What I hate with Paphs

[Roy]

What is the reason 'Bulldog' is not considered acceptable? I always thought it had some reference to the look of the flower - usually big and bulky - but later learned that it was a reference to Winston Churchill (is that right?). Is this a negative reference?

Kevin, in my 40+ years of orchid growing, the term Bulldog, has only ever been used by growers in the USA. I know of no other country using that term.
The Bulldog was always used as a symbol of England during WW2, and many of the worlds best "Complex Hybrid" Paphs came from there originally. To my knowledge ( urban legend or not ) many plants were shipped to the USA because of the war so that their safety was ensured and returned later. Its possible that the bulldog term was created because of the English connection and thus Winston C.
To me and most growers here the term is defamitory to the plant.

 

[NYEric]

Interesting; it is used here commonly in a colloquial, non-defamitory way.

 

[labskaus]

People use the term cabbages here, and it is not meant well. People who grow the plants don't use the term, obviously.

I'm still curious to see how the flower turns out to be.

 

[SlipperFan]

Kevin, in my 40+ years of orchid growing, the term Bulldog, has only ever been used by growers in the USA. I know of no other country using that term.
The Bulldog was always used as a symbol of England during WW2, and many of the worlds best "Complex Hybrid" Paphs came from there originally. To my knowledge ( urban legend or not ) many plants were shipped to the USA because of the war so that their safety was ensured and returned later. Its possible that the bulldog term was created because of the English connection and thus Winston C.
To me and most growers here the term is defamitory to the plant.

I believe we have someone here who calls himself the "British Bulldog" (Paul from Ratcliffe Orchids).

 

[Roy]

Paul may do and he is carrying on a great tradition in Paph breeding. Ratciffes have been the formost breeders of Paph, particularly Complex Hybrids for decades. Most awarded paphs in Australia are as a result of direct Ratcliffe breeding or from plants flowered from their seedlings. I wish their seedlings were available here.

 

[SlipperFan]

I wish their seedlings were available here.

Me, too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[PaphMadMan]

To me and most growers here the term is defamitory to the plant.

Personally, I think the dog is often the one defamed by calling some of these flowers bulldogs. The truly insulting reference is when an orchid is called a 'novelty'.

OK, I'm just in the mood to throw gasoline on a fire. I admit it. :evil::rollhappy::evil:

 

[Roy]

I have no problems with the dislike of the term, Novelty either. I think who every introduced that name used to work in a toy factory or souveniers.

 

[Kevin]

Kevin, in my 40+ years of orchid growing, the term Bulldog, has only ever been used by growers in the USA. I know of no other country using that term.

You can include Canada. I have always known them to be called Bullodogs.

 

[Kevin]

The Bulldog was always used as a symbol of England during WW2, and many of the worlds best "Complex Hybrid" Paphs came from there originally. To my knowledge ( urban legend or not ) many plants were shipped to the USA because of the war so that their safety was ensured and returned later. Its possible that the bulldog term was created because of the English connection and thus Winston C.
To me and most growers here the term is defamitory to the plant.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't get the 'defamitory' part. 'Complex Hybrid' is confusing, because, aren't all hybrids, further down the line, all 'complex'? What makes one hybrid complex and another one not? I don't really like 'Novelty' either. I guess to each his own. As long as we all know what plants we're talking about.

 

[Ross]

Personally, I think the dog is often the one defamed by calling some of these flowers bulldogs. The truly insulting reference is when an orchid is called a 'novelty'.

OK, I'm just in the mood to throw gasoline on a fire. I admit it. :evil::rollhappy::evil:

I also HATE the term "Novelty hybrid". It seems to imply a certain lack of respect, a passing fad, unimportant. It just hits me the wrong way!

 

[Kavanaru]

I don't mind the term Bulldog either, but Novelty... that's quite confusing sometimes, like newly I read (I think in Koopowitz's book) about a new hybrid: "...the result is an interesting flower, but without the quality to be considered a novelty cross..." (freely paraphrased)... hhhmm... isn't it "being a New Cross" the main thing to be qualified as a "Novelty"?

 

[Roy]

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't get the 'defamitory' part. 'Complex Hybrid' is confusing, because, aren't all hybrids, further down the line, all 'complex'? What makes one hybrid complex and another one not? I don't really like 'Novelty' either. I guess to each his own. As long as we all know what plants we're talking about.

Kevin, long ago when the Paphs seen on the show benches were the "complex type" (bulldog), true maudiae types and the odd species & Brachy, the Complex type were the only much bred Paph. The Maudiae types were well bred but Purely with other Maudiae. There wasn't any sukhakulii or rarely wardii and some P. curtisii/superbiens used in the breeding.
Thus the background of the Complex was complex in genes and parents.
Later breeding by the enormous amount of nurseries that have since gone but also now exist have interbred the various families of Paphs to become even more complex but the original term belongs to Paphs as shown in pic.
I would personally accept " cabbage leaf , sourcer, dinner plate etc for the complex but I cant accept the the reference to a slobbering, scratching dog.

 

[labskaus]

Roy, I get the impression you're more of a cat person.

Cheers,

 

[Roy]

Roy, I get the impression you're more of a cat person.

Cheers,

Far from it Carsten, I have 2 dogs with me as I surf the forum. I just don't see any comparison between a bulldog and a Paph.

 

[NYEric]

Personally, I think the dog is often the one defamed by calling some of these flowers bulldogs. OK, I'm just in the mood to throw gasoline on a fire. I admit it. :evil::rollhappy::evil:

We are legion! :evil:

 

[SlipperFan]

Why not let's call them "round Paphs?"

 

[Kevin]

Whatever we call them, do you have a pic of the one you posted with it fully open?

 

[Roy]

Last pics of this plant. The first 2 show the development of the faulty dorsal/ventral connection and the 3rd photo is the fully open flwer from LAST season without a deformity.

 

[NYEric]

A candidate for the ugliest paph contest! I'm sorry.