Monsanto shall pay 289 million US$ indemnity

[Berthold]

Judge Bolanos now will reduce indemnity from 289 to 78 million US$

But how can know Suzanne Ramos Bolanos that glyphosat (Roundup) causes cancer while official US authority and authorities from 160 further nations don't see a correlation between Cancer and glyphosat.

Is judicature in the USA based on emotional faith?

 

[CarlG]

One can never predict what a jury will do. Emotions are often involved, and lawyers on both sides play to that: If the law is on your side, pound on the law. If the facts are on your side, pound on the facts. If neither are on your side, pound on the table.

 

[orchid527]

Berthold

It is a real problem in this country. The lawyers look for a suit friendly state like California or Louisiana where the awards are higher than average. They also advertise on the TV for clients for class action suits. Then they shop around for paid "experts" to support their position in court. That said, the real issue is that most people cannot distinguish between correlation and cause and effect. I'm sure that many people believe that if they have a problem and have ever used a product, it's the product's fault. The magnitude of this ignorance is demonstrated by the belief that vaccines cause autism. Mike

 

[Berthold]

Mike, I see the problem and I am baffled.

The WHO sees the cancer risk of Glyphsat on the same level as hairdressing profession and the consumption of hot drinks as "probably carcinogenic", sunbeams and alcohol as "safe carcinogenic".
Is that a base for a 70 million US$ indemnity really?

Are these members of the jury perhaps Homeopaths, who know about the strong impact of substances below a dilution of D30, what is 1 to 10**30 ?

 

[ehanes7612]

yeah, I am certain a 66 billion dollar company is really hurtin to pay that 79 million , I was at Home Depot yesterday..they are still devoting half a lane for Monsanto glyphosate products ....this thread is another example of someone (the OP) who needs to get a life

 

[KyushuCalanthe]

If the law is on your side, pound on the law. If the facts are on your side, pound on the facts. If neither are on your side, pound on the table.

Man, I don't know if that is yours or not, but it is brilliant!:clap:

 

[Hien]

Berthold

It is a real problem in this country. The lawyers look for a suit friendly state like California or Louisiana where the awards are higher than average. They also advertise on the TV for clients for class action suits. Then they shop around for paid "experts" to support their position in court. That said, the real issue is that most people cannot distinguish between correlation and cause and effect. I'm sure that many people believe that if they have a problem and have ever used a product, it's the product's fault. The magnitude of this ignorance is demonstrated by the belief that vaccines cause autism. Mike

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDyI10Z8aH0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN3LXjigjIg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjkJbramtbk

when in doubt, we should always protect ourselves, they never tell you the truth until it is too late for you to change your fate.

 

[Berthold]

yeah, I am certain a 66 billion dollar company is really hurtin to pay that 79 million ,

Nonsense, 8000 further suing for damages would destroy the whole company.

Glyphosat is the best product in the world for that application. There is no alternate substance known jet with such minimal byeffect.

I fear Your skill is not in this field.

 

[Berthold]

About 25% of Coca Cola drinkers in Germany die of Cancer. That are about 30000 people per year.

I think Coca Cola company shall pay 70 million Euro to each of them, because nobody knows if Coca Cola can cause cancer.

That is the logic of the jury from Madame Bolanos.

 

[ehanes7612]

Nonsense, 8000 further suing for damages would destroy the whole company.

GOOD!!!


While I dont think there is a strong correlation between cancer and glyphosate,.. I do believe the company has overreached in proprietary rights with their seeds. I grew up on two different farms in my childhood..the idea of a seed that is resistant to glyphosate while that seed enters the life cycles of other corn crops (transgenes) is an affront to many farmers and sensible people who understand the need for diversity in our food chain as well as protecting their own livelihood from lawsuits from Monsanto. The dependence on a single genetic strain of corn is a recipe for disaster in the long run. Monsanto is an insidious example of monoculture gone wrong. Right now, most corn crop is used for feeding cows (which is ******** given that cows are ruminants and probably contributes to the need for antibiotics) and for food additives like lecithin and high fructose corn syrup , the principle component of COCA COLA!!! (the latter being more of an issue with health problems than the direct application of glyphosate ), so while there may not be a direct correlation to cancer, there is a connection to health issues from the application of glyphosate in our crops. I, myself , will use any opportunity to diminish the use of glyphosate and the culture it encourages in our food system. I actively discourage the use of glyphosate and any synthetic herbicides when asked. There are better ways. ...and yes, I am very aware of the science ...my bachelor's degree was in molecular biology of plants and I was in a Phd program in biotechnology on the early 90's. I studied and worked with plasmid DNA vectors.The agency for creating altered DNA back in the 90's. I left when I realized what path that education might lead me to. (Implant snide/ignorant remark by Berthold right here)

You don't have to be a Homeopath (for what its worth, I find that the use of the word here on this forum displays a profound ignorance of homeopathic practices ) to understand the complexity of our food system within our ecology...and to know that we are what we eat...monoculture is creating a dangerous situation for humans on this planet..we didn't evolve this way..we evolved from a diverse array of genetic strains in our environment, Monsanto cannot have this or their profit margin dwindles...as orchid growers , we should all know this

 

[littlefrog]

About 25% of Coca Cola drinkers in Germany die of Cancer. That are about 30000 people per year.

I think Coca Cola company shall pay 70 million Euro to each of them, because nobody knows if Coca Cola can cause cancer.

That is the logic of the jury from Madame Bolanos.

You realize that the baseline rate for cancer diagnosis is 33% (1 in 3) over lifetime? 25% sounds pretty good for coke - is it protecting people? Yes, I know diagnosis and death rates are different, point is that statistics are dangerous weapons.

You will need far more persuasive data to get coca cola to be liable for damages. And yes, the jury was bamboozled.

 

[littlefrog]

Fully 100% of all cancer death patients have consumed water. Take that homeopaths.

 

[ehanes7612]

You realize that the baseline rate for cancer diagnosis is 33% (1 in 3) over lifetime? 25% sounds pretty good for coke - is it protecting people? Yes, I know diagnosis and death rates are different, point is that statistics are dangerous weapons.

You will need far more persuasive data to get coca cola to be liable for damages. And yes, the jury was bamboozled.

he was being sarcastic

 

[Berthold]

GOOD!!!


While I dont think there is a strong correlation between cancer and glyphosate,.. I do believe the company has overreached in proprietary rights with their seeds. I grew up on two different farms in my childhood..the idea of a seed that is resistant to glyphosate while that seed enters the life cycles of other corn crops (transgenes) is an affront to many farmers and sensible people who understand the need for diversity in our food chain as well as protecting their own livelihood from lawsuits from Monsanto. The dependence on a single genetic strain of corn is a recipe for disaster in the long run. Monsanto is an insidious example of monoculture gone wrong. Right now, most corn crop is used for feeding cows (which is ******** given that cows are ruminants and probably contributes to the need for antibiotics) and for food additives like lecithin and high fructose corn syrup , the principle component of COCA COLA!!! (the latter being more of an issue with health problems than the direct application of glyphosate ), so while there may not be a direct correlation to cancer, there is a connection to health issues from the application of glyphosate in our crops. I, myself , will use any opportunity to diminish the use of glyphosate and the culture it encourages in our food system. I actively discourage the use of glyphosate and any synthetic herbicides when asked. There are better ways. ...and yes, I am very aware of the science ...my bachelor's degree was in molecular biology of plants and I was in a Phd program in biotechnology on the early 90's. I studied and worked with plasmid DNA vectors.The agency for creating altered DNA back in the 90's. I left when I realized what path that education might lead me to. (Implant snide/ignorant remark by Berthold right here)

You don't have to be a Homeopath (for what its worth, I find that the use of the word here on this forum displays a profound ignorance of homeopathic practices ) to understand the complexity of our food system within our ecology...and to know that we are what we eat...monoculture is creating a dangerous situation for humans on this planet..we didn't evolve this way..we evolved from a diverse array of genetic strains in our environment, Monsanto cannot have this or their profit margin dwindles...as orchid growers , we should all know this

Sorry, You missed the topic of this thread.

1. The only question the Balonos jury had to decide was "is there a clear caused correlation between Glyphosat and cancer".
The jury decided yes but had no data for that.

2. Homeopathy is an absurd faith based ideology which is in contradiction to all scientific knowledge. It has no physiological effect at all, which is proved in an lot of scientific studies.
Dangerous is that there is a psychological effect on human beings, what we call Placebo. People feel good and therefor don't ask for medical assistance but they have a fatal disease.
There are some similarities between Homeopathy and religions.
Glyphosat seems to have a homeopathic effect on some human beings also.

So homeopathic practices should be prohibited.

 

[ehanes7612]

Sorry, You missed the topic of this thread.

1. The only question the Balonos jury had to decide was "is there a clear caused correlation between Glyphosat and cancer".
The jury decided yes but had no data for that.

2. Homeopathy is an absurd faith based ideology which is in contradiction to all scientific knowledge. It has no physiological effect at all, which is proved in an lot of scientific studies.
Dangerous is that there is a psychological effect on human beings, what we call Placebo. People feel good and therefor don't ask for medical assistance but they have a fatal disease.
There are some similarities between Homeopathy and religions.
Glyphosat seems to have a homeopathic effect on some human beings also.

So homeopathic practices should be prohibited.

You opened the floor by saying Glyphosate is a godsend of a product (paraphrased)...this opened your topic to a wider variety of criticism because Glyphosate has multiple applications and contributions that aren't necessarily measured in direct health effects but also is a consequence of society in general and how we approach our problems

The placebo effect has a very strong relationship in standard medical practice especially with pain management and cancer treatment (practiced by medical doctors )...homeopathy is in the forefront of this philosophy. Your statement that homeopathic practices should be prohibited is in regard to only acknowledging a tiny part of a spectrum of the practice (such as practices by Romani or certain christian sects). You would outlaw a doctors suggestion that a patient move to a more hospitable environment because there may be short term advantages (or even long term) ..this is also Homeopathy

 

[Berthold]

Your statement that homeopathic practices should be prohibited is in regard to only acknowledging a tiny part of a spectrum of the practice (such as practices by Romani or certain christian sects).

For Your information only, unfortunately I am very familiar with the complete homeopathic applications spectrum due to family connection to a homeopath.
And in addition there are some more physicians in my family and my surrounding.

All this homeopathic nonsense bases on fantasy of the German Samuel Hahnemann, which could never verified scientifically

 

[ehanes7612]

There are charlatans and bad people in every practice...it is common practice in the US for doctors to push a specific drug by a pharmaceutical company either because they are too busy to research the alternative drugs (that may be more effective) or because they are getting kickbacks. Homeopathy has its charlatans too...I live in Seattle ..probably the area with more homeopaths per square mile than any other city in the US...many of them prescribe to a balanced approach to homeopathy and medical science...they are called naturopaths/osteopaths. And, of course, there are those who are are zealots about homeopathic purity (such as the anti vaxxers) ...I consider them to be dangerous people for various reasons...but the only way to resist them is with information and not prescribing an entire sect of philosophical tenets to being flawed and requiring a prohibition. Although, if it weren't for homeopaths , the awareness of the need for clean drinking water would have been delayed by some years...they do provide a certain amount of passion to the argument for more healthy practices...especially the argument that we have to view our material health in a more wholistic sense (spiritual , emotional as well as physical) to be of sound mind and body...and to me , that is what lawsuits like those against companies like Monsanto, represent..even if those attributes are not admissible in court

 

[troy]

Berthold, do you even grow orchids? You keep posting your personal political beleifs, than arguing without knowing what you are arguing about, you should be banned

 

[ehanes7612]

Berthold, do you even grow orchids? You keep posting your personal political beleifs, than arguing without knowing what you are arguing about, you should be banned

it is plant related

 

[CarlG]

Not mine. Read it on a law blog years ago.