kovachii x Saint Ouen

[Kyle]

Yes sir, it makes a big diference to use the pollen or PK as mother plant. Mr Decker has both because CJM orchids did both flasks. There are no "mistakes " here. The plants do not look like boisserianum or caudatum var wallisi...and the flowers for sure are truly kovachii hybrids...
Perhaps it could be more interesting for you to know that CJM Orchids has Phrag hybrids growing in their collection since 1996, when the Int Orchid Shows in Lima and some presentations in Miami area (Redland), Los Angeles, New York and other cities in the US. All these years the selection of Phrag hybrids were legally imported to Peru. You can ask INRENA about these importations. There are records of them.
If anybody is willing to offer a diferent version for legal stock of PK and legally imported and exported Phrag Hybrids has to prove it. There are no other legal importation for Phrags, according to INRENA data on Phrag Hybrids, requiring CITES II documents at Lima airport. CJM Orchids is the only bussines with all Phrags (species and hybrids) growing in legal conditions.

I think you completely missed the point of my question. And I think Ron probably has the answer. Is this kovachii x St. Ouen or St. Ouen x kovachii?

Kyle

 

[Ron-NY]

I think you completely missed the point of my question. And I think Ron probably has the answer. Is this kovachii x St. Ouen or St. Ouen x kovachii?

Kyle

As far as I am aware, it is kovachii x Saint Ouen. That is how it is labeled so I assume it is correct.

 

[Heather]

I have to say, I was THRILLED to get the photo last night and it was all I could do to wait for Mr. Delinquent, aka Ron, (j/k Ron!!) to get around to posting today but I knew he had permission from Glen and I did not.

I worked for Glen last weekend at my local show and boy was I left excited for all of these goings on this week! Aiiieee!

 

[PHRAG]

I am too lazy to open multiple windows. Can someone post some comparison photos of a kovachii species, a St. Ouen and the hybrid?

 

[Kyle]

Thanks Ron.

 

[isaias m rolando]

No sir. I have not missed the point. The fact you want to disregard accurate info is because you may be acting for the competitors. Of course after their "mistakes" and convicted actions against CITES and US Department of Justice they are trying to use some people to disregard the good results of legal PK and hybrids in the market.
I am out of this discusion. I will respond to legal tenants of PKs and hybrids only...
Have a good week

 

[kentuckiense]

No sir. I have not missed the point. The fact you want to disregard accurate info is because you may be acting for the competitors. Of course after their "mistakes" and convicted actions against CITES and US Department of Justice they are trying to use some people to disregard the good results of legal PK and hybrids in the market.
I am out of this discusion. I will respond to legal tenants of PKs and hybrids only...
Have a good week

Sorry, I'm pretty sure Kyle is not "acting for the competitors." This damn plant drives everyone off the deep end.

 

[gore42]

No sir. I have not missed the point. The fact you want to disregard accurate info is because you may be acting for the competitors. Of course after their "mistakes" and convicted actions against CITES and US Department of Justice they are trying to use some people to disregard the good results of legal PK and hybrids in the market.
I am out of this discusion. I will respond to legal tenants of PKs and hybrids only...
Have a good week

WTF?

- Matt

 

[John M]

No sir. I have not missed the point. The fact you want to disregard accurate info is because you may be acting for the competitors. Of course after their "mistakes" and convicted actions against CITES and US Department of Justice they are trying to use some people to disregard the good results of legal PK and hybrids in the market.
I am out of this discusion. I will respond to legal tenants of PKs and hybrids only...
Have a good week

Does anybody know what the hell he's talking about?

 

[John M]

Yes sir, it makes a big diference to use the pollen or PK as mother plant. Mr Decker has both because CJM orchids did both flasks. There are no "mistakes " here. The plants do not look like boisserianum or caudatum var wallisi...and the flowers for sure are truly kovachii hybrids...
Perhaps it could be more interesting for you to know that CJM Orchids has Phrag hybrids growing in their collection since 1996, when the Int Orchid Shows in Lima and some presentations in Miami area (Redland), Los Angeles, New York and other cities in the US. All these years the selection of Phrag hybrids were legally imported to Peru. You can ask INRENA about these importations. There are records of them.
If anybody is willing to offer a diferent version for legal stock of PK and legally imported and exported Phrag Hybrids has to prove it. There are no other legal importation for Phrags, according to INRENA data on Phrag Hybrids, requiring CITES II documents at Lima airport. CJM Orchids is the only bussines with all Phrags (species and hybrids) growing in legal conditions.

Again; What the hell....?

 

[gonewild]

Does anybody know what the hell he's talking about?

INTERVENTION!

I think there has been a misunderstanding. English to Castillian Spanish to English.

I see an error with translation and meanings of words and phrases.

I think Isaias misunderstood Kyle to be questioning whether the pollen source for the hybrids was legal. He explained that CJM has all the hybrids in Peru to make the crosses legally.

Isais, I think Kyle meant that it makes a genetic difference whether kovachii is the pollen or pod parent. Is that correct Kyle?

If I'm wrong then move the argument to the kovachii battle thread.

Everybody be friends in this nice thread and enjoy the bloom.

No I'm not a moderator, but so what?

 

[kentuckiense]

I see an error with translation and meanings of words and phrases.

Yeah, I think that's what happened.

Back on track: this hybrid definitely exceeded my expectations. I can't wait to see Pk x besseae!

 

[ohio-guy]

I hope the beauty of this hybrid bodes well for the native pk's as I think most (or many) hobbyists will be more interested in growing crosses which will have hybrid vigor and improve on faults of parent plants, such as floppy flowers, or small flowers, or difficulty or slowness to blooming. And it certainly seems the crosses are availible in good numbers...it will be exciting to see the remainder crosses bloom, and then to see the next generation after these.

 

[ohio-guy]

By the way, look back again at post 27 of the whole plant. It looks like this was blooming on a little 3 leave plant, the flower looks huge in relation to the young plant...

 

[Kyle]

INTERVENTION!
I think Isaias misunderstood Kyle to be questioning whether the pollen source for the hybrids was legal. He explained that CJM has all the hybrids in Peru to make the crosses legally.

Isais, I think Kyle meant that it makes a genetic difference whether kovachii is the pollen or pod parent. Is that correct Kyle?

Thats exactly what I was asking, and I think it runs a little deeper then bad translation, considering I made a second post more clearly outlining what my question was.

I just wanted some clearification considering everywhere the seedlings are being advertised for sale with PK as the capsule holder, then a guy with inside info comes out and says the opposite is true.

For me, I would like to know becasue I do some amuture phrag breeding and would like to figure out what traits PK passes on through its pollen or vice versa. That was my motivation for the question.

I apologize to Ron for the blip in an otherwise fantastic thread, and to every one incase this guy doesn't post the pictures of the mother plants as he promised, becasue I pissed him off.

And for the record, I have met Manolo Arias (the competion) but am no way acting in his behalf and do not keep in contact with him, nor have I spoken with him in over a year.

I would be foolish (and it would be impossible) for me to say that that plant is anything but a kovachii hybrid (which I think everyone (but one guy...) knows that wasn't what I was asking.

Carry on!

 

[Ron-NY]

By the way, look back again at post 27 of the whole plant. It looks like this was blooming on a little 3 leave plant, the flower looks huge in relation to the young plant...

There are 4 mature leaves...I obviously didn't get one into the picture.

Kyle the mother kovachii plants were posted in my thread when I returned from Peru.

 

[John M]

Thats exactly what I was asking, and I think it runs a little deeper then bad translation, considering I made a second post more clearly outlining what my question was.

I'm with Kyle - 100%. It was much more than a translation problem. What came to my mind was "Oh God, not another misinformed big FAT ego!". It'd be nice to stick to the facts, stay on topic and not resort to accusations so easily.

My appologies to Ron for my contributing to the tainting of his thread. I love the photos and would love to see more as things change. Thanks Ron!

 

[NYEric]

Back on track: this hybrid definitely exceeded my expectations. I can't wait to see Pk x besseae!

Ummm.. This is the third mention of a Pk x besseae hybrid in this thread and I think I'm pretty well tapped into besseae hybrids. Has anyone ever had these for sale and WHOM!!! :fight:

 

[Kyle]

I read (and saw pictures) on another forum that someone in the US have besseae x kovachii in spike. Shouldn't be long till we see those.

I think this hybrid gives us a good idea of what kovachii brings to this type of breeding. Although its difficult to make any judgements from one flower.

I want to see hybrids with plants from different sections of the genus phrag. Wallisii hybrids should bloom soon.

Kyle

 

[Ron-NY]

Ummm.. This is the third mention of a Pk x besseae hybrid in this thread and I think I'm pretty well tapped into besseae hybrids. Has anyone ever had these for sale and WHOM!!! :fight:

This cross was made by both Arias and Manrique. I don't know if any one is offering any at this time. I had seen that HP Norton was offering some at a lecture in VA last September