do I have reason to complain?

[TyroneGenade]

Hello,

I need your opinions to make up my mind whether to complain or not.

My wife got me an orchid for Father's day. It was shipped on the Tuesday before Fathers Day and opened on Fathers day having spent several days in the box. On opening, the the plant looked perfectly healthy but dry so I drenched it under the tap in the kitchen sink as I do all my plants that are going to live upstairs in the house for a while. The Monday we left for a vacation and when I got back on Sunday I saw this:

Some form of rot had set in and most of the growths were dead or dying. I hacked of all the growths that looked to be rotting and hoped for the best. I removed several more this evening and now have a single 2-bulb lead left that "looks" healthy. I am not optimistic.

The seller is no amateur, they are a professional outfit. I assume they know what they are doing.

In the past I have received a Masdevallia that spent more than 2 months in the post and it was in perfect condition. It didn't break out in rot. On the other hand, I have purchased a Paph from a S. Africa nursery (when I still lived in S. Africa) and had it almost instantly melt after removal from the box. When I complained they sent another and it also instantly rotted so I kind of feel like this might be a supply side problem. Why I am hesitant to complain is because the plant did spent a long time in the box and then I wasn't around to notice trouble -- not that I think I could have done much as the plants are rotting from the bulb up to the leaves, not the other way. I expect the infection is already through the entire plant. I have never had this problem with other US vendors.

If you were me, would you complain?

 

[littlefrog]

Hello,

I need your opinions to make up my mind whether to complain or not.

My wife got me an orchid for Father's day. It was shipped on the Tuesday before Fathers Day and opened on Fathers day having spent several days in the box. On opening, the the plant looked perfectly healthy but dry so I drenched it under the tap in the kitchen sink as I do all my plants that are going to live upstairs in the house for a while. The Monday we left for a vacation and when I got back on Sunday I saw this:

Some form of rot had set in and most of the growths were dead or dying. I hacked of all the growths that looked to be rotting and hoped for the best. I removed several more this evening and now have a single 2-bulb lead left that "looks" healthy. I am not optimistic.

The seller is no amateur, they are a professional outfit. I assume they know what they are doing.

In the past I have received a Masdevallia that spent more than 2 months in the post and it was in perfect condition. It didn't break out in rot. On the other hand, I have purchased a Paph from a S. Africa nursery (when I still lived in S. Africa) and had it almost instantly melt after removal from the box. When I complained they sent another and it also instantly rotted so I kind of feel like this might be a supply side problem. Why I am hesitant to complain is because the plant did spent a long time in the box and then I wasn't around to notice trouble -- not that I think I could have done much as the plants are rotting from the bulb up to the leaves, not the other way. I expect the infection is already through the entire plant. I have never had this problem with other US vendors.

If you were me, would you complain?

Looks like it cooked in the box... Shipping company's fault. But if I had sold it to you I'd want to replace it. So let them know. I think most good sellers would want to have the chance to make sure you were satisfied.

If they don't want to make it right then you learn something, too.

 

[big923cattleya]

Having lived in Florida for 9 years, that looks like black rot. It cost me more money then I ever want to think about. It struck young plants and old plants. Smaller plants were very vulnerable. Black rot can kill very quickly, One day the plant looks fine and 36 hours later it is hopelessly doomed. It spreads rapidly through the rhizome and by the time we notice it, it is way too late to save the plant!
On a mature plant the remedy might be to cut way back into healthy tissue and treat with cinnamon. There was a time where I lost 50-60 seedling Cattleyas inside of two weeks. Lots and lots of dollars were lost. If you trim back and cut into the rhizome of a mature Cattleya, the presence of black rot could be detected by a distinct purple color.

How did I cure it? You can not really. Moist conditions is what brings it on and poor air movement. I placed 2 oscillating fans underneath the overhang on the rear of my home in SW Florida and they were on 24/7/365!! And I began a monthly spraying program using thiomyl. AND I never watered late in the day, always watered early in the morning to try and make sure my orchids dried off by nightfall. I would say I lost about 150-175 plants to Black rot, 95% were Cattleyas!! Did I cure it? No way. But I kept it under control somewhat.
You watered, left it sit deep within a cache pot, and it did not dry out and rot got it quicker then 1, 2, 3. So sorry that you had to deal with this! It is always in the air, and it loves very moist and humid conditions. It spreads easily by the splashing of water on infected plants!

 

[Tom-DE]

I agree it is black rot, and it is horrible.

 

[TyroneGenade]

Hello,

Thanks for the info. I will now have to go sterilize everything. Black Rot was my suspicion as well. I expect it all over all the plants from the Florida supplier and the stress in transport just gave it opportunity.

Many different plants have been housed in the ceramic pot for display and all have been under the faucet in the kitchen sink and survived under the conditions this plant has gone to pieces under. I had this issue years ago in South Africa and ended up adding bleach to every watering to keep it under control but it never went away.

The last healthy looking growth I cut yesterday didn't have a black rhizome so I have a teeny-tiny bit of hope. Everybody is getting a H2O2 + drop of dish soap watering for the rest of the week.

Rob, thanks for the encouragement, I will send the supplied a polite complaint.

P.S. If anyone had a healthy division of Slc Taiwan Chief Bell (or something similar) for sale please PM me.

 

[SelectOrchids]

It is a phytophthora rot. Keeping the plants on the dry side slows down the progression, but as soon as they are kept very wet, or packed in a box where the humidity builds up, it will explode. It was for sure at the grower's place, and for certain more if not all the batch is infected.

It is very common as well on Cattleya imported from Taiwan, they are chopped off and quickly stuffed in pots with sphagnum for sale at shows or shipping.

Phytophthora are not fungi, and they can behave like a bacteria, with an extreme speed progression, sometimes overnight. It is mistaken in many hobbyists publications as 'bacterial rot'. On Phalaenopsis and Paphiopedilum it will shows up as soaking wet areas, sometimes with orange, sometimes with blackish color, that can spread within hours.

It has nothing to do with the watering or humidity, both can be used to control the speed at which the pathogen will infect, and it can be curative as well if the plant outgrows it. But if it is there, it is there. It spreads indeed by water splashes, recycling water to rewater the plants ( a practice more and more common unfortunately in many nurseries, to save on the fertilizer cost), and sciara flies.

A drench with mefenoxam, a single one, of a whole collection, stops permanently the problem, except when new plants are introduced.

 

[wongwong]

It is a phytophthora rot. Keeping the plants on the dry side slows down the progression, but as soon as they are kept very wet, or packed in a box where the humidity builds up, it will explode. It was for sure at the grower's place, and for certain more if not all the batch is infected.....

Do the phytophthora rot produce bad smell?

What should be the concentration for active ingredient for the Mefenoxam/metalaxyl?
=====
Other question may or may not be relevant…..
It has been mentioned in “Orchid Growing Substrate” P.9 that paph. tolerate aluminum/can have high tissue Al; Is there any analysis on tissue Silicon which possibly scavenge Al ion?

 

[BrucherT]

Hello,

I need your opinions to make up my mind whether to complain or not.

My wife got me an orchid for Father's day. It was shipped on the Tuesday before Fathers Day and opened on Fathers day having spent several days in the box. On opening, the the plant looked perfectly healthy but dry so I drenched it under the tap in the kitchen sink as I do all my plants that are going to live upstairs in the house for a while. The Monday we left for a vacation and when I got back on Sunday I saw this:

Some form of rot had set in and most of the growths were dead or dying. I hacked of all the growths that looked to be rotting and hoped for the best. I removed several more this evening and now have a single 2-bulb lead left that "looks" healthy. I am not optimistic.

The seller is no amateur, they are a professional outfit. I assume they know what they are doing.

In the past I have received a Masdevallia that spent more than 2 months in the post and it was in perfect condition. It didn't break out in rot. On the other hand, I have purchased a Paph from a S. Africa nursery (when I still lived in S. Africa) and had it almost instantly melt after removal from the box. When I complained they sent another and it also instantly rotted so I kind of feel like this might be a supply side problem. Why I am hesitant to complain is because the plant did spent a long time in the box and then I wasn't around to notice trouble -- not that I think I could have done much as the plants are rotting from the bulb up to the leaves, not the other way. I expect the infection is already through the entire plant. I have never had this problem with other US vendors.

If you were me, would you complain?

Sorry for your loss. That just sucks.

 

[TyroneGenade]

Hello,

Good news, the seller has offered a replacement plant at no cost.

Anyone know of a source for Mefenoxam which doesn't involve buying a whole gallon? I don't have big collection and would rather purchase a small volume of pesticide I am going to use completely than store stuff that then needs to be disposed of later.

 

[PeteM]

Hello,

Good news, the seller has offered a replacement plant at no cost.

Anyone know of a source for Mefenoxam which doesn't involve buying a whole gallon? I don't have big collection and would rather purchase a small volume of pesticide I am going to use completely than store stuff that then needs to be disposed of later.

Following this thread to see what others suggest and to find it again. Just looked it up and Mefenoxam is not cheap. I found this. I’ve purchased from this company before with no issues.