much of a front against CITES without eliciting a major membership support campaign. Part of this I think will need to demonstrate much better membership support of the AOS sponsored in situ conservation programs. The parallel to this in the rocket hobby was the training, certification, and safety program put together by TRA. Basically if you wanted to fly a high power rocket you had the equivalence of passing a drivers license test, which included proficiency exams for construction of rockets.

This is where the Species Survival Plan system for zoos comes in with CITES. Basically licensed growers who have demonstrated proficiency get the specimens and breed the crap out of them until they become commodity items.

 

[noel]

wow,you mention indonesia,surabaya,thats where i live
BTW,which surabaya grower?
trade for sand?
weird...
i have gigantifolium in my home in surabaya indonesia,and it's true that indonesian people can get it without dealing with serious problem,and the problem was it's rarity in the market...
but that's true,sometimes indo goverment are a bit stupid and selfish
but dont worry,although i'm indonesian,i'm on your side,hehehehehe...

 

[Eric Muehlbauer]

The CITES issues seem to be purely administrative issues at the USFW. I think what will eventually happen is that as more and more flasks of "forbidden" species become more and more available, along with uncounted hybrids that are indistinguishable from legal hybrids, the USFW will gradually relax their prohibitions on plants that are confirmed seedlings. I think that they will do this quietly and gradually. What will most likely motivate them will not be the demands of growers and hobbyists but the reality of dollars and cents..it won't be worth putting the resources into pursuing what is regarded as legal elsewhere in the world...and its hard to justify the cost of the legal efforts for plants that are clearly not a threat to wild populations. The AOS will probably be of no importance in changing the attitude of USFW...as mentioned, the AOS has too many financial problems of its own, and desperately wants more members...most of the AOS membership is into phals and cattleyas, and really don't consider CITES a high priority. The AOS wants new members more than anything, and does not want to distract or bore the potential recruits with arguments over obscure plants that most of these people would find ugly aanyway....Take care, Eric

 

[SelectOrchids]

wow,you mention indonesia,surabaya,thats where i live
BTW,which surabaya grower?
trade for sand?
weird...
i have gigantifolium in my home in surabaya indonesia,and it's true that indonesian people can get it without dealing with serious problem,and the problem was it's rarity in the market...
but that's true,sometimes indo goverment are a bit stupid and selfish
but dont worry,although i'm indonesian,i'm on your side,hehehehehe...

Henry Foresta traded with Au Yong...

In Indo the problem is not that it is rare, the problem is that Api or Slamet want to make big bucks and only care to get a batck if you order more than 200...