Unfortunate Ebay oops... no hope, right?

[Morja]

I ordered this plant on Ebay, only to cancel the order immediately because I used the wrong payment method, then reordered correctly. I got the plant from the second/correct order. Meanwhile, my order cancel attempt from the first purchase was denied. Unfamiliar with Ebay I didn't know what that meant, but nothing happened so I forgot about it. Well, turns out that meant I bought it twice, and I got a second plant while I was out of town earlier this week. It's... bad. Sat in its box for a little over a week, and as a tiny phrag seedling it just couldn't take it. Rot and mealies. Anything I can do for this one? And is this totally my fault because I didn't understand ebay, or do you think I could possibly get a refund?
My other seedling also had mealybugs, and was almost destroyed in shipping due to the USPS slowdown during the recent hurricane, but I think it will pull through. I let the seller know its condition when it arrived but they just told me how to treat mealybugs (already done/doing it) as a response. I don't have great hope that they will be especially helpful this time either, I'm just bummed because I was actually excited when I realized I had a second seedling because it's going to be a beautiful cross (Phrag Asuko Fischer x kovachii). Oh well. Lots of lessons learned with this one.

 

[Morja]

Just to be clear I don't want to poop too hard on the seller here, I'm sure they're a fine person, I just bumbled this and I'm unfamiliar with how it should be handled and if there is hope for the plant.

 

[TyroneGenade]

If this person is knowingly selling plants infested with mealie bugs then you should complain and rate them down. Did they advertise a mealie bug infested plant? These are pretty tiny plants -- how do you miss the bugs?

Everything else is the risk you take with e-commerce.

 

[big923cattleya]

One suggestion if I may. After ordering some smaller Phrag seedlings two or so years ago, I have stopped doing it. My success rate of keeping them alive for 6 months is like, 25%.
It could be my fault. It could be shipping issues although they were never in transit for more then four days. But frankly, they were small seedlings, price was right but I was just throwing my money away.
Perhaps they were compot dug ups? Perhaps too small to leave their mother’s side?
Like I said, maybe 100% my fault but these little guys are just too hard for me to handle.
Now, if I see a Phrag seedling on line, I want a multiple growth seedling, growth and a lead minimum.
And as I posted here before watch the vendors description. “Plant for sale is similar to the one in the photograph” means it is not for me. I don’t want one ‘similar to’! I want a plant as shown on line.

You’ll learn more and more as you go.

 

[gonewild]

Is that how it looked on arrival? How was the seedlings packed inside the box? Wrapping? Insulated? Dry or wet?

 

[Tom-DE]

It has been mummified naturally You should send it back and charge them for the mummification process.

 

[Morja]

Is that how it looked on arrival? How was the seedlings packed inside the box? Wrapping? Insulated? Dry or wet?

I mean, I don't know how it looked when it arrived to the mail box a week ago, since I was gone and couldn't retrieve it immediately. But the box was intact for its whole journey at least and it still managed to be pretty smashed.
It was basically in a pot, taped with a slit in the top for the plant, wrapped in paper that was taped together to pad it. 2-3 layers around it probably. The wrapped plant was nested in paper shreddings. It probably got set upside down for a while at the mail office or something. The paper would naturally pad it initially, but it was humid in the box and things likely compressed. It looked like the plant tried to fall out of the pot but got somewhat caught.
Humid paper aside, the plant was pretty dry. The roots (all 3 of them, small plant... but I knew it was a seedling) were dessicated-dry but also moldy.
Again I know it wasn't sent in this condition. It's just sad to lose it.

Hard to see, but the stem/area where roots try to grow was falling out of the tape slit. The leaf was smashed/wilted over it so I had to pull it back to examine it. The roots were almost completely uncovered beneath.

Unfortunate roots:

 

[gonewild]

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Strong healthy properly packed plants should withstand a week without damage. The plant does not look like it was growing very well before it was shipped. The roots look like they are probably from the flask not secondary roots growing from the base after planting. Basically very poorly grown.
There is no excuse for shipping plants infested with mealy bugs and getting a replacement is the last thing you should want. That is unless the plant is so rare it is worth the infestation risk to you.

 

[Morja]

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Strong healthy properly packed plants should withstand a week without damage. The plant does not look like it was growing very well before it was shipped. The roots look like they are probably from the flask not secondary roots growing from the base after planting. Basically very poorly grown.
There is no excuse for shipping plants infested with mealy bugs and getting a replacement is the last thing you should want. That is unless the plant is so rare it is worth the infestation risk to you.

Fair points all around. Yes, I do not think I will order from them again.

 

[Djthomp28]

I want to double what @gonewild said, especially the comment on the roots. I have deflasked 25+ phrag species and crosses. Those roots are the roots from the flask. So it appears that this plant was removed from flask and sold before new roots that are more suitable for thrive outside of the flask could establish. I question if a compot or other intermediate stage was completed. Moving from flask to an established compot is a very vulnerable time for phrags. Honestly, it is a tricky period for most orchids, but most of my experience is with phrags. I say this to say, selling a plant that young is risky. The failure rate is just higher with these. Try not to let it get you down. How is the other seedling doing? Did I understand correctly that you made a double order and have another plant?

Also, no matter how long it was it the box, mealy bugs, especially that level of infestation, are a major problem. Those pests were shipped on the plant. they did not appear because it was in the box too long.

 

[qcia13]

ebay has a 30 day money back satisfaction guarantee.

if the plants are infested/damaged when you rec'd them, if the seller won't refund, initiate a return with ebay and they should refund, especially if the seller is selling plants infested with bugs or dead leaves/roots.

 

[Phragper]

don’t know if this will help your plants. this piece of a broken off phrag (pic attached) was nothing but that about 2 months ago. i had a jar with some hydrangea cuttings soaking in water and a teaspoon of kelpak. dropped the piece of the orchid in. now. wow. roots and 2 new growths.

 

[Morja]

I want to double what @gonewild said, especially the comment on the roots. I have deflasked 25+ phrag species and crosses. Those roots are the roots from the flask. So it appears that this plant was removed from flask and sold before new roots that are more suitable for thrive outside of the flask could establish. I question if a compot or other intermediate stage was completed. Moving from flask to an established compot is a very vulnerable time for phrags. Honestly, it is a tricky period for most orchids, but most of my experience is with phrags. I say this to say, selling a plant that young is risky. The failure rate is just higher with these. Try not to let it get you down. How is the other seedling doing? Did I understand correctly that you made a double order and have another plant?

Also, no matter how long it was it the box, mealy bugs, especially that level of infestation, are a major problem. Those pests were shipped on the plant. they did not appear because it was in the box too long.

Okay, I feel a bit more validated. Thank you! One of these days when I have a bit more space, I'll try my hand at an established compot. The dream is to grow out some flasks, but that's physically impossible for me now, so I should probably stick to bigger plants for a while!
I do have another! It came in a similarly smashed and dehydrated state (its actual box got smashed when it got held up in Miami) and I had to chop a leaf off that had a rot spot (which was actually fortunate because this led me to discover and treat the mealybugs, which weren't immediately obvious). A week later it is still green at least. I put saran wrap with a few holes poked in it over its pot to try to help it adjust and recover. I hope it makes it! It had a Kelpak soak so hopefully it gets roots going ASAP too.
The day it arrived:

Today. It looks a bit stressed, we'll see. It's time to treat for mealies again. I'll be using rubbing alcohol weekly for a few weeks to be safe.

 

[Morja]

don’t know if this will help your plants. this piece of a broken off phrag (pic attached) was nothing but that about 2 months ago. i had a jar with some hydrangea cuttings soaking in water and a teaspoon of kelpak. dropped the piece of the orchid in. now. wow. roots and 2 new growths.

So did you just keep it in Kelpak water for 2 months? I'm assuming you changed it out like weekly? That's crazy! Haha. I have an phrag I nearly killed that looks a LOT like that, 3 new growths off of a stump with a now single shriveling leaf. Waiting on the roots!

 

[Morja]

ebay has a 30 day money back satisfaction guarantee.

if the plants are infested/damaged when you rec'd them, if the seller won't refund, initiate a return with ebay and they should refund, especially if the seller is selling plants infested with bugs or dead leaves/roots.

Will I have to physically send it back? I mean I guess at this rate I wouldn't be losing much.
In typical millennial fashion the thought of making a stink and being potentially perceived as rude by the seller in the process makes me want to go hide But I may try anyway.

 

[jgroc002]

I think I can guess as to who the seller is and I have never had luck with the seedlings purchased from them. Could be me but I have also purchased small businesses phrag seedlings from others and it seems like a 50/50 if they transport well and don’t rot within a couple of weeks.

In my opinion, that vendor seems to sell plants freshly out of flash that have not established at all. At best they may be hardened off but is not worthy of putting a name on it.

Best of luck of either of them survive though.

 

[Morja]

I think I can guess as to who the seller is and I have never had luck with the seedlings purchased from them. Could be me but I have also purchased small businesses phrag seedlings from others and it seems like a 50/50 if they transport well and don’t rot within a couple of weeks.

In my opinion, that vendor seems to sell plants freshly out of flash that have not established at all. At best they may be hardened off but is not worthy of putting a name on it.

Best of luck of either of them survive though.

Yeah, it wouldn't be hard to figure it out, haha. I poked around here on ST before I purchased anything and saw that there were mixed opinions, but decided the price was okay enough that I could risk a little and try it. Some people just have to learn their lessons the hard way I guess!

 

[qcia13]

i purchased 3 phrags on ebay too recently, the larger one is doing ok, the 2 smaller ones have lost a few leaves already.

i saw some white powder on the leaves on all 3 phrags too, thought the powder was small pieces of perlite so i carefully wiped the leaves with a piece of paper. didn't know they are bugs.

if the seller sends you a return label, you need to return the phrags.

if ebay doesn't send you a return label when you initiate the refund, then you might be able to keep the phrags.

 

[Austin Creek]

I agree with others who have said that if the plants were infested with mealy bugs when they arrived the seller should absolutely refund (or replace) them.

Speaking as an eBay seller myself, I would ask that you first contact the seller directly and give them a fair opportunity to correct the issue. If they don't respond satisfactorily, then pursue a return or provide appropriate feedback on the transaction.

With USPS Priority Mail sometimes taking up to 2 weeks to be delivered and unseasonably hot or cold weather during some times of the year, even the healthiest of plants can turn to a pile of mush during shipment. It's not an eBay requirement, but I personally guarantee safe arrival of healthy plants and will immediately address any issues brought to my attention. It is frustrating to me when buyers receive damaged plants and choose to leave negative feedback rather than contacting me about the issue.

 

[Morja]

I agree with others who have said that if the plants were infested with mealy bugs when they arrived the seller should absolutely refund (or replace) them.

Speaking as an eBay seller myself, I would ask that you first contact the seller directly and give them a fair opportunity to correct the issue. If they don't respond satisfactorily, then pursue a return or provide appropriate feedback on the transaction.

With USPS Priority Mail sometimes taking up to 2 weeks to be delivered and unseasonably hot or cold weather during some times of the year, even the healthiest of plants can turn to a pile of mush during shipment. It's not an eBay requirement, but I personally guarantee safe arrival of healthy plants and will immediately address any issues brought to my attention. It is frustrating to me when buyers receive damaged plants and choose to leave negative feedback rather than contacting me about the issue.

I agree that contacting the seller before leaving feedback is super important. I've already sent a message, and I'm personally more likely to not leave feedback at all than to leave negative feedback, haha.